KillaBICYCLE Electric Bike Drag Racing 3 may 2009

[EVnewbie]

:wink: .. Yeah.. maybe Plasmaboy should see that!... from now I spend less $$$ than someone buying an Harley Davidson! :lol:

Drag racing and acceleraion with electric stuff is just incredible!! I love that... And.. Yes.. i'm just begining!

Doc

Maybe the A123 boys will learn how it is really done right! Good luck with your racing, I'll try to figure out how to run 4 Dewalt packs in parallel...I'm not worthy!
:wink:

 

[EVnewbie]

I noticed my dual N cell icon has changed to a single AAA cell,
Does this mean I'm worthy or I should boost my post count with PICTURES of my electric Giant Stiletto chopper? No worries, I have the design almost complete and will start ordering parts on Friday. 8) My wife is cringing now, good stuff never comes cheap. At least she believes enough in my design to let the funds roll out of the account and arrive in the flesh. Thanks to this board I will be knowledge rich...and cash poor. Nobody ever said education was cheap and these "with lab" costs sure amplify that statement. One day I'll be smoking the tires with Dr. Bass and watching my money fly out of my wallet faster than the bike through the lights. Oh well, such is life on the bleeding edge. :wink: :lol:

 

[jimw1960]

I noticed my dual N cell icon has changed to a single AAA cell,
Does this mean I'm worthy or I should boost my post count with PICTURES of my electric Giant Stiletto chopper? No worries, I have the design almost complete and will start ordering parts on Friday. 8) My wife is cringing now, good stuff never comes cheap. At least she believes enough in my design to let the funds roll out of the account and arrive in the flesh. Thanks to this board I will be knowledge rich...and cash poor. Nobody ever said education was cheap and these "with lab" costs sure amplify that statement. One day I'll be smoking the tires with Dr. Bass and watching my money fly out of my wallet faster than the bike through the lights. Oh well, such is life on the bleeding edge. :wink: :lol:

Yes. We want PICTURES. There is another member of the forum, 64ragtop, who is building a Giant Stiletto ebike in Austin. I'm converting a Schwinn Spoiler chopper, which you can see in my avatar.

 

[gogo]

 

[Reid Welch]

You take your time in building this CHAMPION thread.

We all acknowledge that you, Doctorbass, are the world leader in speedy, advanced ebike racing technology.
In a century your name will be remembered for being THE pioneer of balls-to-the-wall ebike capacity.

I go slow. You go fast. Which is more exciting? Only when I pole vault.

Keep safe and alive for all of us. We love you so much,

Reid

 

[Doctorbass]

You take your time in building this CHAMPION thread.

We all acknowledge that you, Doctorbass, are the world leader in speedy, advanced ebike racing technology.
In a century your name will be remembered for being THE pioneer of balls-to-the-wall ebike capacity.

I go slow. You go fast. Which is more exciting? Only when I pole vault.

Keep safe and alive for all of us. We love you so much,

Reid

Thanks Reid, comments like this are encouraging! and so positive :wink:

Doc

 

[Reid Welch]

^
Because sincere expressions give life, truth and energy to genius people.
Even the unintelligent flourish if given a compliment.

But you...Justin, Bob; a whole body of very, very special people here,
make ES the place I want to be. I want to say thank you to every ES writer, beginner or advanced,
trike, young, old: we're all GREEN as newly planted trees and we all add oxygen to the world with our caring for the earth and for each other.

We need more international members....more women...and more..... gays
because they speak their minds and don't worry about macho imaging. I'll kick anyone who criticizes my man i cure.

Oh, NO

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[dnmun]

doctor bass, i just watched josh kerson of runabout cycles complete 2 separate back to back 1/8 mile runs on his trike. 12.09 and 12.47 seconds. maybe he will show some pictures, but he had 4 of the optimas with about 50 volts i think, not sure why it wasn't full charge except they had been busy all day racing their electric bikes, and he was using an alltrax controller with an etek motor, not sure which one. i think tom will post up the result when he recovers.

his trike was pretty fast, i shoulda had a radar for the terminal velocity, but we just did it on the spur of the moment because tom had the timing setup. this was after the last race at the HPV 3 day marathon with the electrathon guys there the 2 days before. i have put a buncha pitures up on my google picture gallery: http://picasaweb.google.com/home

i am rdnmun on picasa and gmail

i walked through the infield where the electrathon kids were putting the racers together the first morning. mostly just pictures of the common solution for the large gear attached to the freewheel, by bolts and welding, sorry there were so many and i only had time to just walk around the parking lot, bill bates has the electric bike races on his flicker site. i have a few of the last race with just bill bushnell and josh kerson racing, after bill's rear derailer came apart about 1/4 mile into the race. both bill bushnell and josh kerson had driven halfway across the conutry to get here too. josh from ft collins, co where he has moved now and bill from california. had one other guy here from florida, and they had tons of velos for the Left Coast Velomobile gathering. i think these are the only 2 WAWs on the west coast, and there are few local velos that didn't make it either. they all rode downtown from PIR and got lotsa good vibes from the rose festival crowds, finally sunny and hot after 8 months and everybody is high.

