Helmets Part 1,489,348 - To Wear Or Not To Wear

[John in CR]

There's exactly a zero percent chance that I'm going to be on a road tailgating a moving car with another one tailgating me at anything more than walking speeds. I use moving cars as protective shields all the time, like a lead blocker, but not in positions where I can smack into them or they get me, and certainly not where I can be the meat on a car sandwich. That's about like those guys that stick their heads in open crocodile or alligator mouths for shows...a helmet might make it safer by a substantial margin, but I'm still not doing it.

I match traffic speeds, so I inherently interact with fewer cars, making me significantly safer. I ride in a manner where it pretty much is going to require a car intentionally hitting me, the ground opening up in front due to an earthquake, or a piece of a plane falling from the sky. I accept those odds. The thing I'm most at risk for are things kicked up by, or falling or thrown from an oncoming vehicle, but I'm simply not going to wear full face protection, and no one is really pushing that anyway.

I'm also at risk for an equipment failure on my bike, so I pay attention to it. Most recently a crack developed in the connection of my head tube. Had I been wearing a helmet all the time, the slight squeak it caused probably would have gone unnoticed in the wind noise, and I quite possibly would be dead by now. I mean seriously injured, since you can't get killed with a helmet on. Instead I eased it home, identified the cause to be as suspected, and welded it up nice and strong before the next ride.

 

[Canis Lupus]

Like one's head strapped tightly under a helmet on a hot summer's day, the discussion is heating up.

 

[John in CR]

The helmet preachers have some real nerve talking with an air of superiority.

...and you seemingly assume everyone that preaches helmet use is a less skilled or less safe rider than you? Talk about an air of superiority.

Really? When, other than calling people on obviously stupid shit they say they do? Otherwise I don't make any comparative claims, other than the generally implied one that if you feel a helmet makes you significantly safer, then it probably does. For most of my riding it creates an impairment of at least one of my senses, and therefore would make me less safe. There are other times that wearing a helmet does make me safer, and guess what, I wear one then.

 

[John in CR]

Like one's head strapped tightly under a helmet on a hot summer's day, the discussion is heating up.

You bring up a good point Canis. Being all hot and sweaty under a helmet can at times distract from your riding focus, when it's reaching down for your water bottle, or just thinking about the heat. What about it causing sweat, maybe with a bit of sunscreen, dripping into your eye or on your glasses. I'd think it also adversely impacts brain function, though that's only a guess.

 

[Canis Lupus]

I'm still impressed by the English study which showed motorists giving cyclists more space who didn't wear helmets than those that did. Is that an extension of this idea of intelligence and caution providing more safety than a helmet, but from another perspective, or is it because motorists see cyclists more of a human being like themselves, and in doing so, give you more respect and consideration?

Either way, or any way, it seems wearing a helmet is a bit like the deer with a target as a birthmark come hunting season.

 

[Canis Lupus]

Like one's head strapped tightly under a helmet on a hot summer's day, the discussion is heating up.

You bring up a good point Canis. Being all hot and sweaty under a helmet can at times distract from your riding focus, when it's reaching down for your water bottle, or just thinking about the heat. What about it causing sweat, maybe with a bit of sunscreen, dripping into your eye or on your glasses. I'd think it also adversely impacts brain function, though that's only a guess.

There are three reasons why I wear something on my head when cycling: shade, particularly in summer; warmth, particularly in winter; and at night to make it more comfortable to wear a light on my head where it is most effective. For none of these do I need a helmet. All are for safety and comfort, serving their role constantly and predictably, unlike a helmet which may never have to serve its purpose, particularly if I use the best safety feature I have, my state of the art onboard multi-purposed, energy efficient, computer - more commonly known as a brain.

There is a fourth reason relating to a helmet, or at least something which looks like one, to avoid being pulled over by cops, but that is a different type of safety. The law designed to protect is the threat, not anything real.

