how to program a sevcon gen4

[charlesb123]

I'm not much good with rpdos, these are external communications sent to and from the gen4. There is a section in dvt_helper for configuring them, so have a look in there and you might find something. Probably something to do with the extra control board you have on your bike.

Good luck!

 

[dutchlincoln]

But what are they?
Are these external i/o through can, and is it to tell the gen4 what to do when adress "blablabla" enters the can?

 

[querlenker]

Its for communication between different Gen4 or other devices. Is your Gen4 used or new? Looks you need to setup the canbus correctly.

 

[dutchlincoln]

Hi,
Thanks,

My Gen4 is brand new from the vectrix factory.

I have had it running for a very short time.

Yesterday i connected the DVT software with the arrived IXXAT.
I am 200% sure i havn't written anything, but since my connection i have a controller that blinks 10 times, saying that my IO and RPDO are in error.

How can i discover what's wrong with them?

I have to admit i find it very hard this way, becouse i miss a lot of info.

I figure that when i have a new Gen4 and motor, throttle, and so on, and connect it directly to my controller, its easyer to program and figure out....

 

[Doctorbass]

Hi,
Thanks,

My Gen4 is brand new from the vectrix factory.

I have had it running for a very short time.

Yesterday i connected the DVT software with the arrived IXXAT.
I am 200% sure i havn't written anything, but since my connection i have a controller that blinks 10 times, saying that my IO and RPDO are in error.

How can i discover what's wrong with them?

I have to admit i find it very hard this way, becouse i miss a lot of info.

I figure that when i have a new Gen4 and motor, throttle, and so on, and connect it directly to my controller, its easyer to program and figure out....

Ensure that you return in operational mode. I guess is entered in pre-operational mode...

Doc

 

[dutchlincoln]

Hi, thanks for the reply.
I had it in preop indeed, and its back to operational now.

problems that stay:
-io error
-RPDO error.

I am quite sure it cannot communicate anymore through can with the i/o board where all switches and lights go to (and throttle).

 

[Doctorbass]

Here is THE DOCUMENT YOU NEED :wink:

https://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/images/DVT Tutorial.pdf

DOc

 

[Doctorbass]

oh, is it possible to have a DCF file opened in the DVT software and see the values of that specific file? Of does it have to be shot into a controller in order to see the set values?

I also wonder the same thing!

I have a project to install a 2013 Zero S motor to my 2012 Zero S. The 2013 motor have different parameters that i need to program in the Zero 2012 Sevcon controller.
I have the DCF file from the 2013 Zero S and would like to just get the motor data and replace the 2012 motor data of my actual DCF for these new 2013 motro data....
Problem is that the 2013 Zero work at 116V and have different settings so i dont want to load the 2013 DCF file in my 2012 S Zero controller ... I just worrie about any problem.. that's why i would just like to extaract the motor data from the 2013 DCF file and put these data in my 2012 S controller.

For some testing I'm actually trying to make just some changes to see if i can play with the data and see any changes in the motor running.
I tried to change the max motor speed setting in the DVT helper on my 2012 Zero controller and i can't get the change to work..!

I have set it in the Preop mode, cycle the key and have change the max motor speed from 6000rpm to 20rpm just to see if i can affect any setting and if it work ... and then i have click on LOAD value, entered back in operational mode and cycled the key

and motor remain with 6000rpm speed

Any help will be apprecated!

 

[querlenker]

You can do both. Open the file "offline" and see some values, or you simply open it in any text editor and search the values you are looking for. Then you need to convert from HEX to DEC and sometimes multiply with an factor (for example for voltage 0.0625). All those factors are also included in the dcf files.

 

[Shany]

Hi doc.

I can help you with DVT.

Just PM me the DCF for your old motor, and the datasheet or DCF for the new one (or whatever data you have) and i will build you a DCF for the new one.
Allso There is an option in the dvt, to compare dcf... You can do that from there... Just be careful not to change anything else... PDO's for example.. Or you will have no dashboard

Shany

 

[Doctorbass]

Hi doc.

I can help you with DVT.

Just PM me the DCF for your old motor, and the datasheet or DCF for the new one (or whatever data you have) and i will build you a DCF for the new one.
Allso There is an option in the dvt, to compare dcf... You can do that from there... Just be careful not to change anything else... PDO's for example.. Or you will have no dashboard

Shany

Hello Shany,
Great! Thanks.. ! i'm playing with the DCF files and compare the value of the 2012 and 2013 file with Winmerge. I note all motor related parameters.