 

[Doctorbass]

Yes, I remember, I already say him and one of his trike.. pretty impressive for something using big heavy SLA !

My very first 1/8 run .. and also still my last run was 14.38 using my actual torque setup 5305 24" 100V 100A

today, using the ebike simulator of swbluto(that is very accurate by my past experiences)

i got 60.8 MPH with the 5303

and 68.7 MPH with the 5302 at 125A

and 72.4mph with the 5302 at 150A


Just to let you know.. I simulated my actual known setup and i got 47mph... wich is 0.9% error fro my testes speed with GPS

i'm confident!! i'll beat that actual record!!

Doc

 

[Lucky_Hoodlum]

With the recent use of these rc motors on electric bicycles and the impressive performance they offer i am curious why you are using
a hub motor? I am beginner i dont yet have an electric bicycle (have a mountain bike to convert though if that counts haha)
Looking at this PK Ripper bicycle that recumpence has manufactured wonderful drives for and also livephysic member
also with his dual rc motor bicycle, if they geared this for faster top end speed as i see it your hub motor would no be competitive, it appears these setups are far lighter
and use much less batteries to achieve the better results? . Did you watch the video of the PK bicycle with 2 rc motors accelerate?
I watched it and your 1/4 mile run i dont mean to be rude but your 1/4mile acceleration run looked very slow in comparison. I wish you
all the best DoctorBass in building your bicycle i hope it achieve what you want it to

 

[Doctorbass]

With the recent use of these rc motors on electric bicycles and the impressive performance they offer i am curious why you are using
a hub motor? I am beginner i dont yet have an electric bicycle (have a mountain bike to convert though if that counts haha)
Looking at this PK Ripper bicycle that recumpence has manufactured wonderful drives for and also livephysic member
also with his dual rc motor bicycle, if they geared this for faster top end speed as i see it your hub motor would no be competitive, it appears these setups are far lighter
and use much less batteries to achieve the better results? . Did you watch the video of the PK bicycle with 2 rc motors accelerate?
I watched it and your 1/4 mile run i dont mean to be rude but your 1/4mile acceleration run looked very slow in comparison. I wish you
all the best DoctorBass in building your bicycle i hope it achieve what you want it to

A big difference in acceleration about RC motor and hub motor is that the hub motor have a better powerband
Also the hub motor have much less friction. hub are simple.. and i will never breake a chain using hub... 50% of people using rc motor break something when using high power.... it's not the case with hub... hub are strong. maybe my 0-60 foot is not as fast as with a RC motor but the rest of acceleration is better with hub i'm sure.

Doc

 

[gogo]

Yes, I remember, I already say him and one of his trike.. pretty impressive for something using big heavy SLA !
Doc

You can pull some big Amps from SLA for long enough to go 1/4 mile. That means the weight/horsepower ratio will still be comparable to other chemistries. At the end of the track when air resistance gets high, the heavier vehicle will have an advantage over the lighter one (assuming same weight/horsepower ratio).

 

[Lucky_Hoodlum]

With the recent use of these rc motors on electric bicycles and the impressive performance they offer i am curious why you are using
a hub motor? I am beginner i dont yet have an electric bicycle (have a mountain bike to convert though if that counts haha)
Looking at this PK Ripper bicycle that recumpence has manufactured wonderful drives for and also livephysic member
also with his dual rc motor bicycle, if they geared this for faster top end speed as i see it your hub motor would no be competitive, it appears these setups are far lighter
and use much less batteries to achieve the better results? . Did you watch the video of the PK bicycle with 2 rc motors accelerate?
I watched it and your 1/4 mile run i dont mean to be rude but your 1/4mile acceleration run looked very slow in comparison. I wish you
all the best DoctorBass in building your bicycle i hope it achieve what you want it to

A big difference in acceleration about RC motor and hub motor is that the hub motor have a better powerband
Also the hub motor have much less friction. hub are simple.. and i will never breake a chain using hub... 50% of people using rc motor break something when using high power.... it's not the case with hub... hub are strong. maybe my 0-60 foot is not as fast as with a RC motor but the rest of acceleration is better with hub i'm sure.