I should add that I am approaching this discussion as a recumbent cyclist, who, at best, will use a power assist which maxs out at 32km (the BionX system); were I riding a combustion engine bike, or even a high powered electric bike, I would opt for a helmet, preferably full faced. So, it gets back to John's point about choosing intelligently, IMO.

 

[philf]

This discussion always turns ugly. I won't pick sides, but my own sense of spatial awareness is definitely affected by what I wear. I even take my shoes off when I get to the office. So I completely "get" what John is saying.

In some respects, I liken the helmet discussion to what happens when auditors come 'round annually to our installation (I'm a corporate I.T. guy, professionally). They get hung up on the equivalent of spec'ing out what kind of door lock you should put on your front door (the steel one that they made you buy last year) while completely ignoring the fact that there's an unglazed window right next to it.

Whenever I see a cyclist, I always make note of a couple of things. First thing I look for is electrics. Secondly I make note of whether they're wearing a helmet. And thirdly, and most interestingly (to me) I note whether they have a mirror. Either on their handlebars, or clipped to their helmet/glasses. With respect to how often I observe the presence of the latter, the statistic is an overwhelming RARELY. *THIS* I do not understand. A rear view mirror is, in my opinion and by far, the single most important piece of "safety" gear you can put on a bike. Particularly when riding an e-bike (which easily keeps you moving at speeds that significantly dull your hearing with wind noise), you're REALLY blind to traffic sneaking up behind you. I like to be absolutely aware of what's around me at all times, and I feel way more exposed without a mirror than I feel at risk of cracking my skull on the pavement.

I should take this to another thread, but I'm really curious to know how many of the folks here ride without a mirror.

 

[John in CR]

Philf,

I'm guilty of no mirrors, but I ride fast enough and look often enough that in over a year there hasn't been a car or motorcycle within 50m that I didn't know was there. Maybe I'm just lucky with the shape of my ears, because I'm perfectly fine up to 40mph with gradual increase in noise where at 50 and above it's significant. At 50 with only a baseball cap turned backwards (my helmet as far as the law goes) is significantly quieter than at 25-30 with the helmet I have.

Maybe my helmet is the problem, but I know with certainty my attentiveness is heightened with no helmet compared to with a helmet, so I'm not convinced I would be safer overall even with a perfect helmet in terms of sound, at least on my typical routes. I have no doubt that the difference is greater than noted in the study noting the subconscious effect on drivers seeing a helmet or no helmet.

 

[bobmcree]

Philf,

I'm guilty of no mirrors, but I ride fast enough and look often enough that in over a year there hasn't been a car or motorcycle within 50m that I didn't know was there. Maybe I'm just lucky with the shape of my ears, because I'm perfectly fine up to 40mph with gradual increase in noise where at 50 and above it's significant. At 50 with only a baseball cap turned backwards (my helmet as far as the law goes) is significantly quieter than at 25-30 with the helmet I have.

Maybe my helmet is the problem, but I know with certainty my attentiveness is heightened with no helmet compared to with a helmet, so I'm not convinced I would be safer overall even with a perfect helmet in terms of sound, at least on my typical routes. I have no doubt that the difference is greater than noted in the study noting the subconscious effect on drivers seeing a helmet or no helmet.

did you consider the possibility that a dog you did not even see was chasing you and was about to strike at your back wheel and knock your bike out from under you? you might be traveling at 40 mph but the dog might see you coming and thus transit the short side of the triangle from seeing you to striking at the funny sounding thing coming down the road.....i didn't either, on one of the rare occasions i was not wearing my helmet. i lost my sense of smell forever, and i can no longer balance on one foot. i consider this a small price to pay for being such an idiot as not to wear a helmet every time i ride.

 

[graemebc]

Each year in the USA 65,000 bicyclists are seen in emergency rooms and 7,700 bicyclists are admitted to a hospital on account of head injuries from bike crashes. Each year in the USA approximately 900 bicyclists are killed in bike crashes, and of these 70-80% died of head injuries.

Yep no reason to wear a helmet at all, your all right its such a nuisance...

