Huge price differences in Ebay motors vs Vendors!?

[sonnetg]

Hi,

I am planning to convert a secondary bike to an ebike/hybrid setup. I was looking at some ebay motors, which seem to be very cheap compared to most ebike vendors. The price on the vendor site seem to be almost twice or thrice than the ones available on Ebay.

My first purchase was a Leed ebike kit, which came with a Bafang 8Fun sensorless motor, but cost me around $500 or so. I was looking at eBay and it seems a very similar motor can be purchased for less than $200.

To be specific, this is the Ebay kit i am looking at: http://www.ebay.com/itm/36V-350W-Geared-26-Front-Rear-Ebikeling-Electric-Bicycle-Conversion-Kit-ebike-/271923152076?var=&hash=item3f4fe204cc

would it be a mistake to purchase the no-name brand geared motor off ebay? I do realize these cheap motors may come with plastic or inferior nylon gears, but how hard would it be replace these gears for generic no-name brand motors? Any other factors to be aware of in geared motors? How about magnet quality?

Anyone here have any experience with Ebay geared motors? Would it be wise to buy a cheap ebay motor as opposed to brand name motors from well known vendors?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

 

[rsilvers]

It really does look like an amazing value.

 

[sonnetg]

It really does look like an amazing value.

It sure does. I tried searching for "ebikeling" at ES forums, but the search hasn't yielded a whole lot of results. Just from the looks of the kit, the kits seems to be a great deal. The rim of the kit seems to be top quality compared to Leed or Hill topper kits.

The only problem i see from Ebay sellers would be the availability of spare parts, and lack of support. Leed and Hill topper kits warranty their products for up to two years compared to Ebikeling warranty of only 3 months, so it only adds to the mystery. But the ebay kit beats leed kit by a long shot based on the specs alone.

Here's the Leed kit which i currently have on my primary bike: http://www.e-bikerig.com/products/10k-e-bike-kit-samsung-li-ion.html

 

[rsilvers]

There are a few minor things. I would not want those brake levers, as I have XTR brakes on my bike and so I want to use my existing levers. That would necessitate that I buy hidden-wire brake sensors.

The freewheel they include only goes down to 14 teeth (on the rear wheel version). One will want one that goes to 11 if they would like to pedal while under power. So I would have to scrap that freewheel and buy another one.

A 3-month warranty does not concern me at all. No one can sell something with a very slim profit and then give people free stuff two years later.

The same seller also has a 26 inch version.

Just buy it and write a review. The seller has a good feedback score.

 

[sonnetg]

There are a few minor things. I would not want those brake levers, as I have XTR brakes on my bike and so I want to use my existing levers. That would necessitate that I buy hidden-wire brake sensors.

The freewheel they include only goes down to 14 teeth (on the rear wheel version). One will want one that goes to 11 if they would like to pedal while under power. So I would have to scrap that freewheel and buy another one.

A 3-month warranty does not concern me at all. No one can sell something with a very slim profit and then give people free stuff two years later.

The same seller also has a 26 inch version.

Just buy it and write a review. The seller has a good feedback score.

Yeah. I think i might pull the trigger on this one. I already have a folding ebike which i can use if this kit fails. If anything, at least it would be a good learning and tinkering experience if i need to open up and fix this motor, so i see it as a win-win situation for me. (It's usually the battery that cuts deep in to the pocket anyways..) :lol:

I wont be using the brakes or the freewheel, since I will be converting the front wheel only.


PS: I didn't even realize the link I posted is a 700C version. THANK YOU so much for pointing this out. My hybrid bike is 26", so this certainly wouldn't work. I will be getting the 26" version of this kit:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/36V-350W-Geared-26-Front-Rear-Ebikeling-Electric-Bicycle-Conversion-Kit-ebike-/271923152076?var=&hash=item3f4fe204cc

Before I pull the trigger, I will ask the seller if spare spokes, clutches or gears are available for this version of the motor. Hopefully, it is compatible with bafang 250 watt motor parts as well.

Thank you.

I will write a review for sure if I get the kit.

 

[rsilvers]

I think you want the brake sensor because if you are using PAS mode, the power will not instantly cut off when you stop pedaling.

 

[sonnetg]

I think you want the brake sensor because if you are using PAS mode, the power will not instantly cut off when you stop pedaling.

I wont be using the PAS. That was one reason i had initially chosen the Leed kit. Simply plug and play. I hope this Ebay kit doesn't force you to use PAS, unlike currie or izip ebikes where it forces you to pedal in order to use the full power of the motor. I will mostly be using this motor to climb hills, so i will obviously be pedaling, but I prefer not to install so many options and wires just to keep things simple and clean. I will be disabling most of the unused plugs and will be replacing all other wiring and plugs with quality Anderson and JST plugs.