Doc

Im not sure how or why the hub motor will have better acceleration after 60 foot. RC motor setup with gears simple upchange and they go even quicker with the hub your using this is only one speed isn't it your not using the hub with 2 speed? I'm still new to all this but not to drag racing, have done this alot in my car and have never seen a single speed drag car haha. I hope it works great for you and i am impressed by the frame ideas you have posted. I see on other thread you took the frame to be soldered? I laughed at the road that garmin took you to thats funny as hell hehe you should send the link to Garmin to use in the advertising campaign hehe

 

[Doctorbass]

Here is a one speed electric car that can proove you can drag race with!

:wink:

THE WHITE ZOMBIE
[youtube]zp_jwE0KdOk[/youtube]

[youtube]BrHXdM9f13k[/youtube]

Doc

 

[The Stig]

And here is another single speed drag racer watch in HQ with good sound
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVv0...-second-also-174-mph/&feature=player_embedded(sorry if its been posted)

 

[Lucky_Hoodlum]

Single speed yes but still geared which would allow for different ratio too be fitted so they don't max out top speed half way down the strip which is what i believe will happen to DoctorBass. You want to be pulling hard the entire length of the strip not just half of it. It will still be fun to watch this bicycle on a drag strip though i look forward to seeing this.

 

[Kurt]

Single speed yes but still geared which would allow for different ratio too be fitted so they don't max out top speed half way down the strip which is what i believe will happen to DoctorBass. You want to be pulling hard the entire length of the strip not just half of it. It will still be fun to watch this bicycle on a drag strip though i look forward to seeing this.

I tend to agree with the above comment . Its a 400m race and ebikes tend t come off line hard but would reach there top speed within the first 100m.I know the white zombie uses a star delta configuration to help the car continue to accelerate during the last 1/2 of the strip. Drag racing is all about power to weight.How much HP will the bike be putting to the ground and how much dose it weigh?

The white zombie would be putting down well over 300hp or 230KW and tip in at 2600lb. If your ebike including rider is 260lb you can do the maths.

The calculator below is a bit of fun for some rough numbers.I have raced my honda at the 1/4 mile many times and I know its weight and power to the ground from a rolling road test. I put the numbers into the simple calculator and it was very close to the real world 1/4 mile times. I had recorded 180hp and my weight total was 2000lb my best 1/4 run was 13.07 . The calculator said 12.998

There are G meters that you can pick up cheap that will give you a fairly accurate 1/4 mile time they might be handy for test runs without having to pay to use a track.


http://www.jcalculator.com/?c=1_4_mile_calculator

Kurt

 

[Doctorbass]

Single speed yes but still geared which would allow for different ratio too be fitted so they don't max out top speed half way down the strip which is what i believe will happen to DoctorBass. You want to be pulling hard the entire length of the strip not just half of it. It will still be fun to watch this bicycle on a drag strip though i look forward to seeing this.

I tend to agree with the above comment . Its a 400m race and ebikes tend t come off line hard but would reach there top speed within the first 100m.I know the white zombie uses a star delta configuration to help the car continue to accelerate during the last 1/2 of the strip. Drag racing is all about power to weight.How much HP will the bike be putting to the ground and how much dose it weigh?

The white zombie would be putting down well over 300hp or 230KW and tip in at 2600lb. If your ebike including rider is 260lb you can do the maths.

The calculator below is a bit of fun for some rough numbers.I have raced my honda at the 1/4 mile many times and I know its weight and power to the ground from a rolling road test. I put the numbers into the simple calculator and it was very close to the real world 1/4 mile times. I had recorded 180hp and my weight total was 2000lb my best 1/4 run was 13.07 . The calculator said 12.998

There are G meters that you can pick up cheap that will give you a fairly accurate 1/4 mile time they might be handy for test runs without having to pay to use a track.


http://www.jcalculator.com/?c=1_4_mile_calculator

Kurt

Kurt.. you shold read some past thread i did about some 1/4 mile java calculator i posted :wink: I did the test!.. and i already have a G meter ( the Beltronic FX-2) with the PC cable to get the dataloggin !

see what i calculated for the power to weight ratio about the choice of the number of battery vs the voltage drop reduction and added weight..:

 

[rkosiorek]

Hey Doc,

Maybe for next year...... i know that X5's run crap on DELTA. so here is the next trick in my evil plan



2 sets of 2 turn windings. all terminated separatetly. the open spaces were opened up a bit. then 6 relays were installed into the open spaces of the stator. once i get the wiring from the dual phase coils over to here:



i should be able to switch all of them between series/parallel winding connections at the flip of a handlebar mounted switch. a 5304 that changes to a 5302 at the touch of a button.

anyway thats the idea. the relays i have are only rated 30A. they'll do for a proof of concept test anyways. in practice 2 of the contacts are always in parallel so it should double my contact rating. if it works, i'll go get some 50A sealed-marine relays. then we'll have some fun.

rick

 

[docnjoj]

Wow Rick! That is awesome! Even mere mortals like myself appreciate the engineering genius!
otherDoc