 

[John in CR]

Bob,

Thanks for the post with some discussable details, except for the idiot part, which to me is invalid. BTW I am truly sorry for your injuries.

No, I don't give any consideration to a dog I can't see, and I ride too fast with too much mass and momentum for a similar incident to occur. I don't know of any dogs knocking people off of motorcycles, which I am far more similar to than a bike. I don't, however, discount the possibility of freak accidents occurring, and sufficient concern about freak accidents can and does keep people inside the inherent protection of cars.

What I'd like to discuss is how to handle dogs. Maybe there's something there we can learn from. I steer toward those I see preparing for the chase, which in my cases has taken them out of offensive attach mode and put them on the defense. I don't have any statistical support for that approach, but I've seen that it's effective going back to my pedal bike days as a kid. If anyone has input, please post it.

 

[John in CR]

Each year in the USA 65,000 bicyclists are seen in emergency rooms and 7,700 bicyclists are admitted to a hospital on account of head injuries from bike crashes. Each year in the USA approximately 900 bicyclists are killed in bike crashes, and of these 70-80% died of head injuries.

Yep no reason to wear a helmet at all, your all right its such a nuisance...

Inadequate details, however, I can say with confidence that the injury numbers could greatly be reduced through changes in the activities resulting in accident that are in no way related to helmets. That's where the focus should be. Your info is even missing the helmet/no helmet numbers for the 600-700 head injury deaths. Also, missing are the overall percentages of helmets/no helmets of total riders, and cyclists seen in emergency rooms.

Wasn't it just last year one of the big cyclist advocates was killed when someone opened a car door on them. He probably pushed helmets too, yet allowed himself to be close enough to a parked car to get clipped by a door.

How about some statistics regarding accidents and those with active earbuds on? I've no doubt that is a far riskier activity than not wearing a helmet. What about the just the numbers of people trying stupid stuff they saw on YouTube?

Push all of the other safety issues first, not just helmets.

 

[graemebc]

As soon as anyone points out the risk of not riding with a helmet, some one always try's to muddy the water with other things.
So here we go with some other dumb things to do, not related to helmets.

Drive using a cell phone. Ride a bike with a 6 foot metal pole stuck on the back in an electrical storm. Ride bikes in thongs at 50kmh. In motorcycle terminology that makes you a "stupid squid". All these things, like ear-bud's, are irrelevant to a discussion about whether you should or should not wear a helmet... So do whatever you want, stick raw steak on your legs and cycle through the Lion section of a wildlife park. Just don't try to justify those (or not wearing a helmet) as safe, reasonable or responsible.

The figures I posted can be found on more than one or two sites.
Some reading.

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/810986.PDF
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/320/21/1361?

Lets see some studies from anyone of how many lives where saved by NOT wearing a helmet...

 

[Canis Lupus]

What I'd like to discuss is how to handle dogs. Maybe there's something there we can learn from. I steer toward those I see preparing for the chase, which in my cases has taken them out of offensive attach mode and put them on the defense. I don't have any statistical support for that approach, but I've seen that it's effective going back to my pedal bike days as a kid. If anyone has input, please post it.

Funny this should be brought up. The trike freaks dogs out, they don't know what it is exactly. I've had a problem with a couple of roaming mutts on my night rides. They tend to be more aggressive at night.

Because I generally like dogs and I'm in no particularly hurry to go anywhere just at the moment, with most I stop to make friends. This usually works. They get to know you and not see you as a threat next time. But two of late won't befriend and keep following me closely on a slow uphill climb barking and growling aggressively. It's more annoying than dangerous because they won't bite, I'm pretty sure. I usually turn the trike around and start chasing them, growling aggressively myself, however, I managed to tip the trike over during one of these sharp turn arounds.

Now, I arm myself with small rocks and a stick as I approach their areas. The rocks work a treat and I enjoy the challenge of throwing on the move. It adds a military dimension to my training rides, making it a little more interesting.

