Has anyone used the batteries from Greenworks? I was going to set up dewalt 36v's but I found these way cheaper($119 for a 40v 4Ah). Seems like a much better deal than the dewalts but I cant find out whats inside. Higher volts and Ah and cheaper - Is this too good to be true?
Greenworks 40v 4Ah Battery-Whats inside????
- Thread starter casey
- Start date
docnjoj
1 GW
Well DeWalt does not use A123 cells any more. I'm not sure what they do use. At least you won't have to build your own battery but we need more information on what kind of power requirements you need so we can help. Welcome to E-S.
otherDoc
edit: Your general location in the world would also help so shipping costs and availability could also enter the equation as would local laws about e-bikes.
otherDoc
edit: Your general location in the world would also help so shipping costs and availability could also enter the equation as would local laws about e-bikes.
I'm attempting my first build. Just got a 500W MAC motor 7T (w/Infinion 36-72v 4110). I've ordered a CA but might try a simpler build without it first. I have a couple bikes to choose from - not sure if I should build as mountain bike or cruiser. Was hoping to put 2 of the Greenworks 40v 4ah (to get 8ah). Is that enough power to start? I'd like to hot rod some high watt eventually. Is there a better off the shelf battery? Thanks!!!!
dnmun
1 PW
$120 for 160 watt hours, $.75/Wh is not that cheap.
you could buy a 48V15Ah lifepo4 pack from the sunthing28 guy for $300+ which is about $.33/Wh and you get a real battery with BMS and charger too.
you could buy a 48V15Ah lifepo4 pack from the sunthing28 guy for $300+ which is about $.33/Wh and you get a real battery with BMS and charger too.
999zip999
100 TW
One big battery is better and easier with a bms. All in one box. Now that needs to to fit in your frame.
I cant find sunthing28 on ebay- I've found tons of others but not sure who is a good seller. Is ping the best way to go? Any other recommended sellers on ebay? I liked the idea of the power tool batteries so I can vary how much power I take at a time(2,3 or4) and its easy to find used cheap ones but its sounds like everything out there is inferior to a real Lifepo4 pack.
liveforphysics
100 TW
I would recommend getting that battery opened up and taking a look at what cells it uses. Or searching for info on it from someone else who has opened one up if you don't feel comfortable opening it yourself.
You can take something with special screw heads to a place like fastenall that specializes in fasteners and fastener drivers, and they will likely be able to get you the correct bit for them, unless it's something completely proprietary.
You can take something with special screw heads to a place like fastenall that specializes in fasteners and fastener drivers, and they will likely be able to get you the correct bit for them, unless it's something completely proprietary.
SamTexas
1 MW
If the cells are A123 then it's a good deal. But I would be surprised if they are A123. Too good to be true at that price.casey said:
If not, buy A123 26650 cells from this ES member's sale thread
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=36589&start=150#p671663
The price should be comparable or even less. He has a special going on now.
(You owe me one, migueralliart.)
http://www.google.com/search?q=sunthing28+on+ebay&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-UScasey said:
fficial&client=firefox-aI recently bought a Greenworks twin force electric mower from Lowes (so I could justify the cost of the batteries for a Razor e300 scooter project ) The 40V, 4AH G-MAX battery pack is awesome! No current limiting! (at least at the 30A operating current of my controller). I'm not sure if there is a BMS inside. From what I have read, the cells should last >2000 cycles which means they are likely LiFePo4 of some sort. I had a hard time believing they were actually 4AH until I ran the following test...
When I connected the G-Max 40V battery pack to the stock 24V controller/throttle, etc., of the e300, that I bought at a yard sale for $30 each for two, the controller just made a clicking noise when I rotated the on/off throttle but it did not blow the controller. The clicking noise may have been due to an over-voltage sensor in the controller? Anyway, I stole a controller and variable speed throttle from an MX500 (that I had previously found in someone's trash) and temporarily attached them to the e300. Being slightly over 200 lbs, I drove it cumulatively for over half an hour over a few days mainly on fairly level ground and mostly tried to stay at moderate speeds (but probably for more like 40 minutes!) This was just using only one 40V, 4AH G-Max battery pack. I also was easily able to drive the scooter up a small hill that was totally impossible for me to go up previously on the stock scooter. The standard 250W, 24V motor and upgraded 36V controller, etc., did not even get warm running at 40V. The battery pack was drawn down to 33.3V at the end of the runs ~5 minutes after the two battery sensing throttle LEDs went from green to solid yellow and ~10 minutes after they were blinking between green/yellow. The controller has a low voltage cutoff at 31.5V, I believe, which I did not want to test at this point. But the 31.5 LVC should enable ~2.4V per cell on average before shut down... The 36V controller and throttle seem to work great in every way with the 40V battery.
