Headway Battery rust

[frodus]

I realize that, but it doesn't help his argument at all..... just too many similarities to take is word for it.

That and the fact that my Headway contact has told me, twice, they they build cells for Lifebatt/Lifetech.

Any single one of these and I wouldn't doubt him, but the fact that there is more than one thing that make this sound a little fishy.

 

[rkosiorek]

personaly i don't care who makes the cells, headway , not headway. apparently the cells for LifeBatt/BMI/LifeTech were made to an entrirely different spec than the ones Headway made for themselves. to me that means that they are different cells. period.

i don't have much experience with the headway cells. i just know that the delivery took so long that i ended up reselling mine even before i recieved them. i had them shipped direct to the person who bought them from me. i haven't heard any more about them.

i do know that the Green PSI/Lifebatt cells i got perform very well. i have several that were discharged below 0.7V and after a couple of charge/discharge cycles they recovered to approx 60% of their former capacity. maybe they cost me little more per cell than the duct tape cells or the headways. but i know from experience that i can pull 100A+ from my 10Ah packs for 30 or 40 sec and they barely get warm. my wimpy 8awg wiring on the other hand gets very warm.

i think that i'm gonna skip over the 15Ah cylindrical cells altogether and go straight to the 20Ah prismatics. cylindrical cells waste a lot of space in the gaps between cells. sizewise the best cells look to be the offerings from A123 and LifeBatt. and it seems like it will take an act of god or at least a minor miracle to get the A123s. so i guess i'll be looking at LifeBatt again.

View attachment LiFeBATT P-20 Cells.pdf

specs look good. sizewise they are a lot more compact than cylindrical cells. now i just want to find out what the price is gonna be like for a 48V 20Ah pack.

rick

 

[liveforphysics]

That and the fact that my Headway contact has told me, twice, they they build cells for Lifebatt/Lifetech.

Any single one of these and I wouldn't doubt him, but the fact that there is more than one thing that make this sound a little fishy.

Just in this thread he admitted that headways DID build the 15Ah cells for them initially.

This was something BMI repeatedly lied about over and over since they first mentioned the 15Ah cells, repeatedly saying that headways didn't build the cells.

Now he says they did at first. I respect him for admitting the obvious rather than trying to continue that obvious lie any further, which was just getting silly.

He says headways no longer makes the cells for them. Well, given the past history of honesty, and zero shown evidence that lifetech has the facililties to do anything beyond cell testing and pack assembly, I can't say I've got much faith in this claim.

He says he has a video of cell manufactureing they show clients, but can't show us? Is it because we would recognize that it's simply the headways factory that all seen the pics from? lol

personaly i don't care who makes the cells, headway , not headway. apparently the cells for LifeBatt/BMI/LifeTech were made to an entrirely different spec than the ones Headway made for themselves. to me that means that they are different cells. period.

I couldn't agree more. I don't care where they are made. I wouldn't even care if they just test and cherry-pick the best of the headways cells to sell as LiFeTech, that would still be a better cell than generic headways, and it would be a value to the market for the people who are willing to spend 3 times the price for cells to ensure the get good ones.

The problem isn't with the product, it's with the constant chain of lies we get from BMI. Want to sell a good product at high prices? That's great, it will appeal to many folks, and the more batteries on the market the better. Just don't try to fill us with a constant stream of lies about who makes them, yadda yadda.

I think that i'm gonna skip over the 15Ah cylindrical cells altogether and go straight to the 20Ah prismatics. cylindrical cells waste a lot of space in the gaps between cells. sizewise the best cells look to be the offerings from A123 and LifeBatt. and it seems like it will take an act of god or at least a minor miracle to get the A123s. so i guess i'll be looking at LifeBatt again.
rick

You know all it takes is one simple PM to cell_man on this forum to tell him how many you want, then you make a payment, and they arive on your front step in 1, maybe 2 weeks. No act of God needed, you could have your A123 cells ordered and payed for in the time it takes to get a cup of coffee.

 

[cell_man]

Thanks Luke

However I wouldn't wait too long to long if you really need the 20Ah prismatics as stocks are running a bit low. Still have plenty of the 15Ah though.

 

[BMI]

personaly i don't care who makes the cells, headway , not headway. apparently the cells for LifeBatt/BMI/LifeTech were made to an entrirely different spec than the ones Headway made for themselves. to me that means that they are different cells. period.
i don't have much experience with the headway cells. i just know that the delivery took so long that i ended up reselling mine even before i recieved them. i had them shipped direct to the person who bought them from me. i haven't heard any more about them.