But being harassed by dogs on a trike is different to an upright where balance needs to be maintained. I can't remember ever having as many dogs bark at me when I was riding an upright though. Dogs are more used to uprights and going uphills, uprights are faster than a trike.


Just to digress a little, 27 years ago when I used to work for the railways in Sydney, I'd ride my bike to work each day. At a certain point I'd get attacked by a magpie, who would swoop down on me, after my hair for its nest. In that situation a helmet would have been handy. A beanie or cap probably would have also. I wouldn't have looked like such an attraction in the first place and the magpie probably wouldn't have bothered me. At that time, no-one wore helmets, it wasn't law. My solution was to use speed. Once I approached its territory, I sprinted. If I cruised by at anything like an average speed I was vulnerable, but at a faster rate the magpie never bothered me. I've found the same applies to dogs also. It is only during uphill climbs they are a real problem.

 

[liveforphysics]

Pepper spray.

Great on chicken wings, great on agressive/attacking dogs. It's cheap, 1 bottle will last a long time, and you can buy it in a form that shoots about 20ft. Even forgetful dogs tend to remember pepper spray, and you aren't doing any sort of physical damage to them, only stimulating nerves.

I was talking to my on-foot mailman about what he does with dogs that attack. He said just 1-time with a tiny shot of pepper spray in the face, and that dog will generally run and hide for years afterwards when he has a package to deliver rather than biteing at him. He keeps a little sprayer in his mail-vest pocket.

*edit*

I just found the mail service actually has an official issued type of EPA approved dog pepper spray. lol

http://www.milestonesafety.com/muzcanrep.html

 

[liveforphysics]

Just make sure to get it in their face directly. That might not be so easy to do when moving on a bike. On your skin, it just feels like a mild tingle. I spray it on ribs and chicken wing and pizza etc, and it really has no effect unless you're breathing it in, or you get it directly in your eyes, nose, mouth.

 

[Canis Lupus]

Just make sure to get it in their face directly. That might not be so easy to do when moving on a bike. On your skin, it just feels like a mild tingle. I spray it on ribs and chicken wing and pizza etc, and it really has no effect unless you're breathing it in, or you get it directly in your eyes, nose, mouth.

I did think about a water pistol, which would have been fun. I even thought about urinating in it instead of using water. I'm sure no self-respecting mutt wants to get sprayed with human piss.

 

[liveforphysics]

Just make sure to get it in their face directly. That might not be so easy to do when moving on a bike. On your skin, it just feels like a mild tingle. I spray it on ribs and chicken wing and pizza etc, and it really has no effect unless you're breathing it in, or you get it directly in your eyes, nose, mouth.

I did think about a water pistol, which would have been fun. I even thought about urinating in it instead of using water. I'm sure no self-respecting mutt wants to get sprayed with human piss.

LOL! Piss filled squirt guns brings back memories of swimming/waterpolo team hazeing traditions...

I don't think it would bother them too much. If you're riding down a public street, and the dog is threatening your personal safety, feel free to give it a shot of pepper spray in the face. You might save the dogs life in the long-run vs what happens to it if it threatens a small child with a parent watching, or threatens someone who carries a pistol rather than pepper spray etc.

 

[Canis Lupus]

Pepper spray.

run and hide for years afterwards when he has a package to deliver rather than biteing at him. He keeps a little sprayer in his mail-vest pocket.

*edit*

I just found the mail service actually has an official issued type of EPA approved dog pepper spray. lol

http://www.milestonesafety.com/muzcanrep.html

You can get a bear spray too - extra heavy duty obviously. I reckon that could double up for the odd road rage motorist who needs a spray.

Bear Pepper Spray from Guard Alaska
Guard Alaska ultra hot pepper spray has proven so effective repelling bears, it is the only one registered with the EPA as a repellent for ALL SPECIES of bear!

Absolutely the most effective and powerful bear defense spray available today!