I now have a big problem... I loaded the Zero S 2013 DCF file to the controller to see and note all the value in DVT just to compare to the one i noted from the DCF in HEX and converted them in DEC. Problem is that the DCF file from the 2013 is programmed to operate at 28s ( 102V nominal) and the 2012 S that i have is for 18s ( 66V nominal) and not i just can't communicate with the controller.. I can't get the DVT to read any info.. and the normally flashing green led on the IXXAT is not flashing anymore!... I just wonder if i will have to seperatly power the sevcon to the voltage range of the 2013 Zero to get it to communicate.. i guess the voltage limit programmed for the 2013 are above the actual voltage my 2012 battery have .... Damn it!

I think also that the 2012 was operating at 125khz speed for the canbus and the 2013 dcf had indication for 500khz.. this might be the reason why it wont communicate anymore... mayby i'll have to reprogram the firmware ( i have it) and reupload the last saved working DCF i had for the 2012

They say we learn with errors... .. so YES i'M LEARNING! :lol:

Any help from you will be really apprecaited!

Doc

 

[querlenker]

This does have another reason than the voltage.

Does the Led on the Sevcon blink?

Did you try to change the baut rate? I am not sure but maybe they changed from 250kbs or 1000kbs to 500kbs from "12 to "13.

Try this at first, if the Sevcon led is alive, this will be a canbus error..

 

[Doctorbass]

This does have another reason than the voltage.

Does the Led on the Sevcon blink?

Did you try to change the baut rate? I am not sure but maybe they changed from 250kbs or 1000kbs to 500kbs from "12 to "13.

Try this at first, if the Sevcon led is alive, this will be a canbus error..

I tried to change the baud rate and the only baud rate working now... but slowly and with still the red led on the IXXAT is now at 500kHz.

If i enter the command flts ( fault) i get: Low batt and Preop

Low batt is probably due to the new dcf that contain value for the 2013 battery wich is higher voltage.. and the nmax voltage i have on my 2012 battery is lower than the min operating voltage of the 2013...

Actually i can't see the led on the sevcon.. i'll have to remove the seat and few shield to see this LED ( i dont know where it is located..)

Normally the ixxat was operating at 125kHz when with the 2012 Zero S DCF and the led was flashing green.... and now there is no value read at that speed.. the only speed i can get some slow value displayed is at 500kHz.. but the IXXAT led is RED SOLID and if i try at 250kHz i get flashing RED led but still no communication...

If i goes on the DVT HELPER i get the error message: Time Out.. IS the controller ON ?... that is indicating me that probably the controller is OFF due to the too low voltage present for his new DCF asking for a minimum that is higher than what my 2012 can do now...

What do you think?

 

[querlenker]

Try to upload your stock 12" dcf with "send dcf to unit" with 500khz, after upload you should be able to communicate with 125khz again. Than just remove the ixxat and open the 13" file in dvt, there is something like "manipulate offline" or so in the helper menu. There you can get all the settings for the motor. Note them and insert them later in your 12" dcf. That's all

 

[Doctorbass]

This does have another reason than the voltage.

Does the Led on the Sevcon blink?

Did you try to change the baut rate? I am not sure but maybe they changed from 250kbs or 1000kbs to 500kbs from "12 to "13.

Try this at first, if the Sevcon led is alive, this will be a canbus error..

The LED on the sevcon blink 7 times

The IXXAT no more communicate at 125khz and i see some activity only at 500khz setting for the baud rate.

All problem began once i uploaded the 2013 Zero controller DCF file into my Zero 2012 controller, and cycled the key. In fact i need the 2013 motor parameters and the only way to get this is to send the Zero S 2013 DCF file to the controller. It seem not possible to load a DCF file and to read it unless to send it to the controller..

As for the IXXAT, I think that normally the 2013 is operating at 500khz According to some info i saw in the dcf files when i opened it with a txt file editor
My 2012 normally work at 125khz.

It's like the uploaded infos from the 2013 DCF file have set the controller to work at 500khz... but normally the rirring in the 2012 is made to work at 125khz...
if i want to go back and reprogram the right older DCF file of my 2012 S, i just can't because it must be set at 125khz to comm properly and have no comm error, but the sevcon is set to work at 500khz now...

If i type the command FLTS to get the fault i get the two following error: Preop and Low Batt

I know i have left the sevcon in Preop wich is normal.. i am working in programing it.
As for the Low Batt error i think it's an error caused by the fact that the DCF file for the 2013 Zero is setting the controller to work between about 84V to 116V ... But my 2012 Zero normally work between 54 to 75V so even with my fully charged battery on the 2012, the controller "think" it is critical low voltage.. and i wonder if that is what is causing problem....