I felt the same way as you did rkosiorek. Very frustrated! The shipping/delivery times by Headway were just not acceptable. With our old packs which used the 40138 cells which we manufactured we could deliver assembled batteries in less than 3 weeks from the time of the customers order.
Once Headway supplied the early XPS series (red) cells we could not supply battery packs to customers for up to 3 months (sometimes longer).
The numerous emails I have asking the factory about the delays receiving my packs only to be told that the battery casings, VMS/BMS etc were all ready but the factory was waiting for cells to arrive.
This would happen on a regular basis due to the very long delays in receiving cells supplied by Headway (not to mention all the rejects we would have to send back to them which were not up to specification or defective in some way).

Considering all of our cells and packs are shipped by air there is no reason for long shipping times. Headway cells are not approved to be shipped by air and must be transported by sea/road only which results in much longer delays (which are in addition to the actual manufacturing delays we experienced).

Our customers would be screaming at us wondering what was taking so long in supplying their battery packs. In the end we just had to cancel the supply contract with Headway.

Thankfully things are back to normal now and delivery times for packs are back on track with most orders filled in 2-3 weeks and it is nice not having customers yelling at me any longer wanting to know where their packs are.
How true is the saying "if you want something done properly you have to do it yourself" rather than rely on an unreliable 3rd party supplier. We learned our lesson!

 

[AndyH]

I felt the same way as you did rkosiorek. Very frustrated! The shipping/delivery times by Headway were just not acceptable. With our old packs which used the 40138 cells which we manufactured...

Oops...which PSI manufactured...

...we could deliver assembled batteries in less than 3 weeks from the time of the customers order.
Once Headway supplied the early XPS series (red) cells we could not supply battery packs to customers for up to 3 months (sometimes longer).
The numerous emails I have asking the factory about the delays receiving my packs only to be told that the battery casings, VMS/BMS etc were all ready but the factory was waiting for cells to arrive.

The factory that made the cells was waiting for the cells to arrive?

This would happen on a regular basis due to the very long delays in receiving cells supplied by Headway (not to mention all the rejects we would have to send back to them which were not up to specification or defective in some way)....<snip>

 

[BMI]

I felt the same way as you did rkosiorek. Very frustrated! The shipping/delivery times by Headway were just not acceptable. With our old packs which used the 40138 cells which we manufactured...

Oops...which PSI manufactured...

...we could deliver assembled batteries in less than 3 weeks from the time of the customers order.
Once Headway supplied the early XPS series (red) cells we could not supply battery packs to customers for up to 3 months (sometimes longer).
The numerous emails I have asking the factory about the delays receiving my packs only to be told that the battery casings, VMS/BMS etc were all ready but the factory was waiting for cells to arrive.

The factory that made the cells was waiting for the cells to arrive?

This would happen on a regular basis due to the very long delays in receiving cells supplied by Headway (not to mention all the rejects we would have to send back to them which were not up to specification or defective in some way)....<snip>

No oops! Your green cells are made by PSI but our grey cells were made by us. No ifs no buts! If you are inclined to get on a plane and fly to Taiwan I will send you to our factory where the grey cells were made and you will find it certainly aint the same address as PSI.
If fact I am willing to put money on it. How much do you want to bet on it Andy?

Headway's factory is in China. They would ship the early (red) cells to us to our factory in Taiwan where we would eagerly await their arrival for testing and to assemble them into battery packs. We would ship back to China all the reject cells after we tested them all to separate the A-grade cells from the ones not up to standard.

 

[rkosiorek]

Thanks Luke

However I wouldn't wait too long to long if you really need the 20Ah prismatics as stocks are running a bit low. Still have plenty of the 15Ah though.

Ah, there's the rub. at this moment i am not ready to purchase. and there is no guarantee that when i will be ready later this year that any more cells will be available unless i am willing to purchase large quantities. the information i had been given is that presently the A123 20Ah prismatics available were ones for sampling/testing and supplies would be limited. also there is no way to ensure that more cells would be available for sampling or testing in the future.

the last time i bought A123's i initially bought 16 cells through their sample program. the only source originally was to buy direct from A123. this included filling in a long questionaire on how the cells were to be used and what market they were going for. when i attempted to buy more i was turned away. A123 deemed that my project was not worthy of getting any more cells. i was told that they had better places to send their few precious remaining sample cells. to get the cells i needed i was forced to buy and disect DeWalt 36V power tool packs.

the A123 company attitude may have changed since then. but from past experience and rejection it would take some convincing before i'd be willing to subject myself to this a second time.

to me the important specs of a cell are how they perform and not who actually made them. so far the cells i got from LifeBatt performed as advertised. i don't really need to know who made them unless my intention is to Surreptitiously circumvent the supplier and buy direct. i don't blame BMI/LifeTech/Lifebatt from protecting their source. it after all is their bread and butter. why should they help you in any way to cut thier own throats? why should or would they not protect their bottom line.