 

[rsilvers]

That leads kit is really just 125 watt-hours battery? That is 1/2 the size of the smallest battery I have previously heard of. Actually I heard of a 110 but it was concealed in the bike and completely invisible.

 

[sonnetg]

That leads kit is really just 125 watt-hours battery? That is 1/2 the size of the smallest battery I have previously heard of. Actually I heard of a 110 but it was concealed in the bike and completely invisible.

Actually Leed has other battery options. I actually paid quite a bit for a bigger battery because i didn't know any better. I am planning on building my own 10S4P packs with Samsung 25R and charge using an iCharger. Leed isn't a bad deal at all for anyone looking to enter the world of ebikes. I have multiple bikes, which I will eventually convert. Once you get into the world of ebikes...it's hard to go back to only pedaling. If not for the damn hills in my area, I would have no trouble at all pedaling.

http://www.e-bikerig.com/extra-batteries/

 

[rsilvers]

If their extra batteries are 48v, then the price seems fine for US dealers.

They don't list the voltage though, so I think they are 24v, which uses only 1/2 the number of cells for the same Ah as 48v.

 

[sonnetg]

If their extra batteries are 48v, then the price seems fine for US dealers.

They don't list the voltage though, so I think they are 24v, which uses only 1/2 the number of cells for the same Ah as 48v.

That is true. All their kits are 24 volts. I did a huge mistake with purchasing a battery from them. It sure was easy to install as a kit, but I am now locked down with their proprietary wiring and cabling.

It's seem Leed and Hill Toppers are the only plug and play kits out there. Very similar kits.

Leed Kits: http://www.e-bikerig.com/
Hill Topper: http://www.electric-bike-kit.com/hill-topper.aspx

 

[slowhands]

Yep, cheap. I wonder about quality for an unknown brand. Ebay will keep them honest as far as delivery, and eBay has a 2 month money back guarantee, regardless of seller warranty. So make sure it arrives safely and install quickly, as support is probably non-existent. Check the ebay feedback for buyers of this hub, beware if there are negatives.

Honestly, you get what you pay for. Both the MAC 500 and Bafang BPM2 hub motors have great reputations and high power/torque. I'd feel safer going with them.

The concern is the motor quality, bearing quality, clutch quality and lubrication. These hubs use plastic or nylon composite planetary gears, and those must be high quality for the hub to last. Same for the clutch, will it last. You need to know if you can get replacement gear sets or clutches, because those are wear parts and will need replacing after some miles.

 

[tomjasz]

Ebay will keep them honest as far as delivery, and eBay has a 2 month money back guarantee, regardless of seller warranty. So make sure it arrives safely and install quickly, as support is probably non-existent. Check the ebay feedback for buyers of this hub, beware if there are negatives.

Sadly eBay protections have gone in favor of the buyer, to a fault. To many asshats taking advantage of sellers. I gave up because of dishonest buyers. Beating stuff or taking motors apart and then claiming warranty. Great of you're a buyer and have a problem but sucks if you're a seller with a buyer with remorse or being dishonest.

 

[sonnetg]

Yep, cheap. I wonder about quality for an unknown brand. Ebay will keep them honest as far as delivery, and eBay has a 2 month money back guarantee, regardless of seller warranty. So make sure it arrives safely and install quickly, as support is probably non-existent. Check the ebay feedback for buyers of this hub, beware if there are negatives.

Honestly, you get what you pay for. Both the MAC 500 and Bafang BPM2 hub motors have great reputations and high power/torque. I'd feel safer going with them.

The concern is the motor quality, bearing quality, clutch quality and lubrication. These hubs use plastic or nylon composite planetary gears, and those must be high quality for the hub to last. Same for the clutch, will it last. You need to know if you can get replacement gear sets or clutches, because those are wear parts and will need replacing after some miles.

True. I contacted the seller asking on the maintainability and parts availability. The clutches and gears are often the culprit. I have not heard back from the seller yet, but it's weekend here, so I will wait for his response for few more days.

That being said..i have not had any luck finding a 250 Watt Bafang geared motor anywhere for less than $250 (just the motor alone). I think that speaks a lot for the brand demand..

As for MAC 500, it would be too powerful for my needs. I only need the motor to assist during hill climbs...other than that, I am happy to cruise at 10-15 mph...

Just out of curiosity, I still might pull the trigger on Ebikeling motor and checkout the internals for myself....if it works, great...if not, learn and move on..

 

[tomjasz]

Bafang SWXH rear for $75, kit $160 greenbikekit. $50 shipping on the motor. $320 total for the kit with LCD.

 

[sonnetg]

Bafang SWXH rear for $75, kit $122 greenbikekit. $50 shipping on the motor.

I checked their web, but I wasn't able to find Bafang motor kits at that price. Only a generic GBK motor kit for $122: http://www.greenbikekit.com/electric-bike-kit-1/front.html

They do have Bafang BPM motors, but no kit available for those. The BPM motor axle would probably be too big for my aluminum bike.

