Can i ask for some opinion regarding the MAC/BMC/Ezee geared motors? i've read some article between these 3 geared motors. Some articles says that BMC is better than MAC but base on MAC's efficiency curve and price, MAC is better than BMC, Also some article says that Ezee is better than BMC.
MAC/BMC/Ezee
- Thread starter mbs
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biohazardman
100 kW
Well I have a BMC so it has to be better than the others or why would I have bought it? ;^) Macs cost less, BMC posed to make more power 600-1000W and the Ezee is a 400W unit that costs near the same as the BMC. 
Different people say different things some talk about what they don't even have so it's hard to sort it all out sometimes. Neptronics has experience with the Macs, expect he will comment here, they had issues when I bought my BMC a couple years back. Not very impressed with the quality of machine werq on the axles of two of three BMCs I have but they are about the norm from what I have witnessed here on the sphere. I am happy with the performance of the V2S I have been running for near 6K now after I upgraded the phase wires. Improvements have been made, on the Macs so I am not sure just where they are right now. As far as the Ezee I does not have one and have not heard of issues so can't say. Justin sells them so I would guess they are acceptable or he would not do so.
Check this out for some info and get and idea of what they can do then decide what you need and check yer pocketbook then listen to some of the rants around here to get the rest of the story.
http://www.ebikes.ca/simulator/
Different people say different things some talk about what they don't even have so it's hard to sort it all out sometimes. Neptronics has experience with the Macs, expect he will comment here, they had issues when I bought my BMC a couple years back. Not very impressed with the quality of machine werq on the axles of two of three BMCs I have but they are about the norm from what I have witnessed here on the sphere. I am happy with the performance of the V2S I have been running for near 6K now after I upgraded the phase wires. Improvements have been made, on the Macs so I am not sure just where they are right now. As far as the Ezee I does not have one and have not heard of issues so can't say. Justin sells them so I would guess they are acceptable or he would not do so. Check this out for some info and get and idea of what they can do then decide what you need and check yer pocketbook then listen to some of the rants around here to get the rest of the story.
http://www.ebikes.ca/simulator/
IIIHorseman
100 mW
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
- Messages
- 46
I wanted to know the same thing. Also I am wrong, or that no mater what controller, if your running a 48v system, it seems like the ezee will never get past 25 mph on a flat surface. Plus where the heck can you get BMCs at a reasonable price? They seem to be at or exceed the ezee kit. The good things I've heard about Ezee are the reliability and warranty (2 years), which I believe is better than the other two.
StudEbiker
100 kW
IIIHorseman said:
A controller doesn't affect top speed, only raising the voltage will get the motor to spin faster.
DAND214
10 MW
I have had 2 BMC v1 and v1 with upgraded phase wires. Yhey run ok and are very much the same as the MAC. I sold the moddod V1 3 years ago, it's still running 36v 9fet comtroller with a top speed of 22mph 26" wheel.
The other BMC has the same setup and runs almost the same. it's haning in the garage since the wife likes the FS POS I put togeather. It's a Bafang 8FUN on 48v and it's just leagal.
Can't say anything about Ezee other than they are more money.
As for my MAC you will have a hard time to pry it out of my hands. What a ride, quiet and great low end torque. On 15s 4p lipo it will just make 40mph with a lot of help. 36 is easy, it's the last 4 mph are so hard to get.
That's just my experances, hope it helps.
Dan
The other BMC has the same setup and runs almost the same. it's haning in the garage since the wife likes the FS POS I put togeather. It's a Bafang 8FUN on 48v and it's just leagal.
Can't say anything about Ezee other than they are more money.
As for my MAC you will have a hard time to pry it out of my hands. What a ride, quiet and great low end torque. On 15s 4p lipo it will just make 40mph with a lot of help. 36 is easy, it's the last 4 mph are so hard to get.
That's just my experances, hope it helps.
Dan
So i guess it's a now a choice between Ezee and BMC. I wonder which of them is better in terms of efficiency, which can get me a longer range? I'm planning to operate at 48v. Since they're both small motors, how are they in terms of heat dissipation? DO any of you guys have problems with the BMC and ezee motors getting to hot?
Lebowski
10 MW
Where do you buy a BMC motor ? Is a BMC the same as a 'Bafang' ?
Lebowski said:
They are 2 different companies entirely, and the motors are not related either.
Ebikes-sf sells BMC.. so do a few other vendors. Cell_man is the MAC daddy and the main vendor.. he is also close to the company itself.
BMC and MAC geared motors are extremely similar, and MAC broke off of BMC a few years ago. They are surely "sharing" some of the same IP.. lol.
eZee is actually kinda similar to the MAC 350W motor.. maybe more like a cousin to the BMC and MAC motors than a brother tho. It's a good quality product, but isn't capable of the same kinda power as the larger motors.
