Im going to say something very controvertial. SPEED.

[rider95]

I used to tow my hangglider up to 1800ft behind a car then do a loop in my Wills wing HP AT for fun nothing I mean nothing scares me more then having to ride my E bike on a 4 lane road or just about any busy rd . I ride my e bike to work its just over 1 mile last week just one day I had 3 near miss its just that way somedays stay on the sidewalk and go slow don't trust a light or you have the right a way think every car is out to kill you .

 

[Chalo]

They will be satisfied only when we have no more... Freedom

Given how little cycling specific infrastructure there is, I think it's reasonable that cyclists should be able to use it freely without finding motorcyclists there. And I think it's not fair to motorcyclists who meet their legal obligations for you to put some pedals on your motorcycle and decide that releases you from those same obligations.

Remember that using any kind of motor vehicle in public asserts your "freedom" by imposing burdens on others. It isn't cool. But being arrogant about it, like it's some kind of virtue, is much less cool yet.

 

[Ykick]

“PERFORMANCE SAVES LIVES” - “LOUD PIPES SAVES LIVES”, etc…

Pedals or not, I believe a sensible eBike definition is comparable performance up to the level of a top athlete on a road bike. I believe that’s a “fair” gauge for eBikes to be defined and utilized on paths, etc.

Anything which performs beyond that threshold of performance is really a motorcycle and loses any “privilege” to be considered a bicycle, IMO.

 

[WoodlandHills]

If you live in a country with a national health system where other taxpayers pay if you get hurt, doesn't the state have an obligation to take reasonable steps to prevent avoidable costs? Steps like discouraging tobacco use, encouraging condom use or assuring that riders....

I agree ther should be a law forcing YOU to wear a condom

People with such a mind stole something from us, and continue to steal more and more of it. They will be satisfied only when we have no more... Freedom

Since you happily live in the continents only nanny-state and seem to be counting on socialized medicine to take care of you and those you injure when you crash, you must have a unique interpretation of the whole concept of freedom vs irresponsibility. As an assault rifle owning, long-time Arizonan who was born and raised South of the Mason-Dixon Line, I am sure you have much to teach me on the subject. So please, do continue......

 

[Chalo]

200+ pounds of flesh, bone, and metal doing 30mph can do some significant damage to both people and property.

The comparison with a very fit cyclist is apt, however it must be noted that there are very, very few such people.

If you pedal a bike faster than 20mph, your blood is pumping and your mind is on, in a way that many motorists can't even understand because they've never experienced it on the road. Step up another level to the high 20s of mph, and that implies you have also accumulated a lot of cycling skills in the process of acquiring that kind of fitness.

Compared to a 30mph pedal cyclist, a 30mph e-biker is by nature a dopey saddle tater with marginal riding skills. I wish it weren't so, but it is. If you don't exert yourself hard and efficiently over a long period of time to attain such speed, you don't get the beneficial side effects of the exertion. And neither do the other road users around you. With an e-bike, you can continue to be a callously indifferent, oblivious car driver minus the car.

A pedal cyclist with the spaced-out mindset of a motorist is one who's going 5mph. That cyclist doesn't pose a significant safety risk to anyone, unless you believe benign road users are responsible for mitigating the risks imposed by dangerous ones.

 

[the12be]

I do 40 mph on my normal bike and you will always have some dick trying to race you ebike or bike 20 mph is a good speed (people can pass you and not get road rage ) it's the people who pull out on you you need to look out for

just pick a fixed point as a car passes say in you head only a fool breaks the two second rule if you pass it before you finish that you are too close and back off a bit

hope this helps

 

[MadRhino]

If you live in a country with a national health system where other taxpayers pay if you get hurt, doesn't the state have an obligation to take reasonable steps to prevent avoidable costs? Steps like discouraging tobacco use, encouraging condom use or assuring that riders....