I guess that your argument is that the middleman is a liar, because they won't tell you who or how to go around them and buy from the manufacturer direct? does that sum it up? who really is being dishonest here? sounds more like sour grapes to me. whats the matter? frustrated in your attempts to get the same for less? middle-man won't cooperate and disappear from the picture? what's next in the interogation techniques? Kidnap? Bright lights? Rubber Hoses? The Third Degree?

if you can find the source yourself, all well and good. but to accuse someone of dishonesty for protecting themselves from you? seriously sounds like bully tactics to me. and bullies are never honorable or honest.

Truthfully, if i did find out for myself the source and that i could buy cells direct that are made to the same spec for less, i would likely go direct. but i would not expect any help or confirmation from LifeTech/LifeBatt in this quest. i think that information proprietary and respect their right to protect it.

sort of moot anyways. from what i have read on this thread Headway even if they originally maded the cells either cannot or will not make or sell cells made to the same spec any longer. and since they either can't, aren't or won't be the source, that leaves you with dealing with LifeBatt or LifeTech to supply cells of that quality and pay their price

rick

 

[AndyH]

Sorry Armin. We've been thru all this before. You and Don have posted enough info on this forum so that a member can put together an approximate time-line for cell manufacturing. It's difficult to assemble a picture from either your statements, or Don's, or from the general membership because of all the twists and turns in the information. Even if one pulls info from other forums it's still a very tortuous path.

I very much appreciate your right to protect your own company and supply chain - as Rick clearly outlined (thanks Rick!). But there's been so much dis-information up to this point about everything from manufacturer to company relationships to whether one company or the other will sell single cells, that I'm left in a place of not believing ANYTHING said without proof. Once bitten twice shy and all that. You could show me a building today, but how do I know that's where you built your first-gen grey cells in the past? I might not be smart enough to understand this complex business stuff, but things just don't seem to fit together.

Cell testing- yes - you sent a cell to DocBass as did McStar. Then we bought Doc a new test load and waited for that to be shipped, waited thru race prep and other things that needed to happen. But when cell testing was near, you posted here that it wouldn't be worth it to test the old cell since the really good new stuff was on the streets. Because of that, I was a bit disappointed that you would point a finger at Doc in this thread because he hadn't yet evaluated BMI cells. Even Thunder Sky sent cells to an independent lab in the US to get a proper evaluation of their products. Maybe you could bring that up with your new parent company?

 

[rkosiorek]

i would like to see a test of the old PSI/LifeBatt 10Ah "GREEN" cells, the newer "gray" cells and the headway screw top cells.

Doctor Bass if you are out there did you ever do any tests n these cells? if you did please point me to the thread where you posted the results. i could not find one using a general search.

rick

 

[AndyH]

i would like to see a test of the old PSI/LifeBatt 10Ah "GREEN" cells, the newer "gray" cells and the headway screw top cells.

Doctor Bass if you are out there did you ever do any tests n these cells? if you did please point me to the thread where you posted the results. i could not find one using a general search.

rick

Bob tested some of the Gen1 LifeBatt cells - numbers are in the eval thread. Bob Mcree and Gary worked with early LiFeBatt cells as well and should be able to vouch for performance. Sandia Labs ran tests on cells supplied by LiFeBatt - I can confirm those cells were manufactured by PSI under contract. Doc has two grey cells. I don't know anyone with the new headway screw top cells.

Andy

 

[rkosiorek]

geez Andy, i know how well the 10Ah green PSI manufactured cells work. the only two i have that work less than expected are two that i damaged and replaced with cells i bought from you. i do not need any convincing about these cells. they perform to spec.

what i would like to see is a side by side comparison of these cells against their bigger 14Ah brothers and the headway cells. i was hoping that someone with a bit of equipment would be able to independantly test them, publish the results and end all of these silly he said, she said, a friend of my cousin twice removed who is from an alternate universe told me so i know it's true type crap. how well do these 3 different cells perform when tested side by side using the same equipment.

just a simple answer to a simple question.

rick

 

[rkosiorek]

boy for a thread labled "Headway Battery rust" most of the posts seem to be about LifeBatt/LifeTech instead.

rick

 

[BMI]

Thanks Luke

However I wouldn't wait too long to long if you really need the 20Ah prismatics as stocks are running a bit low. Still have plenty of the 15Ah though.