According to the specs, The 7 blink the Green LED on the controller is doing mean:

7 Incorrect battery voltage
Correct battery voltage,
loose connections,
discharged battery.

Doc

 

[Doctorbass]

Try to upload your stock 12" dcf with "send dcf to unit" with 500khz, after upload you should be able to communicate with 125khz again.

Thanks for the suggestion.

I tried that already but the comm at 500khz is so poor that there is errors and also the IXXAT device CAN led is solid RED...

It's like the controller have to be reprogrammed to work at 125khz and not 500khz.. but to be reprogrammed, it must be at 125khz... lol

Some info about the CAN LED on the IXXAT:

If the USB LED is lit green, communication with the interface via the USB port is
possible. If communication is not possible, the USB LED is lit red.
The CAN LED flashes green with every message received or transmitted without
error. If the CAN controller is in “Error warning“ or “Error passive“ mode, the LED
flashes red with every message. If the CAN controller is in ”Bus off“ mode, the
LED is permanently lit red.


Doc

 

[Doctorbass]

I made a video to show the problem and give you guys a better idea of the help i need.

I know that these Sevcon controller and the DVT are not so user friendly and i was aware of the difficulty level but hey!... nobody can learn without errors enh? :lol: We learn from our errors lol

[youtube]SWg8CkVHCz0[/youtube]

 

[Doctorbass]

Problem solved !


Thanks Biff ! :wink:

I had to isolate the CAN bus lines from the rest of the motorcycle components and communicate directly with the controller alone, Then i was able to get the CAN data to be ok with the IXXAT interface at the wrong baud rate of 500kHz and to re upload a working DCF file with the right 125khz baud rate setting!

I'm learning ! .. These DVT and Sevcon programming might not remain complicated for so long to me guys!

Doc

 

[Shany]

Respect!

I was a bit late with my replay
But good to know there are some experts here.

The CANbus can connect to up to 127 devices on the same bus, so theoretically you can use the IXXAT with everything still connected...

Just make sure you have proper 120ohm Termination resistor, like so:

 

[charlesb123]

I had the same problem when I first built my motorbike. My Gen4 runs at 1mhz, but my BMS is 500khz. They need to run at the same baud on the canbus, or you get loads of errors. I could have slowed the Gen4 down, but I just split them up instead.
I'm pretty sure Sevcon usually use 1mhz as the default speed.

Charles

 

[Doctorbass]

That's exact Charles!

The problem was that the 2013 Zero Can bus are working at 500khz and the DCF file is seting the sevcon to work at 500khz for the 2013.
For the 2012 Zero , the CAN bus work at 125khz and all connected components are at that speed as well. There is NO SHIELD a or twisted pair on the 2012 for the CAN line, that's why it is set to operate slower. The DCF file of the 2012 is seting the sevcon to 125khz.

When i uploaded the 2013 DCF to my 2012 Zero, the controller has been set to operate at 500khz but the entire wiring on the 2012 is made for max 125khz ( no shield or twisted pair CAN wires)

That's what caused the problem ... the CAN was working at too high speed for the 2012 connections type and shield etc...

I discovered that For the Zero sevcon opertation No matter the baud rate you set in the main screen (not the DVT Helper) the sevcon remain programmed at the baud rate set in the DCF


Next task: isolate all related motor parameters from the 2013 zero S dcf file and put them to my 2012 zero S dcf to have my 2013 motor to operate!

 

[dnmun]

i bet there are people at ZERO who had to do that exact same thing when they were developing the new motor.

they would have needed a test bed for the motor so they would have used the 2012 as the test bed and then modified the dcf motor files as you are attempting.

i bet if you contacted them and explained what you are after and ask if someone in that group can forward you the process or the files themselves you would generate some support from them.

 

[Arlo1]

I wonder how long it took Ryan to find that out

 

[Doctorbass]

I wonder how long it took Ryan to find that out

Yeah it was not that long! he replied me about 10 minutes after i emailed him in CC with Luke 8)

My plans now are to get a Size 6 ASAP, and then to install it on the 2012 S, and take the ME0913 and the Size 4 and install them on my 2009 Zero X frame and operate them at 116V for a drag bike

 

[Arlo1]

I wonder how long it took Ryan to find that out

Yeah it was not that long! he replied me about 10 minutes after i emailed him in CC with Luke 8)

My plans now are to get a Size 6 ASAP, and then to install it on the 2012 S, and take the ME0913 and the Size 4 and install them on my 2009 Zero X frame and operate them at 116V for a drag bike

Actually I ment the first time he discovered the problem...

As for me I just picked up a 2007 kx250f from a fire I'm going to cut the front off and weld it to a zero frame and make my race bike with 2 size fours.