* 9 Ounce Supersize with Shotgun fogger delivery.
* Range of spray: Approximately 15-20 feet.
* Dimensions: Height: 8-3/4" x Width: 2"
* An invincible 20% capsaisin and oleocapsaisin resin formulation, ultra hot pepper spray.
* Environmentally safe! Does not contain flammable or ozone depleting substances.
* Our formula is scientifically proven superior, and endorsed by the Alaska Science & Technology Foundation.
* Six years of extensive testing in the wilds of Alaska.

http://www.milestonesafety.com/bearspray.html

 

[liveforphysics]

Here is a little testimonial from a bear-spray site about the bike/dog pepper spray application working. I kinda confirms the same thing the mailman told me about dogs remembering the pepper spray on a long-term/permanate basis. Maybe you can teach old dogs new tricks if the teaching aid is pepper spray.

"The only protection I had against dogs was a loud voice and spraying them with my water bottles. Usually this only kept them at bay and they would always be there waiting for me on my return trip or my next ride. This was very frustrating.



I was talking once with some fellow triathletes and we were having an entire conversation about how much we hate dogs because of the problems they cause us on the bike. This was a very bonding conversation. One of the guys said he uses UDAP Bear Spray to protect himself and the dogs do not bother him anymore. I ordered my first bottle the next day!



My next ride, I tucked the UDAP Bear Spray in one of my bottle holders on my bike and went out for my ride hoping for some payback. Of course, I did not have any problems with any dogs. After about two weeks, I was riding and I started being chased by three dogs. I saw them charging at me and I got out my UDAP Bear Spray. When the dogs were close, I fired the spray at the dogs and missed. I was amazed at how streamline and how far the spray went. It startled me as much as it startled the dogs. The dogs stopped in their tracks and did not bother me even though I missed. They stood there confused. Since then, I have used the spray many, many times. I have sprayed many dogs and put them down from far enough away that I was never in any danger.



Once a dog gets even the smallest taste of UDAP Bear Spray, he never bothers me again. I repeat, he never bothers me again! He will sit there from a distance and watch me ride by. I just smile J



Thank you UDAP! I am now able to enjoy all of my bike rides. "

 

[John in CR]

Using pepper spray while on a bike sure sounds like a good reason to wear a helmet, because I can think of all kinds of ways that increases your chance of a crash...get it in my own eyes at 30-40mph, it requires one-handed riding which eliminates the ability to brake during that time, one-handed riding at a time of increased potential of striking something or needing to make evasive or quick maneuvers.

 

[John in CR]

graemebc,

The point is there are quite a few safety issues that are far more important in keeping you safe than wearing a helmet, yet helmets are what gets discussed:

If you engage in activities on your bike that greatly increase the possibility of a crash, then of course you need to wear a helmet. It is also possible to greatly reduce your chances of crashing. If you reduce your odds of crashing to a low enough level, then wearing a helmet can in fact increase your chances of getting killed because they increase your chances of crashing:
1. The study quoted before showed that car drivers are more careful around riders with no helmet and allow them more space.
2. Helmets typically create more wind noise, reducing your ability to hear, and hearing well increases your safety.
3. Helmets that offer the most protection also restrict your field of vision, which increases you chances of crashing.
4. Being exposed more increases your focus, and increased focus and heightened alertness to your surroundings decreases your odds of crashing.

If we had reliable data, I'm sure there are circumstances that would made putting a helmet on a poor statistical choice. Even if that wasn't the case, I'm certain that on roads that you know very well, during the day, with good surface conditions, that strong defensive riding techniques combined with 1-4 above can make the statistical benefit of wearing a helmet is so small that you'd enjoy a far greater benefit by wearing a helmet around the house or in a car.

I know with a pretty good degree of certainty that the times I don't wear my helmet that I'd be better off statistically if I instead wore one walking the 100 yards down the street to the corner grocery. If you disagree, let's discuss it like adults, but please don't waste all our times with wholly inadequate or inapplicable statistics, and the silly insinuations about intelligence, Darwinism, etc. only demonstrate your own lack of understanding and/or inability to do so. During the discussion I'll even help you understand that for me riding at double the max speed of store bought e-bikes actually makes me safer.