Ah, there's the rub. at this moment i am not ready to purchase. and there is no guarantee that when i will be ready later this year that any more cells will be available unless i am willing to purchase large quantities. the information i had been given is that presently the A123 20Ah prismatics available were ones for sampling/testing and supplies would be limited. also there is no way to ensure that more cells would be available for sampling or testing in the future.

the last time i bought A123's i initially bought 16 cells through their sample program. the only source originally was to buy direct from A123. this included filling in a long questionaire on how the cells were to be used and what market they were going for. when i attempted to buy more i was turned away. A123 deemed that my project was not worthy of getting any more cells. i was told that they had better places to send their few precious remaining sample cells. to get the cells i needed i was forced to buy and disect DeWalt 36V power tool packs.

the A123 company attitude may have changed since then. but from past experience and rejection it would take some convincing before i'd be willing to subject myself to this a second time.

to me the important specs of a cell are how they perform and not who actually made them. so far the cells i got from LifeBatt performed as advertised. i don't really need to know who made them unless my intention is to Surreptitiously circumvent the supplier and buy direct. i don't blame BMI/LifeTech/Lifebatt from protecting their source. it after all is their bread and butter. why should they help you in any way to cut thier own throats? why should or would they not protect their bottom line.

I guess that your argument is that the middleman is a liar, because they won't tell you who or how to go around them and buy from the manufacturer direct? does that sum it up? who really is being dishonest here? sounds more like sour grapes to me. whats the matter? frustrated in your attempts to get the same for less? middle-man won't cooperate and disappear from the picture? what's next in the interogation techniques? Kidnap? Bright lights? Rubber Hoses? The Third Degree?

if you can find the source yourself, all well and good. but to accuse someone of dishonesty for protecting themselves from you? seriously sounds like bully tactics to me. and bullies are never honorable or honest.

Truthfully, if i did find out for myself the source and that i could buy cells direct that are made to the same spec for less, i would likely go direct. but i would not expect any help or confirmation from LifeTech/LifeBatt in this quest. i think that information proprietary and respect their right to protect it.

sort of moot anyways. from what i have read on this thread Headway even if they originally maded the cells either cannot or will not make or sell cells made to the same spec any longer. and since they either can't, aren't or won't be the source, that leaves you with dealing with LifeBatt or LifeTech to supply cells of that quality and pay their price

rick

Rick, I find your open and honest comments to be quite refreshing. You have probably said (in writing here) what many forum readers think to themselves (but are not willing to write).

I can see both sides of the story and can understand the uncertainty in continued supply of A123 product. I find they are a very arrogant company and from what others tell me they often won't even receive the basic courtesy of a reply to an email. I always send a courtesy reply even if I am not able to help or I have a backlog and it takes me a few days to get back to reply to the customer.

Contrary to what many my think, I do not have a problem with cell_man. I have formed the opinion he is a nice decent guy (even though he is a competetor). In fact I quite like him and know that as a person he is a decent guy. The problem is not so much with cell_man but "the company" (A123 Systems) since they force people to have to take back door approaches to supply their product. Cell_man has found a source for the cells and is making the most of it. It is A123 which could make things easier and have an authorized cell supplier so there is no longer any uncertainty in supplying cells in the future and making the supply source clear so there can be no criticism as to whether the cells are real or fake (there should be no need to rub manufacturers details and serial numbers off cells since that just raises suspicions as to why this needs to be done).
Of course A123 have their own reasons for their attitude and that is up to them.

As far as LiFeTech are concerned I am their direct representative and supply our products throughout the western world (North America, Australia/New Zealand and Europe) while the factory service Asia directly. Not only am I involved with LiFeTech in a sales capacity but as an electrical engineer myself I am very heavily involved in the engineering aspects of the company with the development of new products. Much of my time at the moment is involved with the design and development of our new hospital / medical application battery packs. These are being designed for a particular hospital client and must be approved for travel by air since they will be used to provide power for patient's medical equipment when they are transported by either passenger aircraft or rescue helicopter to hospital. I am working closely (on a daily basis) with Raymond King (who many here may know from his time at PSI before he left to join us). The medical application packs will have an accurate LED "fuel gauge" built into each pack and I have selected the charging/discharging connectors which will be fitted to these packs so there is no need to use the main battery terminals for low discharge rate applications. I have decided on a very high quality (reliable) Swiss made Lemo connector which will be used on these packs. The packs will have BMS with all the necessary battery protections built in.