I agree ther should be a law forcing YOU to wear a condom

People with such a mind stole something from us, and continue to steal more and more of it. They will be satisfied only when we have no more... Freedom

Since you happily live in the continents only nanny-state and seem to be counting on socialized medicine to take care of you and those you injure when you crash, you must have a unique interpretation of the whole concept of freedom vs irresponsibility. As an assault rifle owning, long-time Arizonan who was born and raised South of the Mason-Dixon Line, I am sure you have much to teach me on the subject. So please, do continue......

Yep, I do. I did not ask for the nanny state, it came from people who believe the government should protect their citizens against themselves, giving always more and more services and collecting more and more taxes. In half a century of riding, I have been in a hospital 5 days in all, never sent anyone to the hospital, and never been sick enough to see a doctor in 69 years. My taxes are paying for those who are using the system, and I don't care much because I believe they should be free to be what they are, or to live like they want, as soon as they are not menacing other peoples life or goods.

All this mentality about governments having to protect us from ourselves, started with laws that have nothing to do with crime. Now I can be fined 1500 $ for smoking a cigarette on the sidewalk, tomorrow someone else will be for eating junk food or being fat, someday for reading the wrong book... When I was a kid this country was land of freedom, now it is every year more of an abusive bureaucracy.

 

[E-geezer]

Compared to a 30mph pedal cyclist, a 30mph e-biker is by nature a dopey saddle tater with marginal riding skills.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

So true

 

[WoodlandHills]

How do you handle the fact that it is your uninspected, uninsured 70mph homemade electric motorcycle that is "menacing other people's life and goods"? Especially since you seem to like to ride it on public bike paths.

Apparently, De Nile is more than just a river in Egypt.....

 

[MadRhino]

I am not menacing anyone. I ride like a motorcycle where or when it is safe to do so, and like a bicycle when I find an advantage in using bicycle facilities. My bike is both, and I am taking advantage of both. Those who are a threat, are driving 2 tons vehicles thinking about something else, wether it is the Nile or just how they could force others to live by their own fears.

My life and safety does rely on my bike being in perfect order. I don't need anyone to inspect it once every 4 years for that is something I am doing everyday. When they do inspect a vehicle, it is OK for now but for how long ? Or do you believe the government should inspect them all every week ?

It must be very uncomfortable to live in your state of constant insecurity feeling kid. I am begining to understand why you like guns so much. Maybe you are a threat, like a scared dog ready to bite anything that his paranoïa sees as a danger.

 

[MrDude_1]

Speed never hurt anyone.
Stopping really fast has hurt alot of people.

Moral: Never stop. Never slow down.

 

[liveforphysics]

I am not menacing anyone. I ride like a motorcycle where or when it is safe to do so, and like a bicycle when I find an advantage in using bicycle facilities. My bike is both, and I am taking advantage of both. Those who are a threat, are driving 2 tons vehicles thinking about something else, wether it is the Nile or just how they could force others to live by their own fears.

My life and safety does rely on my bike being in perfect order. I don't need anyone to inspect it once every 4 years for that is something I am doing everyday. When they do inspect a vehicle, it is OK for now but for how long ? Or do you believe the government should inspect them all every week ?

It must be very uncomfortable to live in your state of constant insecurity feeling kid. I am begining to understand why you like guns so much. Maybe you are a threat, like a scared dog ready to bite anything that his paranoïa sees as a danger.

+1

 

[sn0wchyld]

I am not menacing anyone. I ride like a motorcycle where or when it is safe to do so, and like a bicycle when I find an advantage in using bicycle facilities. My bike is both, and I am taking advantage of both. Those who are a threat, are driving 2 tons vehicles thinking about something else, wether it is the Nile or just how they could force others to live by their own fears.

My life and safety does rely on my bike being in perfect order. I don't need anyone to inspect it once every 4 years for that is something I am doing everyday. When they do inspect a vehicle, it is OK for now but for how long ? Or do you believe the government should inspect them all every week ?

It must be very uncomfortable to live in your state of constant insecurity feeling kid. I am begining to understand why you like guns so much. Maybe you are a threat, like a scared dog ready to bite anything that his paranoïa sees as a danger.

