Magicshine GeoManGear

[georgefromvt]

Last summer I purchased two Magicshine bike lights. The lights worked great but recently the company recalled the batteries d/t potential fires. They asked for patience because they are a "small company and constrained by the cost and supply of new batteries. Replacement batteries will be sent in phases as new inventory shipments are obtained...we ask for your patience and understanding." I understand the replacement will take time but last week they sent me an email offering to sell brand new batteries but at discount! Maybe I'm not looking at this right; I understand recalls but think it's poor customer service to offer discounts on new batteries while existing customers wait for their recalled batteries to be sent.

 

[StudEbiker]

Yeah, that's pretty rude for sure.

 

[neptronix]

Remember, these lights are sold at a cut rate price in the first place..

If this were a Chinese operation, they'd never recall anything, they'd just keep selling the same product under different names.

You still have a working battery, right?

 

[auraslip]

LoL, your battery might explode. You should buy a new one!

Trashy.

BTW, the magic shine people told me that it can run at 12v. Has anyone confirmed this?

 

[biohazardman]

I heard the same about 12V so hooked one up to a DC to DC putting out a bit more than 12V on the bike I gave my brother. The light comes on with the motor switch so is on when ever the bike is powered up. He ran it for 30+ days of ten mile drives commuting, as well as many more miles of trips to the store and for pleasure, it is still ticking so I would think they can take it. I still run mine with the original exploding battery pack that is now two years young and I have as yet no problems with it. I do watch it closely though.

 

[biohazardman]

Geoman is the only one I have seen that recalled the batts everybody else just kept selling them although I have not checked in the last couple of months to see if that is still the case. Don't know what to tell you I have not had a problem but a few have. Hope you are able to work things out. His prices and service were great.

 

[Evoforce]

I agree, prices and service have been great. +1 on using my battery till the new one arrives. +1 on this vender doing the recall in the first place and being honest about it. +1 on China being more complicated in handling anything like this. Don't buy the battery at discount if you don't want it. Buy the battery if you want a spare! George, I take it you are not powered by Hobby King Lipo as your main pack, otherwise you would have already crossed this risk taking threshold.

 

[boostjuice]

If anyone does get sent a replacement "safe" battery pack, or buys a newer kit with a supposedly "safe" battery pack, can you please open it up and look for a 2S Balancing circuit (If your unsure what to look for, just post some photos). I've opened up my MJ-808 model battery pack to confirm that no such essential circuitry exists to protect the 2S2P set of LiCoO2 cells. These models are slightly newer than the older model shrink wrapped packs in that they feature Alloy cased battery packs with the voltage readout like this V V V

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mj-808-ha-iii-ssc-p7-c-sxo-3-mode-900-lumen-led-bike-light-set-44459

BTW: Magicshine is now making a single light-head MJ-808E "1000 lumen" kit with a new more efficient 100Lm/W Cree XM-LT60 emitter (~43% more lumens per watt compared with the pre-existing 70Lm/W SSC P7-C-SXO emitter used in the earlier models).

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mj-808...e-1000-lumen-led-bike-light-set-4x18650-57100

Also note another new battery case... maybe these finally have the essential circuitry inside

 

[boostjuice]

Thinking about it some more, rather than Magicshine incorporating a balancing circuit in their new battery packs, they could have chosen the option of migrating to a 'self-balancing' Manganese Spinal cell chemistry (LiMn04/LiMnCoO2). Although It would be hard to tell if this was the case unless it was printed on the cells shrinkwrap (same nominal voltage).

 

[georgefromvt]

Remember, these lights are sold at a cut rate price in the first place..

If this were a Chinese operation, they'd never recall anything, they'd just keep selling the same product under different names.

You still have a working battery, right?

No, I do not have a working battery. Replacement batteries are only sent after you return the original battery or send a signed voucher from the recycler. Radio shack was kind enough to recycle the original battery and sign the voucher. At present, I do not have a replacement battery. I just hope I get it before August, our Vermont summers are very short.