I understand much of this is counter intuitive, resulting in some of your inappropriate knee jerk reactions, but once you realize I am correct, then maybe you'll start preaching the techniques for safer riding, which has far better potential to improve accident statistics than the Gospel of Helmet.

John

 

[Arlo1]

Statistically most of us will ride through life never needing the protection of a Helmet. Most of us will never need the protection of a seat belt, a fire extinguisher or fire insurance either. These are things that most of us have/use, if not by Law through common sense, and hope to GOD that we never actually have the need to use them. We hope that in the end it was all a big waist of time and expense.

So what are your viewes on wearing a Helmet? Do you think it is pointless to wear a Helmet and have Helmet hair as most of us will never go down or ever be hit by a car? Or do you choose to wear a Helmet, regardless of local law, because you think it is the wiser choice to take this small and slightly inconvienent pre-caution?

Oh and BTW.....v tach, you are welcome for the AVY edit :wink:

I have needed all thouse things Couldn't count how many times a helmet has saved my life couldn't count how many times I have put out a fire with a fire extinguisher, Seat belt has likely helped me a few times, I am sure eventualy I will need to put a claim though for a fire.
I see it like this It is the unforseen that you need a helmet for like when I was snowbording a few years ago and aperantly a skier cut me off I cliped the back of his skies and fell over backwards and hit my head. Needless to say I dont remember the whole day! Now when I snowbord I ware a helmet! In college one year before me A harley instructor was messing around and doing wheelies on his buell when he was just turning around at ~3 mph (you could walk faster) and the front wheel washed and he hit his head and was dead instantly!
I see it like this. Common sense will tell the fittest of us when we should use a helmet. And the law tries to tell those who are not as fit when they need a helemet. I will never climb on a 2 wheeled powered machine and go for a blast without a helmet. I wear a helmet for alot of things in my life so I can go faster and hope if I do crash I wont die!

 

[deronmoped]

Statistically most of us will ride through life never needing the protection of a Helmet. Most of us will never need the protection of a seat belt, a fire extinguisher or fire insurance either. These are things that most of us have/use, if not by Law through common sense, and hope to GOD that we never actually have the need to use them. We hope that in the end it was all a big waist of time and expense.

So what are your viewes on wearing a Helmet? Do you think it is pointless to wear a Helmet and have Helmet hair as most of us will never go down or ever be hit by a car? Or do you choose to wear a Helmet, regardless of local law, because you think it is the wiser choice to take this small and slightly inconvienent pre-caution?

Oh and BTW.....v tach, you are welcome for the AVY edit :wink:

I have needed all thouse things Couldn't count how many times a helmet has saved my life couldn't count how many times I have put out a fire with a fire extinguisher, Seat belt has likely helped me a few times, I am sure eventualy I will need to put a claim though for a fire.
I see it like this It is the unforseen that you need a helmet for like when I was snowbording a few years ago and aperantly a skier cut me off I cliped the back of his skies and fell over backwards and hit my head. Needless to say I dont remember the whole day! Now when I snowbord I ware a helmet! In college one year before me A harley instructor was messing around and doing wheelies on his buell when he was just turning around at ~3 mph (you could walk faster) and the front wheel washed and he hit his head and was dead instantly!
I see it like this. Common sense will tell the fittest of us when we should use a helmet. And the law tries to tell those who are not as fit when they need a helemet. I will never climb on a 2 wheeled powered machine and go for a blast without a helmet. I wear a helmet for alot of things in my life so I can go faster and hope if I do crash I wont die!

I guess you wear a helmet whenever there is a chance you will fall. Falling is one of the top ten killers of people.

Off a roof, off a ladder, tripping down stairs, running, trampoline, climbing, hiking...

Just to advocate that you wear a helmet in limited circumstances does not seem consistent.

Deron.

 

[Canis Lupus]

I still can't work out why car drivers and passengers aren't required to wear helmets.