+1

+2

 

[Ozzzz]

My life and safety does rely on my bike being in perfect order. I don't need anyone to inspect it once every 4 years for that is something I am doing everyday.

What about the other dude coming towards you, you speak for him? Much more than this, call it good enough that the dude is safe on roads and paths with folks you care about (if indeed you do)? Just saying.. limited individuality is not such a big sacrifice in gaining maturity, being part of a community.

 

[WoodlandHills]

I am not menacing anyone. I ride like a motorcycle where or when it is safe to do so, and like a bicycle when I find an advantage in using bicycle facilities. My bike is both, and I am taking advantage of both. Those who are a threat, are driving 2 tons vehicles thinking about something else, wether it is the Nile or just how they could force others to live by their own fears.

My life and safety does rely on my bike being in perfect order. I don't need anyone to inspect it once every 4 years for that is something I am doing everyday. When they do inspect a vehicle, it is OK for now but for how long ? Or do you believe the government should inspect them all every week ?

It must be very uncomfortable to live in your state of constant insecurity feeling kid. I am begining to understand why you like guns so much. Maybe you are a threat, like a scared dog ready to bite anything that his paranoïa sees as a danger.

Projecting again, are we?


I enjoy building mechanical things of all sorts, but I also know enough not to take them to inappropriate places: just as assault rifles have no place at the mall, motorcycles have no place on bike paths. Attempts to rationalize either is just a bunch of hypocritical tap dancing to try and excuse selfish and irresponsible behavior. But I am sure you wil feel compelled to try. So, put on your clickety boots and dance away......

 

[MadRhino]

No matter the power it has available, my bike is still an ebike all built with bicycle parts. It does ride like any other ebike on the bike path and I can pedal it up to 15 Mph on my own 69 yrs old power. The only difference is that I can pull the HI switch and use it as a motorcycle on the street. It is not an instrument of death, it is a versatile urban transportation that I am using to ride 15 000 miles a year, faster, safer and cleaner than I ever did before. To compare this with a weapon is an insult to intelligence, or just the last attempt to make a point from someone who is out of arguments. Your ebike is probably much more dangerous than mine, given the probability of accidents that you would face riding it the same mileage as I.

I am not burning gas anymore. If only 10% of the urban transportation was done by this mean, it would make life much better for us all. Powerful ebikes are the best promotion for the EV revolution. Some of my friends abandoned their gassers already. Standard ebikes are only convincing those who are pedaling to work already, and some very few gas users who have short distances to commute.

 

[RyanC]

Personally I think under-regulation on ebikes would (will) lead to over-regulation.

"Freedom" sounds great until some drunk dude exercises his freedom to go 50mph on his *bicycle* and slams into some kids on a mixed use trial and kills them. If/when something like that happens the ensuing regulatory backlash will be a setback for ebikes as a viable transit option, especially because most people see bicycles as recreational and not a viable means of transportation in the first place. Additionally that would mean less growth of ebike commuting, which would also mean less growth of infrastructure to support it.

Putting aside 'the ethics of regulation' and dealing instead with the reality of it, I would much prefer to have some reasonable regs with reasonable enforcement over having no regulations until we have too many.

IMO a mix of ebikes, ebike friendly infrastructure and ebike friendly mass transit has the potential to replace a huge percentage of car based transportation in our cities and with so many benefits to society at large that it would be a shame to lose all that to a few people who want to push the envelope to the bleeding edge.

That all said I do think it would be great if there was a practical way to make a bike with different legal modes- one mode is legal on MUT's, one with a little more power for bike lanes, and one for riding with traffic.

 

[MrDude_1]

at the current political rate.. everything I love is illegal anyway... so saying "its illegal" or "it will be illegal" has no real effect.

for example... I am pretty sure in most places you live, you cant ride a 150+hp supersport bike wearing a scooby doo outfit... yet...