We have several other projects and products either ready now or in the design stages. This week I am receiving the first of our new "Car Save" battery packs. This is the world's lightest lithium car jump start booster packs with built in FM radio, LED torch, LED flashing warning lights and USB 5V socket power supply. I am receiving the first two test units to show major auto parts customers and to advise the factory of any changes which need to be made to the product. I was responsible for correcting all of the "Chenglish" in the original instruction manual and re writing it so it looks professional for all of the western customers who will be buying this product.

We have many other EV projects in the works with some of the major automakers in the USA and I will have some info on our new total battery management system which will be used in these EV's which incorporate our BMS, BCU and CAN.
I will also come back with some info on our new 20Ah cell which is under test now.
Enough for this post.... more soon. I am pretty busy with tons on my plate with so many things happening at once.

 

[BMI]

boy for a thread labled "Headway Battery rust" most of the posts seem to be about LifeBatt/LifeTech instead.
rick

Yeah, it has turned out that way. Perhaps this should all be moved to a new thread?

 

[Lock]

boy for a thread labled "Headway Battery rust" most of the posts seem to be about LifeBatt/LifeTech instead.

hehe... I think the question of "headway rust" has already been put to bed as galvanic corrosion between diff. metals but I also think it's really cool to have folks like Armin/BMI aboard ES, willing to jump into this Wild West of fast-paced EV battery tech... Ya can read between lines all you wish but at least there are lines to read between versus the smoke and mirrors of China commercial attitudes that have jaundiced many "western" opinions... Really important not to drive any China-based suppliers/mfgrs away from supplying ES "hobby" interest... They can't get better R&D and promo for their product if they want honest profits from quality goods.
Cheers
Lock

 

[dnmun]

the original post that started this thread was never settled. that guy dropped off his own thread just like he did the last time he appeared on the headway thread when we started the group buy last year. we asked him to join and he never even replied and went off and bot the cells by himself so they have no relationship to the headway cells we all got in the group buy.

for all we know he poured acid all over them and them came up with this rusted cells stuff, which nobody else has had a problem with.

but the guy was able to put up this false impression that the headway cells are subject to rust by putting such a bogus title on the thread for the google bot to record.

 

[AndyH]

Some of the rust pictures look extreme, but I found rust on the Headway end plates straight from the factory. This cell was shipped by air from Headway to the US west coast, then surface shipped to S Texas.
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=8109

View attachment cap_rust.jpg

 

[Lock]

Ouch Andy. Shipped as separate cells or wired together as pack? Did Headway comment?
tks
Lock

 

[AndyH]

geez Andy, i know how well the 10Ah green PSI manufactured cells work. the only two i have that work less than expected are two that i damaged and replaced with cells i bought from you. i do not need any convincing about these cells. they perform to spec.

what i would like to see is a side by side comparison of these cells against their bigger 14Ah brothers and the headway cells. i was hoping that someone with a bit of equipment would be able to independantly test them, publish the results and end all of these silly he said, she said, a friend of my cousin twice removed who is from an alternate universe told me so i know it's true type crap. how well do these 3 different cells perform when tested side by side using the same equipment.

just a simple answer to a simple question.

rick

And I promise you - that's what you got!

The test paper is of 10Ah LifeBatt cells. The comparison thread has Lifebatt cell data because Gary and Bob were early reps for LifeBatt and sold some ebike packs.

I've been trying to get a couple of the new cells to test and cannot get any. EV Components can't get them, I've gone to a couple of sources in the UK and have only found TWO cells 'in the wild' and since the owner hadn't tested them yet they wouldn't send them to me.

More info on the 16Ah cells here: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=14485&start=30#p219537 "Hi guys, I had a couple of 16AH cells for testing some time back, but they were both faulty on arrival." [edit] Check the thread - there's a discharge chart for the 16Ah Headway cell there. [/edit]

10Ah Headway discharge curves: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7655&start=0 and here: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=8926&start=0

['nother edit] Found a green LifeBatt VS grey BMI chart: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=6586&start=90#p164185 [/edit]

Andy

 

[AndyH]

Ouch Andy. Shipped as separate cells or wired together as pack? Did Headway comment?
tks
Lock

These were separate cells. I bought them in Dec '08 from a forum member that had them air shipped to the 'States. Here's a reference to the timeframe, but the original for-sale thread has fallen off the foru. http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7655

 

[AndyH]

I felt the same way as you did rkosiorek. Very frustrated! The shipping/delivery times by Headway were just not acceptable. With our old packs which used the 40138 cells which we manufactured...

