Lycra!

[Dee Jay]

My son and I took a brisk ride to the bicycle rental park again today so he can get his cycling on! It's about 21 kilometers roundtrip. We took the usual bike path having to go against some headwinds, and we came up behind a lycra racer sweating, huffing and puffing.

I'm usually not into pissing contests but I became curious with "drafting" so we got right up behind him for a bit. I felt no real difference in aerodynamics nor effort (how could I if I was pedaling lightly while using the throttle).

I'm not really fond of throttling and more prone to using PAS... (some of you might already know how I'm sweatin' my ass off this summer trying to keep up with my WOT PAS, 20"/408 motor, 52+ volt A123 packs @ 20amps. . .)

So I decided to pass him in order to use my PAS mode. I gave him a courtesy ring on my bell with a single *ding* but he was startled and wobbled bit. Maybe he didn't know I was behind him. I went on PAS mode and began to pass him with a slight nod/bow while pedaling furiously to keep up with my motor... and this asshole decided to yell in Japanese "Get the hell out of my way ! ! ! 1" so that the other cyclists down the road would think that I was the one yelling.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not averse to yelling at pedestrians and other cyclists, but only when my bell isn't effective or when someone ahead of me is doing something dangerous. But this jerk took offense to a single ring.

I guess ringing your bell at a wannabe racer is a serious insult, specially when sailing past him on 20" wheels, carrying a 3 year old and a duffle bag, with jazz blaring out of your speakers on a hot sticky day... whatever.

J

 

[vanilla ice]

Heh, theres asses anywhere you go. BTW just for future reference, how does one say that in japanese?

 

[Drunkskunk]

Lycra riders seem to have a problem with anyone passing them. I've been called an idiot (Possably true), a Damn kid (said by someone younger than me), an @$$hole (True, but they didn't know me that well), and a few other, more colorful expressions when passing them around here. Once the name calling starts, I consider it fair game to mess with them.

The Clyte is silent, and my schwinn had no exposed equipment, virtualy stealth, so I would pedal along, sitting upright, not even winded, and pretend i didn't hear the insult as I asked them dumb questions.
"Hey, does breathing hard like that realy help? maybe I should try it"
"You know, if you got a better bike, you might find it easier to ride this fast" - said to a guy on a carbon cannondale.
"Hey, i forgot to set my trip counter, do you know how far back ---- is?" -naming something 15 or 20 miles behind us
"Wow, you look tired. Want a beer? I think I have a few extra in the bag"
- Pull out a sandwich i was carring and start eating it, all while riding beside them. give them a friendly nod, and keep on going past them

 

[TylerDurden]

Some people are just askin for it.

Sandwich, LOL. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[dogman dan]

Next time the guy sees you and he's in his car, expect to get that beer back. Right between the shoulderblades at about 50 mph. :x

On my morning route, there are three girls who cover the whole path walking. Every morning my horn scares the shit out of em since they can't hear it over thier yakking. They are freindly with me, and I apologize for startling them, every single day.

 

[vanilla ice]

Lolzor @ DS, nice.

 

[Patriot]

You know, I have only one bit of advice to anyone who gets irked by someone else on the trail, regardless of what they are riding.

1. Aggravating the situation by rubbing it in, or providing a snide retort, can easily make things worse.

Keep in mind. A frame pump works just as well on an Ebike, as it does on a regular bike.

 

[gasfree]

I know that some of the riders are overly competitive. I am to a certain extent but I do stop and think why that person does what they do. I have been both complemented and insulted but I simply tell them would you rather deal with someone who smells really bad or you can't smell at all? I don't have showers at work so this the reason I do it this way. Don't like, don't say anything.

 

[DahonElectric]

My son and I took a brisk ride to the bicycle rental park again today so he can get his cycling on! It's about 21 kilometers roundtrip. We took the usual bike path having to go against some headwinds, and we came up behind a lycra racer sweating, huffing and puffing.

I'm usually not into pissing contests but I became curious with "drafting" so we got right up behind him for a bit. I felt no real difference in aerodynamics nor effort (how could I if I was pedaling lightly while using the throttle).

I'm not really fond of throttling and more prone to using PAS... (some of you might already know how I'm sweatin' my ass off this summer trying to keep up with my WOT PAS, 20"/408 motor, 52+ volt A123 packs @ 20amps. . .)

So I decided to pass him in order to use my PAS mode. I gave him a courtesy ring on my bell with a single *ding* but he was startled and wobbled bit. Maybe he didn't know I was behind him. I went on PAS mode and began to pass him with a slight nod/bow while pedaling furiously to keep up with my motor... and this asshole decided to yell in Japanese "Get the hell out of my way ! ! ! 1" so that the other cyclists down the road would think that I was the one yelling.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not averse to yelling at pedestrians and other cyclists, but only when my bell isn't effective or when someone ahead of me is doing something dangerous. But this jerk took offense to a single ring.