In order to use the batteries without modification, I will need to raise the deck by 1/2 inch which does not look very hard to do. I believe I just need to trace most of the the outside of the deck cover onto a piece 1/2 inch plastic material, cut it out and drill some holes in it. Maybe I could use some quick release latches. I will be able to but at least two 40V, 4AH G-Max batteries on their sides in the battery compartment. I may even be able to get three Greenworks batteries in there. A spade connector works great to connect wires to the batteries (the outer terminals marked + or -). Even thought the spade terminals I used can easily slide into the Greenworks battery connectors, and hold pretty firmly, I should make some sort of adapter to slide the batteries into for easier and more secure connection to the terminals. A couple of the $36 chargers could also be butchered to make connectors out of. The batteries could be used one at a time by installing a switch. Or, in order to prevent sparks when inserting and using the batteries in parallel, I could put a power resistor network in a star configuration (all resistors connected at one end in common only to each other) between the new connectors in the scooter on battery plus sides (with the battery negatives all connected together) for a few seconds to balance the battery packs with each other before connecting the positive sides together. Parallel operation of the battery packs should significantly reduce battery stress and increase life by sharing the current between batteries.
BTW, the Greenworks G-Max twin force lawnmower seems to be pretty comparable to my old gas powered mower even on grass that was not mowed for two weeks that would have choked my gas mower. So, maybe it's a win-win all around, we'll see.
) The 40V, 4AH G-MAX battery pack is awesome! No current limiting! (at least at the 30A operating current of my controller). I'm not sure if there is a BMS inside. From what I have read, the cells should last >2000 cycles which means they are likely LiFePo4 of some sort. I had a hard time believing they were actually 4AH until I ran the following test...When I connected the G-Max 40V battery pack to the stock 24V controller/throttle, etc., of the e300, that I bought at a yard sale for $30 each for two, the controller just made a clicking noise when I rotated the on/off throttle but it did not blow the controller. The clicking noise may have been due to an over-voltage sensor in the controller? Anyway, I stole a controller and variable speed throttle from an MX500 (that I had previously found in someone's trash) and temporarily attached them to the e300. Being slightly over 200 lbs
, I drove it cumulatively for over half an hour over a few days mainly on fairly level ground and mostly tried to stay at moderate speeds (but probably for more like 40 minutes!) This was just using only one 40V, 4AH G-Max battery pack. I also was easily able to drive the scooter up a small hill that was totally impossible for me to go up previously on the stock scooter. The standard 250W, 24V motor and upgraded 36V controller, etc., did not even get warm running at 40V. The battery pack was drawn down to 33.3V at the end of the runs ~5 minutes after the two battery sensing throttle LEDs went from green to solid yellow and ~10 minutes after they were blinking between green/yellow. The controller has a low voltage cutoff at 31.5V, I believe, which I did not want to test at this point. But the 31.5 LVC should enable ~2.4V per cell on average before shut down... The 36V controller and throttle seem to work great in every way with the 40V battery.In order to use the batteries without modification, I will need to raise the deck by 1/2 inch which does not look very hard to do. I believe I just need to trace most of the the outside of the deck cover onto a piece 1/2 inch plastic material, cut it out and drill some holes in it. Maybe I could use some quick release latches. I will be able to but at least two 40V, 4AH G-Max batteries on their sides in the battery compartment. I may even be able to get three Greenworks batteries in there. A spade connector works great to connect wires to the batteries (the outer terminals marked + or -). Even thought the spade terminals I used can easily slide into the Greenworks battery connectors, and hold pretty firmly, I should make some sort of adapter to slide the batteries into for easier and more secure connection to the terminals. A couple of the $36 chargers could also be butchered to make connectors out of. The batteries could be used one at a time by installing a switch. Or, in order to prevent sparks when inserting and using the batteries in parallel, I could put a power resistor network in a star configuration (all resistors connected at one end in common only to each other) between the new connectors in the scooter on battery plus sides (with the battery negatives all connected together) for a few seconds to balance the battery packs with each other before connecting the positive sides together. Parallel operation of the battery packs should significantly reduce battery stress and increase life by sharing the current between batteries.
BTW, the Greenworks G-Max twin force lawnmower seems to be pretty comparable to my old gas powered mower even on grass that was not mowed for two weeks that would have choked my gas mower. So, maybe it's a win-win all around, we'll see.
skeetab5780
1 MW
ok now im interested whos gonna crack one of those things open and post some pictures of the cells? unless anyone can confirm a cell part # or spec sheet
I don't have the 40v 4AH but I do have the 24V 4AH. Most likely they both use the same cells.
No store around there other than Harbor Freight carried tamper-proof T10 bits that's long enough. Anyhow, I took apart the battery and really, it's nothing special. It's your typical 18650 cells. This one was a 6s2p pack made up of ATL INR18650P201(7.5Wh). I couldn't find much information on the cell other than what could possible be inflated specs (5C burst? 1000-2000 cycles?)
Anyhow, I have 4 of these battery packs that I bought brand new with the intention of replacing one of my bike's bottle battery.