 

[WoodlandHills]

No matter the power it has available, my bike is still an ebike all built with bicycle parts. It does ride like any other ebike on the bike path and I can pedal it up to 15 Mph on my own 69 yrs old power. The only difference is that I can pull the HI switch and use it as a motorcycle on the street. It is not an instrument of death, it is a versatile urban transportation that I am using to ride 15 000 miles a year, faster, safer and cleaner than I ever did before. To compare this with a weapon is an insult to intelligence, or just the last attempt to make a point from someone who is out of arguments. Your ebike is probably much more dangerous than mine, given the probability of accidents that you would face riding it the same mileage as I.

I am not burning gas anymore. If only 10% of the urban transportation was done by this mean, it would make life much better for us all. Powerful ebikes are the best promotion for the EV revolution. Some of my friends abandoned their gassers already. Standard ebikes are only convincing those who are pedaling to work already, and some very few gas users who have short distances to commute.

Tap, tap, tappity, tap...... At this point it sounds like the person you are trying hardest to convince is yourself.

Although, I will grant you that it is not easy trying to explain that you are just so darned special that the rules and regulations ordinary folks have to live with just don't apply to you. Can't they understand that your unique combination of skill and experience permits you to ignore the limits that are meant to restrain lesser beings? After all you are the best person to decide for everyone else that sharing a bike path or bike lane with a motorcycle is a safe thing to do, why should you care what they think about it? And most importantly, why don't those idiots see that it's all about YOUR freedom, not theirs....... I can understand your frustration. :|

 

[MadRhino]

:wink:

Here you can, if Scoobidoo does wear a helmet of course.

 

[E-geezer]

First, E-geezer's nested quote incorrectly attributes Chalo's comment to me, not that I disagree with it, just that it indicates a possible error in the system.

Bizzare. I fixed it, thanks for the heads up.

 

[Jabotical]

Nobody has mentioned Bicycle Lanes.
...
But all that is neither here nor there, what I'm wondering is why more here don't use the bike lanes. Are they in too much of a hurry? Or are the bikes lane system not as good as it is here, or perhaps it doesn't exist?

On the main busy road that's part of my commute, I stay out of the bike lane as much as possible because it's where all the debris is. When I first started biking to work I'd get about a flat a week, and now I seem to be going (at least) months in between. It helps that it's a three-lane road. When I see a wave of traffic coming in the rear view mirror I move over to the bike lane (and also sometimes when someone is approaching in the right lane who really seems to want to stay there)

 

[Santa'sLittleHelper]

at the current political rate.. everything I love is illegal anyway... so saying "its illegal" or "it will be illegal" has no real effect.

for example... I am pretty sure in most places you live, you cant ride a 150+hp supersport bike wearing a scooby doo outfit... yet...

SPEED? Speed can kill AND thrill!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WREyAicJXkM&feature=youtu.be

Holy rocket bike! That has got to be the biggest adrenaline rush ever. That Scooby suit is too much drag for this baby. Might stripe the Scooby suit right off...

SPEED! Yeah baby!!!

 

[Robocog]

Those that scoff at conformity, usually group together, for CONFORMITY. Also, the scoffing of laws, works JUSt due to others NOT doing as you do.

When you mature, you think of the ramifications of all acting as you. Those that scofflaw, SCREW it up for those that followed the stinkin rule.

 

[hypertoric_amplituhedron]

Pedals or not, I believe a sensible eBike definition is comparable performance up to the level of a top athlete on a road bike. I believe that’s a “fair” gauge for eBikes to be defined and utilized on paths, etc.

Just to put some numbers to that: A top athlete on a road bike can do 45~50mph in a flat-out sprint, and maintain 27~30 indefinitely w/o drafting. You're average fit roadie can maintain 20 and sprint to 35 or so, on the flats, no wind.


---------------------------------------


But, I totally see where you guys are coming from. All you need is some drunk dude crashing into some kids at 50 on the bike trail. This has been a possible event for a while, though. And I imagine Florida would be the state where it happens, lol :lol: . Now, luckily, most of them stay on the roads. But, every so often I'll see someone riding a motor scooter or moped down the bike trail at night. I've only seen 3 people with an electric assist bike, over the last few months. These were store-bought multi-thousand dollar machines, though, and not a souped up 50 mph homemade beast.