I guess ringing your bell at a wannabe racer is a serious insult, specially when sailing past him on 20" wheels, carrying a 3 year old and a duffle bag, with jazz blaring out of your speakers on a hot sticky day... whatever.

J

Then you should know the proper drafting etiquette! Here's why. The rear wheel of the front rider is sometimes the most expensive component of the bike. If paired spoked wheels are used and they sport SAPIM bladed spokes, which are very expensive per spoke wise than a regular spoke. And to realize the full extent of drafting, your front wheel and his rear wheel must be within less than 1/2 inch apart! See where I'm getting at. In the racing world, every rider is aware you're drafting behind him. This is called a "pace line".
In the cycling world, the rule of the road is, YOU MUST INITIATE an intention of drafting. By ringing the bell and asking the front rider for permission, you make him fully aware of you at the rear is the only nice and proper thing you can do. When you're drafting a front rider, you do not have a clear view of the front, only his rear brake and ass, especially his rear brake. Your only cue if he's stopping is when he's braking, so you'll keep a sharp eye on it, at least most racers do. Unfortunately, untrained racer wannabes look at someone's butt, so as soon as the front rider brakes hard and with the small gap between your front tire and his rear wheel, guess what you're gonna do next. You'll gonna clip and destroy his rear wheel. If you have a strong front wheel like an eZee, then you'll likely destroy his rear rim. What if that racer type in front of you runs a pair of Zip 404 or a set of Spinergy Carbon wheels? These guys will set you back about $1000! Who's going to be footing the bill then? You?

While you're drafting, the front rider is supposedly to peel off to the left hand side as you maintain speed and then the lead front rider will re-integrate into the rear of the pace line. You DO NOT PASS the front rider on the left especially running long. Running long means you are increasing speed to pass him, because it will take you longer to pass him rather than he would just by reducing speed, peel to the left and re-integrating into the rear pack as any proper person drafting would do. This introduces danger not only to you because you are taking someone's lane to pass him and you have to constantly look at front traffic and his bike in relation to yours so you don't clip his front.
Drafting etiquette is there to protect all riders.

Also, I'm not surprised if the front rider is really pissed, totally pissed. I would too! First of all, whether or not you're benefiting his draft or not, he's doing the grunt work for you because he's pacing you too. Why didn't you return the favour by offering yourself as a wind blocker since you've got a MOTOR as you know he's puffing and huffing and offer an equal time of drafting as a return favor?!?

If you don't know anything about drafting, don't draft behind someone. Learning to ride in a peloton and drafting is part of pro racing cycling and it takes a few rides to master the technique and make it safe.
Unfortunately, when normal people try it, they do it in an unsafe manner which not only endanger the front rider and also yourself.

If I know someone drafts me, which a lot do due to my speeds on the electric bike, I give a left hand signal and peel away from them slowly. I had the unfortunate experience of some idiot who did actually clipped and destroyed my rear carbon rim. He was just such a complete looser and unwilling to accept responsibility and not only that, couldn't even afford to buy me a new rear placement wheel.

 

[Lessss]

I seriously doubt he was within 4 feet of the lycra guy let alone half an inch.

 

[Anonymous]

.

 

[gasfree]

Well I have never drafted behind anyone with or without a motor, but thank you for clearing it up. I personally just use my bike to get from point a to point b as quick as possible. I try to be polite when I am going to pass by telling them I am going to pass on your left and I wait for the go ahead of the rider and then say thank you. For the most part it works well.

 

[DahonElectric]

I seriously doubt he was within 4 feet of the lycra guy let alone half an inch.

If he's not feeling the full advantage of drafting, I agree he's probably not close enough. Still, I wouldn't ride close to someone I have no full knowledge about. If I know I can pass him (you know because you have a motor), then quickly and nicely say you're passing him. If you draft behind him for awhile, who knows what he might think.
8)

 

[DahonElectric]

Well I have never drafted behind anyone with or without a motor, but thank you for clearing it up. I personally just use my bike to get from point a to point b as quick as possible. I try to be polite when I am going to pass by telling them I am going to pass on your left and I wait for the go ahead of the rider and then say thank you. For the most part it works well.

