Konion 18650V charging? Help?

heathyoung

100 kW
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May 27, 2009
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Location
Newcastle, Australia
I'm looking for the best way to charge a setup of Konion 18650V's - 6S18P (22.2V @ 27AH).

From what I have determined from the datasheet, they need to be charged 4.2V (max) at 1A (max) per cell.

If they are charged to a lower level, then they also have a longer life too apparently without sacrificing too much capacity (ie. charge to 4.15v)?

I'm looking at this power supply (meanwell SP-200) http://www.computronics.com.au/meanwell/sp-200/ - which uses a constant current overload protection rather than the more common 'hiccup' mode - but doesn't use foldback protection like their battery charger units (which are too big!).

Is this supply adequate (ie. is the current limiting appropriate for a charger?) - 8.4A, can be adjusted to 24.9V (for 4.15V per cell) - and fits nicely in the Topeak bag I have. I havn't determined the leakage current of the power supply yet (as to whether it can be left permanently hooked up to the batteries or not)

How is end of charge determined - as you reach 4.15V, the graph seems to approach zero - can it be left on as a trickle (or will it eventually reach zero + leakage current across the batteries) or is there a recommended charge end point determination (eg. 100ma per cell) that should be adhered to?

Even though they have a reputation for self balancing, can this be relied upon - as long as they are charged (4.15~4.2) and discharged (3.0V) within their safe limits? Or should I get a 6S balancer for use after charging - I do remember someone mentioning that they don't hold a surface charge well like LiPo, and tend to sit at their nominal voltage (3.7V?).

I'm probably going to assemble the pack with copper foil/shim to parallel all of the cells together, and use nylon cutting board for a top/base of the battery (to protect it from damage/rubbing through the bag/rack and shorting out) with the power supply bolted onto the top of the battery, and have the whole thing removable from the rack (with andersons for quick removal) for security and opportunity charging.

Thoughts? Comments?
 
Hi,

I am one of the older person that used these cells. I can give you the advices you need.

My actual setup cnosist of 4 x (6s16p) or 4 x 22.2V 23Ah using all these 18650V

I also use a Meanwell psu to charge,. The power supply i have is a 48V 32A (1500W with pfc corrected)

I charge in 2x parallel 12s16p with contactor that make 2s2p pack or 4s1p pack

the charger is set to 50.4V ( 4.200V/cell) and i cut the current when I reach C/20 wich is the most common known and recommanded current cut off for lithium cells C/20 with 46Ah is 2.3A so i cut at 2.3A.

what is beautifull with this 1500W charger is that it have a overpower protection so if i charge at let say 50.0V, the current will be regulated to never output more than what the 120V input can take... ( around 2000W AC) with an output of 1700W DC. so the constant current step is regulated with the max power allowableat input..

Also when you store the battery for prolonged period like 1month or more, NEVER keep the cells 100% full.. that stress the cell!... keep them at around 3.7-3.9V.

I have over 120 cycles on my 2.3kWh pack and it still work fine.. but have loosed like 200Wh from the first cycle i did with...
not to mention that i also accidently overcharged it at 4.5V/cell last month!... but it still give me the Wh i need!

[youtube]y0BtGm5LAiM[/youtube]

Doc
 
Hi doctorbass,

would you recommend to buy these cells ( Sony/ Konion 1400 mah "V") ?
I am having a "local" offering on these (not taxes or duties) at approx 3$ /cell; is the lifecycle degradation of your usage exemplary for those cells ( so could used cells be allready down to mayor degradation) ?
 
dragonfire said:
Hi doctorbass,

would you recommend to buy these cells ( Sony/ Konion 1400 mah "V") ?
I am having a "local" offering on these (not taxes or duties) at approx 3$ /cell; is the lifecycle degradation of your usage exemplary for those cells ( so could used cells be allready down to mayor degradation) ?
I just paid about $0.60 a cell that were used from a forum member. I doubt paying an extra $2.40 a cell for new is worth it.
 
DoctorBass - Thanks for that, I'll design the charger based on those recommendations.

Is balancing neccesary when using large (16-18) paralleled strings? Or just have the paralleled strings at the same SOC when series-ed up?
 
Here is the specs .. that may help..

( tehre is an error in the technical performance data: at 1C discharge the Wh is 5.97.. not 3.97Wh
 

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Thanks for that - while I'm waiting for my cells to arrive, I designed a charge current cutoff device - it uses a LM393 comparator, and a Mosfet both as a switch and the current measurement shunt - push button start, auto off when the current decreases to the correct value, or if there is a power outage.

Adjustable between 100mA and 10A (!) - those comparators are very sensitive. Uses an IRF8010 (whose RDS ON I calculated to be 0.013 Ohms at 25 degrees celcius) - I deliberatly used a higher RDS component to make the unit more sensitive, but there really wasn't any need.
 
heathyoung said:
Thanks for that - while I'm waiting for my cells to arrive, I designed a charge current cutoff device - it uses a LM393 comparator, and a Mosfet both as a switch and the current measurement shunt - push button start, auto off when the current decreases to the correct value, or if there is a power outage.

Adjustable between 100mA and 10A (!) - those comparators are very sensitive. Uses an IRF8010 (whose RDS ON I calculated to be 0.013 Ohms at 25 degrees celcius) - I deliberatly used a higher RDS component to make the unit more sensitive, but there really wasn't any need.

nice!.. Will you post your desing and final charger project here?

Doc
 
Of course - I'm a big fan of open source...

I'm also working on a watts-up clone with a programmable LVC - designed to integrate with the shunt on the cyclone 180/360/500W Not sure if I'll do current/wattage limiting or not, depends how much space is left for code on the chip.
 
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