Look at the date on the articles that you've read. At one point, the MACs were kinda second fiddle to the BMC, were always a generation or two behind.. but now this is no longer true.
I don't see how efficiency or power handling is any different. The stator of both motors is visually identical. Then at one point, BMC got a higher grade stator.. although ebikes-SF tested this and noted that the efficiency wasn't improved :/. MACs are getting improved stators as well. I should have one in my hands soon
The difference comes down to price more than anything these days. The MACs are almost half the cost. Some will say that the BMC is better constructed, but the MAC and BMC have experienced the same exact problems.
Lebowski
10 MW
but is BMC the same as bafang ?
o00scorpion00o
100 kW
The mac is also getting a much improved clutch that I hope to have soon.
The 8T is a monster motor for its size and my favourite motor and I can't wait to have it back. I ran way too much power through it so it was my fault, but hopefully this new clutch will take it.
But on 60 volts nominal, or 16S LiPo it will do 40 mph!
Heat was not an issue for me, it did get hot up a steep hill but it gets up them so fast it was never an issue, however my new stator will have a temp sensor so I can monitor it. Every motor should have one!
I'm getting new phase wires too, the old ones never got hot even at 2kw constant. It would be no harm to have better phase wires anyway.
I love the way the motor free wheels as I love to pedal a lot and it feels much more like a bicycle.
Direct drive motors can shed heat much better, so if you were climbing steep hills all the time I would recommend direct drive or a higher voted 10T mac. But the mac for its size and weight is amazing.
Ask cell-man if you can get the upgraded parts!
The 8T is a monster motor for its size and my favourite motor and I can't wait to have it back. I ran way too much power through it so it was my fault, but hopefully this new clutch will take it.
But on 60 volts nominal, or 16S LiPo it will do 40 mph!
Heat was not an issue for me, it did get hot up a steep hill but it gets up them so fast it was never an issue, however my new stator will have a temp sensor so I can monitor it. Every motor should have one!
I'm getting new phase wires too, the old ones never got hot even at 2kw constant. It would be no harm to have better phase wires anyway.
I love the way the motor free wheels as I love to pedal a lot and it feels much more like a bicycle.
Direct drive motors can shed heat much better, so if you were climbing steep hills all the time I would recommend direct drive or a higher voted 10T mac. But the mac for its size and weight is amazing.
Ask cell-man if you can get the upgraded parts!
mbs said:
I've heard of the eZee kits having similar problems as the BMC and MAC. Supposedly they are built of a higher quality than both. I've not heard of clutch and gear problems, then again the eZee are often run at such low power that it doesn't become a factor.
scorpion: DD motors may shed heat better, but on hills they tend to make more heat. Just going off a 'touch the cover' test, given the same situation / hill / speed, my MXUS/9C motor is often smoking hot and feeling boggy, whereas the MAC is just getting warm and not feeling boggy at all.
In a very small wheel, DDs do great, but they generally suck in larger wheels, when it comes to hill climbing and torque.
You've been spoiled by the magic pie. I hope you get a chance to test a 9C/MXUS diameter motor in a 26" wheel, and find out how cruddy it is
I'm running my MAC at 42A/57v nominal lately. That's 2500-2600w. I am surprised that i am not getting it hot. The 12FET controller is the only thing getting hot - the MAC is a controller torture device for sure.. lol.
o00scorpion00o
100 kW
neptronix said:scorpion: DD motors may shed heat better, but on hills they tend to make more heat. Just going off a 'touch the cover' test, given the same situation / hill / speed, my MXUS/9C motor is often smoking hot and feeling boggy, whereas the MAC is just getting warm and not feeling boggy at all.
In a very small wheel, DDs do great, but they generally suck in larger wheels, when it comes to hill climbing and torque.
You've been spoiled by the magic pie. I hope you get a chance to test a 9C/MXUS diameter motor in a 26" wheel, and find out how cruddy it is
I'm running my MAC at 42A/57v nominal lately. That's 2500-2600w. I am surprised that i am not getting it hot. The 12FET controller is the only thing getting hot - the MAC is a controller torture device for sure.. lol.
Yes, the mac can spin much faster than a dd motor and so it produces more power than heat.
I had a conhismotor 1000 watt motor, it was a fast wind but not much torque, but I ran it only on 20 amps so not fair to compare it to the mac or pie.
Is the conhismotor similar to the 9C/mxus ? I remember it got fairly warm only on 20 amps 48 volts, so if the 9C is anything like it or the crystalyte hs or ht then I would not like to see them at 40 amps. The pie mostly runs cool.