Things like this happens to me sometimes too as well. I don't get too mad or too worked up about it either. I figure that many of them came out riding due to high gas prices and never bother to take the "Canbike" (offered in Canada) course which does teach you proper road etiquette. If everyone takes a course on proper riding etiquette, incidents like this will lessen. Just like car drivers who need to go to driving school. You still get people like the front rider who will get mad for no reasons at all, because nobody likes being a wheel sucker. When we had the bus strike in Vancouver, BC, we had a lot of idiots riding on the road in total disregard of road safety. It was in this period of time that my rear carbon wheel got damaged by some TDF Lance Armstrong wannabe fan who didn't know how to draft properly behind me.

 

[Link]

Meh. I've never drafted anyone in my life ('cause it's not like I need to 8)), so I wouldn't know the rules. But I'm pretty sure I couldn't manage to keep a 1/2" gap between the wheels. I mean, srsly. I'd eat some serious crap if I were to try that kind of stunt...

When you're drafting a front rider, you do not have a clear view of the front, only his rear brake and ass

Reason #2 I don't need to draft anybody.

 

[Anonymous]

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[Link]

I was thinking the same thing when I saw that vid in your other thread. Especially when he was passing that one guy in black on the inside of that corner and almost pushed him off the trail.

 

[diver]

on my trike i have a set of air horns that play the calvary charge, I just tap the button to get a blast and if they don't move over i give them the whole the melody. they hate it but law says to alert people before passing and those skin tight riders have head phones and shit, they cant hear a thing. they do hear the air horns. the guys love to draft me cause the trike punches such a big hole but when I'm on the horns it will startle my buddy's also

 

[diver]

The lycras around here are the dangerous ones, they don't slow down when approaching small children, groups of people on a path, and pass in front of oncoming bikes, etc. I'm sure some pedestrians have been hit by them.

that is the same way here. they thing the road was made for them only. . the guys that draft me get pissed cause i stop at ALL stop signs and i slow down for walkers and children. If they want to draft they just have to put up with it. there is no way i want to hurt anyone because of speed or safety

 

[dogman dan]

Given where they were riding in the video, the manners there is to get off and out of the way of real DH riders. That was in europe for sure, and in the alps, it's a different world with liability lawsuits than in the US. The guy in black was cool with that pass, I'm sure of it. The behaviour is very similar to that on a double black diamond ski run in Taos. If you can't hack this run, stand on the side awhile. When skiing I found the traditional call of which side you were passing on just made em turn that way into your path. I used to do a bloodcurdling hoot that just froze em in place for the nanosecond I needed to pass em. Much like the whistleing dude. When I was learning to ski black diamonds I stayed out of the way of real skiers. Notice that the guys diving out of the way never dive to the inside of a corner. Bet they learn that the hard way fast on that trail.

 

[Anonymous]

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[Lessss]

Anyone did that to me after cracker #2 they'd no longer have kneecaps.

 

[swade]

Those two DH riders in the video were pretty much okay with the etiquette. Notice he mainly passed on the corners, very appropriate place pass as the speeds are a lot slower and there is more room for error. When riding on a trail like that, especially at ski hills with mtb biking, its proper etiquette to move off the side and let faster riders over take you.

 

[Dee Jay]

where's the delete post function?

 

[Dee Jay]

Hi DahonElectric, thanks for taking the effort to pass on the finer points of cycling etiquette, but it's not a question of etiquette. He obviously didn't know I was trying to draft him. For all he knew, I might've rolled up behind him that instant before ringing the bell.

Like Link, I have never drafted anyone before. Not in a car behind 18 wheelers. Definitely not during my Yamaha RD 400 riding days, that's just suicide. (I owned two RDs btw ) I didn't think it was that dangerous on bicycles. I drafted without permission because, not too long ago, a Lycra Rider drafted me without permission. He was so close behind me that I'm sure he was able to hear me humming to the music on my speakers. So I thought it was ok to just hitch-a-ride.

Something you need to know about manners in Tokyo... After living in Tokyo for several years I found that competition is so fierce, it's downright rude (to me). Not just in sports or the workplace but in nearly every aspect of their lives here. You'll have at least a few days in a week when someone is trying to show you up in some way, shape or form. This is something you'll never fully understand unless you've lived here. When it comes down to competing, all the manners and formalities that you've heard about that Japan is known for.. that is out the window. Or at least the rudeness is masked somehow. There are children at the playground younger than my son that try to block him from playing on the slide or swing for no apparent reason, and they threw a tantrum when they were told to share. Their parents couldn't possibly have taught these toddlers to compete . . . it is in their genes.

This wannabe racer threw a tantrum because of a single *ding* from some strange alien bike trying to pass, then he cried like a little b!tch, which you'll see a lot of in the olympics. After pulling that stunt of yelling at the other cyclists for me, why should I offer him to block his wind? At that point, the only thing I want to offer him was my middle finger but didn't because my son was with me.

J