Hi all. I recently picked up a used Ridel XS1 scooter. The previous owner told me he lost the charger and it had not been rode in about 2 years, but for $20, I figured I could take a chance and buy a new charger and not be out a whole lot. Well, I got it home and decided to do some investigating and found that the battery still had about 36v. It is a 36v system, so I know the battery is about halfway charged, but assume that would not hold it back from being turned on. I know I am getting voltage up to the display, but after that, I'm not really sure where or what to check. Is there anyway to test different components before just throwing money at it (or just deciding it's not worth it)? I'm wondering if the power button itself is bad (it's integrated into the thumb throttle). Maybe the display circuit board? Controller?
Help troubleshooting scooter won't turn on
- Thread starter azeus17
- Start date
With the battery connected to the scooter normally, connect your voltmeter's black wire to battery negative, and set the meter for DC Volts. Test the voltage with the red meter wire at:
--controller battery+ B+ input
--controller-to-display cable (each wire) with them still connected if this is possible (some are not easily accessed without unplugging them).
Also test the B+ at the battery output when you press the power button, and see if it changes at all. If it suddenly drops then there's somethign wrong with the battery (the BMS is probably protecting the cells against overdischarge by disconnecting the output in this case)
--controller battery+ B+ input
--controller-to-display cable (each wire) with them still connected if this is possible (some are not easily accessed without unplugging them).
Also test the B+ at the battery output when you press the power button, and see if it changes at all. If it suddenly drops then there's somethign wrong with the battery (the BMS is probably protecting the cells against overdischarge by disconnecting the output in this case)
Battery negative to controller B+ input = 36v
I had to unplug the connector for the display to be able to measure, but all wires measured 0v, except the red which measured 36v.
I think the nail in the coffin was your last suggestion. Pressing the power button while monitoring the battery, voltage instantly drops to 21v. I assume that means it's shot.
I had to unplug the connector for the display to be able to measure, but all wires measured 0v, except the red which measured 36v.
I think the nail in the coffin was your last suggestion. Pressing the power button while monitoring the battery, voltage instantly drops to 21v. I assume that means it's shot.
Probably at least one cell group is discharged all the way down to just above the cell-level LVC in the BMS. Some BMS use just one cell group (or a few) at the most negative end of the battery to power the BMS. If the battery was left completely untouched for a couple of years, it could have emptied those cells that far and left the rest at whatever state they had been before.
If this is the case, then you may be able to simply recharge the battery, and leave it on the charger for however many days (minimum) it would take to rebalance it.
If you know someone with a 36v (42v actual) charger you can borrow from them, you can try this.
If the problem is simply one or more failing cell groups, then it's probably easier (and possibly cheaper) to replace the battery than to fix it (since fixing the bad group(s) would only fix those, and not change the aged groups of the rest of the pack).
If this is the case, then you may be able to simply recharge the battery, and leave it on the charger for however many days (minimum) it would take to rebalance it.
If you know someone with a 36v (42v actual) charger you can borrow from them, you can try this.
If the problem is simply one or more failing cell groups, then it's probably easier (and possibly cheaper) to replace the battery than to fix it (since fixing the bad group(s) would only fix those, and not change the aged groups of the rest of the pack).
Thanks for the help. I had ordered a charger before I started digging into it (I could not find any 42v output chargers laying around the house) so I'll see what happens when it arrives. Fingers crossed it comes to life, but I'm not holding my breath. Unfortunately, these scooters seem to be rare and I cannot find parts anywhere. The Ridel website does have a few parts listed, but batteries are out of stock and $140 when they are in stock. Not sure I want to throw that kind of money at this thing.
Depending on the level of DIY you're willing to do, it's likely that at least some parts from other similar scooters would work on it. Many of these things are just clones of each other with a different name slapped on, all made in the same factory just ordered in batches by different companies. Sometimes they have different firmware in the controllers for different limitations/features.
If you don't find one that fits, and are willing to use an externally-mounted one (or one you carry with a cable down to the scooter), you can use any battery of the right voltage that can supply the necessary current (whatever the controller's current limit is, plus margin for safety and aging over time).
Keep in mind that the cheaper a battery is for the same capability, the less likely it is that it will work very well or last very long. More expensive isn't necessarily better, but cheaper is usually worse.
If you don't find one that fits, and are willing to use an externally-mounted one (or one you carry with a cable down to the scooter), you can use any battery of the right voltage that can supply the necessary current (whatever the controller's current limit is, plus margin for safety and aging over time).
Keep in mind that the cheaper a battery is for the same capability, the less likely it is that it will work very well or last very long. More expensive isn't necessarily better, but cheaper is usually worse.
I thought I’d post a follow up and resolution to my problem. My charger came, but unfortunately did not solve the problem. I decided, as a last ditch effort, to open the battery pack to investigate. After removing lots of silicone and sliding the cells out, I discovered one of the balance leads had become detached from the cells. I was unsure if I had caused this while removing the silicone or sliding the pack out, but to my surprise after soldering the lead back on, I plugged the pack into the scooter and it fired right up!
All in all, a simple fix, but one that, outside of this community, most people would have probably gave up on and trashed a decent scooter. Glad I stuck with it and am thankful for the help on these forums.
All in all, a simple fix, but one that, outside of this community, most people would have probably gave up on and trashed a decent scooter. Glad I stuck with it and am thankful for the help on these forums.
DaLanMan
10 kW
the other thing that leapt to my mind, if you can't find a replacement battery, there are a couple of lads posting in the for sale group that they are making batts, I imagine one of them could wisk up a unit for ya.
My answer was to go full nutty and just read on on how they work ,then build my own. So far no house fires, But I do keep buckets of safety sand around just in case.
My answer was to go full nutty and just read on on how they work ,then build my own. So far no house fires, But I do keep buckets of safety sand around just in case.