No store around there other than Harbor Freight carried tamper-proof T10 bits that's long enough. Anyhow, I took apart the battery and really, it's nothing special. It's your typical 18650 cells. This one was a 6s2p pack made up of ATL INR18650P201(7.5Wh). I couldn't find much information on the cell other than what could possible be inflated specs (5C burst? 1000-2000 cycles?)
Anyhow, I have 4 of these battery packs that I bought brand new with the intention of replacing one of my bike's bottle battery.
skeetab5780
1 MW
Ya I took apart 2 of the 29282 40v 4ah packs last night, they have 20x 18650 atl inr1850p201 7.5wh in a 10s2p config. I couldn't find much on the cells other than 1 link.
Shenzhen Green Energy Technology Co., Ltd
INR18650P201 2000mah 22ohm no UL listing and in development phase
I'm not expecting them to have much more than a 2c rating, although there is a 40amp inline fuse soldered into the positive lead. Must be incase of a dead short. Also the terminal posts do not output 40v, so there must be some sort of a series connection happening once you plug a device into the pack. Could cause some confusion...But that didn't stop me.
Shenzhen Green Energy Technology Co., Ltd
INR18650P201 2000mah 22ohm no UL listing and in development phase
I'm not expecting them to have much more than a 2c rating, although there is a 40amp inline fuse soldered into the positive lead. Must be incase of a dead short. Also the terminal posts do not output 40v, so there must be some sort of a series connection happening once you plug a device into the pack. Could cause some confusion...But that didn't stop me.
hi skeetab - were you able to make use of it?
im guessing you had to bypass the BMS - as you are correct that there is no 40v output at the terminals so the device must trigger something in the BMS to push out this 40 volts - i did not open mine up as i ended up returning it (if it wasnt for that these would of made an easy 8ah 40v pack- easier than 4 bricks of yardworks)
the vendor was very secretive about these modules/ and did not wanto disclose much information
my thread about these-
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=50650
i feel that these arent anything of quality/or cheap - but are ok if you need something low key with a limited warranty(thats if you can d/c the bms)
im guessing you had to bypass the BMS - as you are correct that there is no 40v output at the terminals so the device must trigger something in the BMS to push out this 40 volts - i did not open mine up as i ended up returning it (if it wasnt for that these would of made an easy 8ah 40v pack- easier than 4 bricks of yardworks)
the vendor was very secretive about these modules/ and did not wanto disclose much information
my thread about these-
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=50650
i feel that these arent anything of quality/or cheap - but are ok if you need something low key with a limited warranty(thats if you can d/c the bms)
skeetab5780
1 MW
After dis assembly I charged the 2x 10s packs with a 2a charger and a watt meter. from 36.5v to 4.22v it pushed 4.14ah into the packs. I let the batteries stay connected in parallel over night attached to the watt meter, and in the morning they were at 41.4v (with a watt meter load on them).
I have yet to do a discharge but it is very easy to tear the packs apart and make a battery out of them at 10s or 20s
Im hoping these cells will impress me, but they probably wont
heres a quick video of the opening of the 29282 packs
[youtube]1iixrd1NImc[/youtube]
I have yet to do a discharge but it is very easy to tear the packs apart and make a battery out of them at 10s or 20s
Im hoping these cells will impress me, but they probably wont
heres a quick video of the opening of the 29282 packs
[youtube]1iixrd1NImc[/youtube]
SHARKBITEATTACK
10 W
nice vid!
agniusm
1 MW
Does anyone knows if one can get the black, sticky isolation stuff on eBay or elsewhere as per this battery or ideas what to use instead?
liveforphysics
100 TW
Great video and contribution. These look like the best made and most EV convenient size of all the tools packs ive seen. Glad to see this stuff becoming available.
skeetab5780 said:
spinningmagnets
100 TW
Wow!, INR chemistry? you mention that a lot of stores are closing this product line out, and that may be why these are being liquidated. If that is true, then you won't find these cells at this price for long. I wish there was some way to find out the manufacturer...
skeetab5780
1 MW
Thanks Luke.
Yea, that's probably why I'm having trouble finding more of these...at the right price(under $60 bucks shipped)Do not pay full retail for these babies.
I was planning on getting 8 packs but only have 6 at the moment. And with the lower C rating it may turn into a problem. I already have a 120cell 2c pack that get beaten up as it is. Winter always slows me down so I have yet to build the pack up. Only time will tell if they were worth it.
Yea, that's probably why I'm having trouble finding more of these...at the right price(under $60 bucks shipped)Do not pay full retail for these babies.
I was planning on getting 8 packs but only have 6 at the moment. And with the lower C rating it may turn into a problem. I already have a 120cell 2c pack that get beaten up as it is. Winter always slows me down so I have yet to build the pack up. Only time will tell if they were worth it.
skeetab5780
1 MW
4 months later..hah little update, Almost ready to start building an actual pack from these batteries. I've been using my Dewalt cells as a powerful test pack(20s 6ah) so i have been putting off this pack build even though its not that much work. Sadly when I placed my HK order they were out of wire and heat shrink. So i ended up with some cool colors.
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