As for the controller getting hot with the mac, never a problem for me!
o00scorpion00o said:
I believe it is, DD motors of that diameter tend to all have the same stator. Maybe you weren't feeding it enough amps and it was dropping out of it's efficiency band, like if you were climbing a hill? I could get mine hot running 36A on 36v when i hit some hills. If it's a front motor, i believe it has a narrower stator too. I thought it was a pretty wimpy motor. Not awful... just can't put out the power like the MAC or magic pie does
o00scorpion00o said:
Well, i also run mine inside my falconEV bag. So that's my bad.
But it definitely gets notably hotter than when it's driving a DD.
o00scorpion00o
100 kW
neptronix said:I believe it is, DD motors of that diameter tend to all have the same stator. Maybe you weren't feeding it enough amps and it was dropping out of it's efficiency band, like if you were climbing a hill? I could get mine hot running 36A on 36v when i hit some hills. If it's a front motor, i believe it has a narrower stator too. I thought it was a pretty wimpy motor. Not awful... just can't put out the power like the MAC or magic pie does
I noticed it was fairly warm, not hot but warmer than the mac or pie and that was on level ground.
neptronix said:
That is strange, I never had hot phase wires with the mac either even after a 40 mph blast for 10 miles, strange.
I wonder if the 1.6 continental sport contacts have anything to do with things running cooler ? they are noticeably easier and faster to pedal !
My phase wires have never been hot either. Only the controller gets hot when suffocated in a bag.
I am 6 ft, 240lbs and less um.. gravimetrically and aerodynamically ideal than most riders
Tire friction really doesn't make a huge difference in your power consumption. Not when aero drag is causing the power usage per MPH to be hundreds of percents higher.
It makes a difference in pedaling only because well.. our legs are like 200 watt motors... anything will make a difference. Putting on some stupid looking spandex, getting a carbon fiber bike, and running $1000 a piece aero wheels helps when you only have 200 watts.. :lol:
I am 6 ft, 240lbs and less um.. gravimetrically and aerodynamically ideal than most riders
Tire friction really doesn't make a huge difference in your power consumption. Not when aero drag is causing the power usage per MPH to be hundreds of percents higher.
It makes a difference in pedaling only because well.. our legs are like 200 watt motors... anything will make a difference. Putting on some stupid looking spandex, getting a carbon fiber bike, and running $1000 a piece aero wheels helps when you only have 200 watts.. :lol:
o00scorpion00o
100 kW
Sometimes I think I would like to convert a recumbent. A good one with a suspension, 3 wheels.
We also need better aerodynamics!
wind is a bitch, especially in a windy place like this!!!
We also need better aerodynamics!
wind is a bitch, especially in a windy place like this!!!
DAND214
10 MW
I run mine at 35a/57 nominal with 26 x 2.125 tires. All that power thru a 6 fet 75 phase 35a battery. I droppped the battery to 30a today to see the differance. It ran fine but had a growl/misfire at 10 to 14 mph. Back to 35a and it's fine? Mac 8t 15s4p lipo runs great. I've been carrying a 12 fet controller now for a couple weeks. The controller gets warm but is heatsinked in the frame of my BlackComb.
back to Ezee and BMC, it seems talking MAC is not interesting OP.
It's the same as a BMC maybe better as you can get what you want, from 6t to a mild 12t. With supper support from Cell_Man.
I want another one but $$$ is a little tight.
Just want you to know the MAC motor is not made by APPLE! If that was a turn off :lol:
Dan
DAND214
10 MW
It's custom home built. if you read about THUD or Methods mini might 6 fet. That's is what I have Irfb4110 fets with braid beefed up traces. I see peaks of 65amps on the CA 22 to 2500watts under heavy power but it comes down quick. Longest 30mph+ ride is maybe 2 miles. Other I'm just cruising 15 to 20mph taking in the view. And a lot slower if I get behind a skater, now that the weather is getting WARMER.
The controller is heatsinked real good as it sits tightly between two amuminum frame seat supports. It gets warm but not hot. I even have it wrapped in black duct tape to hide it.
I carry a 12 fet just incase. If I stop carrying it, then it will pop.
Dan
The controller is heatsinked real good as it sits tightly between two amuminum frame seat supports. It gets warm but not hot. I even have it wrapped in black duct tape to hide it.
I carry a 12 fet just incase. If I stop carrying it, then it will pop.
Dan
DAND214
10 MW
It's still running.
So today I tried cutting down the powr, 20 battery and 50a phase. It was so weak I almost got off and pushed it. What I also noticed was that the WH/MI was not as good as the 35a 75 phase. It still got warm, maybe more than when higher.
Macs like power, I think. Peak amp draw was 35 compaired to the 65 I normally see.
Dan
DAND214 said:
You were running it below it's efficiency curve and it was making more heat than power, that is the reason.
6T requires tons and tons of amps and not many volts. Yeah, you really need a 12FET for that baby, minimum.
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