Oops...which PSI manufactured...

...we could deliver assembled batteries in less than 3 weeks from the time of the customers order.
Once Headway supplied the early XPS series (red) cells we could not supply battery packs to customers for up to 3 months (sometimes longer).
The numerous emails I have asking the factory about the delays receiving my packs only to be told that the battery casings, VMS/BMS etc were all ready but the factory was waiting for cells to arrive.

The factory that made the cells was waiting for the cells to arrive?

This would happen on a regular basis due to the very long delays in receiving cells supplied by Headway (not to mention all the rejects we would have to send back to them which were not up to specification or defective in some way)....<snip>

No oops! Your green cells are made by PSI but our grey cells were made by us. No ifs no buts! If you are inclined to get on a plane and fly to Taiwan I will send you to our factory where the grey cells were made and you will find it certainly aint the same address as PSI.
If fact I am willing to put money on it. How much do you want to bet on it Andy?

Headway's factory is in China. They would ship the early (red) cells to us to our factory in Taiwan where we would eagerly await their arrival for testing and to assemble them into battery packs. We would ship back to China all the reject cells after we tested them all to separate the A-grade cells from the ones not up to standard.

Grey BMI cells were mentioned on this forum as 30 Oct 2008. http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7231#p109118 Miro13car bought a LiFeBatt HPS pack sometime before Sep '08 and it has grey LifeBatt cells.

At that time, Mr. Raymond King was still working for PSI (until 4th Nov?). We know about connections between BMI, LIFeBatt, and PSI during that timeframe from posts by Gary Goodrum and Don Harmon: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7231&p=110161#p110154. I know from PSI that they supplied cells for BMI/LiFeBatt thru Oct '08. Raymond was my account rep at PSI until his departure.

It's possible that you had a new cell production facility up and running around or prior to Nov '08, but it also appears that at least some of the grey cells were manufactured by PSI. It also appears that the non-standard 40138 size with stud terminals is a PSI design, I suspect (but cannot confirm) that the studded 40138 cells were manufactured by PSI. I suspect (but cannot confirm) that it would be somewhat expensive to build a cell factory for 40138 studded cells, then switch all the equipment for completely different can sizes and terminal designs.

[edit] You posted photos of new grey BMI cells with at least one serial number 4BF1M131-0585. I received green PSI cells last December with 4BF1M...-.... serial numbers. I can't find the thread where I questioned you on the choice of serial number sequence but I posted a photo of a cell in my stock. Here's a photo from one of Ypedal's shipments from PSI - serial's including 4BF1M506...[/edit]

Andy

 

[rkosiorek]

the info that i have on the new LifeBatt 20Ah prismatics is that each cell has it's own individual in a rectangular metal can and has studs for the connections.

here is a sketch of what the cells are going to look like:

View attachment 20Ah Prismatic Cell.jpg

this PDF has a dimensional comparison of the A123 and Lifebatt 20Ah cells.

now if someone could just get their hands on a couple to test. problem is to get one as the sheet specifically says they'll only supply full packs.

rick

 

[Battboy]

Rick, one important distinction needs to be made here. There is no connection between LiFeBATT and LifeTech. The two companies are NOT connected anymore.

The 20Ah Prismatic Cell you posted up is indeed LiFeBATT's new product but it doesn't have any connection to LifeTech whatsoever. LiFeBATT manufactures in Taiwan for it's Cells and builds their Plug & Play Packs now in Danville, VA. All shipping, warranty service, and support is U.S. based.

LifeTech manufactures in China and builds their Packs in Taiwan. All shipping, warranty service, and support is Asia based.

LiFeBATT has previously been buying from LifeTech but when they opted to take the mfg. offshore to Headway in China, LiFeBATT developed new mfg. partners for the 20Ah Prismatic Cells keeping it in Taiwan. You can draw your own conclusions from this. In keeping with the title of this post " Headway Battery rust", I can confirm I have never seen this particular problem with Headway's cylindrical cells they made for LifeTech.

 

[AndyH]

Rick, one important distinction needs to be made here. There is no connection between LiFeBATT and LifeTech. The two companies are NOT connected anymore.

Don - what's LiFeBATT's connection with the Panjit Group now?