I am looking for something similar to Bafang 8Fun motor, both in power and size.

 

[sonnetg]

Wait...i was wrong. It seems greenbikekit.com does offer Bafang Kits for around $140, but shipping to Maryland, USA is around $127

http://www.greenbikekit.com/electric-bike-kit-1/front/bafang-swxk-36v-250w-front-driving-e-bike-kit.html

The total with shipping adds to around $267, which isn't a bad deal considering GBK also carries plenty of spare parts and spokes as well.

Checking out the site now..

Thank you.

 

[rsilvers]

In my searching for what to buy, I pretty much concluded that if I was not going to get the super-cheap eBay stuff, then BMSBattery was the best combination of price and selection. I don't think they are completely plug and play though, and was prepared for some soldering and maybe or maybe not some spoke adjustment. I didn't go that route myself because in the end I wanted a CAV3 and Mac motor, but it seemed like a good way to go for more economical stuff.

They would be $127 + $132 shipping for a Q85 36V200W-250W Front V-Brake E-Bike Kit with LED Meter.

 

[tomjasz]

Micah Toll did a good job of explaining how to convert a controller to use CA3.

http://www.ebikeschool.com/add-cycle-analyst-connector-controller/

 

[rsilvers]

Micah Toll did a good job of explaining how to convert a controller to use CA3.

http://www.ebikeschool.com/add-cycle-analyst-connector-controller/

Oh man. That is a project. I have done so many things like that which take hours and hours to have learned sometimes it is best to just buy a controller with CA plug.

In fact I recently made that mistake - I tried to modify a 12mm torque-arm to 14mm. My friend and I spent two hours on it. I could have just bought the new torque-arm for $30. Two hours for two people - I just valued our time at $7 per hour. And to make matters worse, I was not happy with the result and bought the new arm anyway! And to make matters worse again, I can't even sell the old arm now because it is modified.

 

[tomjasz]

I did buy the new controller, but the lessons learned by taking on a very doable project are invaluable. As a retiree I have more time than dollars and the sense of accomplishment is immense. That said, it's really not as complex a project as you make it sound. That's the joy for many here, learning new skills.

What do you do if there is no controller available with the CA3 plug for your application? Quit? <wink>

 

[bionx 1954]

Hi I bought from Ebikeling Ebay dealer. They are base in IL. I ordered a 9C clone rear 26 in motor. It arrived in a few day to me in Canada as described. The motor is well made and runs well. I did respoke it with Sapin 13/14 butted spokes for I am running high power (2500-3000 ) watts through it The dealer ships fast and has very good prices.

 

[teklektik]

Micah Toll did a good job of explaining how to convert a controller to use CA3.

http://www.ebikeschool.com/add-cycle-analyst-connector-controller/

Oh man. That is a project. I have done so many things like that which take hours and hours to have learned sometimes it is best to just buy a controller with CA plug.

Here's a link to an alternative strategy to add a CA connector to any controller that doesn't require cracking the controller open or messing with making JST connectors. Requires a CA external shunt, a resistor, and some very basic soldering skills. This technique gives full functionality for either V2 or V3 CAs.

 

[sonnetg]

Hi I bought from Ebikeling Ebay dealer. They are base in IL. I ordered a 9C clone rear 26 in motor. It arrived in a few day to me in Canada as described. The motor is well made and runs well. I did respoke it with Sapin 13/14 butted spokes for I am running high power (2500-3000 ) watts through it The dealer ships fast and has very good prices.

Thank you for the vote of confidence, but It's absolutely critical for me to have readily available parts. I don't want to be ordering from US vendor than having to scramble for parts from chinese vendors.

I did check Ebikelings website. They have some really great deals going on, but i have not found any spare parts for spokes, gears or clutch assembly. I think it's crucial to have these parts readily available.

I will probably give them a call tomorrow and see if they can manage couple of extra spokes and clutch assembly for me. I will order the kit as soon as I get a confirmation from them.

Ebikeling site: http://www.ebikeling.com

 

[rsilvers]

Thank you for the vote of confidence, but It's absolutely critical for me to have readily available parts. I don't want to be ordering from US vendor than having to scramble for parts from chinese vendors.

I don't think you are going to find parts in the US, but that same dealer sells the hub/wheel for $160. You can always buy a new wheel if the motor breaks after the warranty period and still be ahead of buying a more expensive system. If a spoke breaks, then a bike shop should be able to make one. I know you said that a Mac motor was more power than you wanted, but it does have parts available, though at a much higher price. If you don't want to go fast, you could get a 12T and just enjoy the torque. You could even limit the current so that you put under 500 watts in it, and maybe then it would last a crazy long time due to being overbuilt for your application.