 

[rscamp]

Why not power your MagicShine (or any other light) with your motor battery? Once you buy an appropriate DC-DC converter and wire it up, no more fiddling and fussing with separate lighting batteries! Every motor battery charge refreshes your lighting battery with no additional effort...

 

[ebent]

Like rscamp, I power all accesories with a 12v converter. My trike never needs a, aa, or aaa batery ever. One less thing to think about. I ran the 12v to a circuit board and anything that is 12v goes to the board. I run a head light, tail light, cigarette lighter for charging iphone, and a 100w motorcycle stereo. On the rare occasion I want to go for a very long ride, I simply turn off the stereo and minimize any other use.

 

[sangesf]

OR....
You can run them off of a 12v 20ah lifepo4 battery like I do.
I use it to run, 100w front lamp, 55w rear lamp, 40w Directionals, 500w sub amp and all my other 12v accessories, including my cigarette lighter port.

 

[boostjuice]

I use these lights on non electric bikes as well, so a safe working battery pack is a necessity to me.

So I did some more digging, and found info that I thought you other guys would have already posted yourselves....right on the GeoManGear website.

So it seems that as to the new "safe" battery packs that GeoManGear was eluding too, he's getting a 3rd party US company to build his own properly engineered replacement packs in the USA. So it looks like Shenzhen Minjun Electronic Co., Ltd.aka the 'Magicshine' factory doesn't give a $hit about safety concerns raised by GeoManGear, and are still supplying the same dubious packs despite at least three reported fires. (makes sense really, these sorts of low numbers of incidents would be accepted by most companies as acceptable losses, not warranting a redesign)

You can read all about it on the GeoGearMan website.

RECALL INFORMATION:

Hazard: Mismatched lithium-ion battery cells can cause the battery to overheat, posing a fire hazard to consumers.

Incidents/Injuries: There have been three reported incidents causing fires and property damage. There have been no reported personal injuries.

http://www.geomangear.com/index.php?main_page=page&id=17

The [new] battery pack is UN/DOT transportation tested, features Panasonic Li-ion battery cells, includes a “smart” protection circuit board with both charging termination and charging temperature control features, and comes in a functional, V-0 rated hard plastic housing. These extra features are usually only found in expensive smart chargers and help preserve the life and safety features of the battery pack.

http://www.geomangear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4_45&products_id=275

 

[rscamp]

Like rscamp, I power all accesories with a 12v converter. My trike never needs a, aa, or aaa batery ever. One less thing to think about. I ran the 12v to a circuit board and anything that is 12v goes to the board. I run a head light, tail light, cigarette lighter for charging iphone, and a 100w motorcycle stereo. On the rare occasion I want to go for a very long ride, I simply turn off the stereo and minimize any other use.

We recumbent trike riders are clever...

 

[RVD]

I have this battery as well. As far as I know, I actually believe that that reason for this recall is that the battery pack gets very hot and can get so hot that the nylon casing gets on fire. If you use this battery carefully (where it's well ventilated, etc.) and you consider getting a more fireproof case for it (e.g. lipo sack type of thing), the unit should be fine.

 

[Diamondback]

Why not power your MagicShine (or any other light) with your motor battery? Once you buy an appropriate DC-DC converter and wire it up, no more fiddling and fussing with separate lighting batteries! Every motor battery charge refreshes your lighting battery with no additional effort...

that's what im doing with mine.
i got a custom 8.4V DC-DC converter made by ebikes.ca and use that to power the magicshine from the main 48V pack.

i learned later that the magicshine headlight (MJ-816) can run from voltages up to 16V, so i could have just got the 12V
converter instead, but didn't discover that until after i had already ordered and paid for it.

almost all of my lighting on the bike runs from the main 48V battery.
only my red helmet light and a small brake light run from AAA power.

Jason.

 

[adrian_sm]

I have mine running at 5.5V from a RC ESC BEC. Works a treat.

The LED on the back of the light head shine RED, and it is not quite running at full brightness, but you can't get much simplier.

- Adrian

 

[boostjuice]

I have this battery as well. As far as I know, I actually believe that that reason for this recall is that the battery pack gets very hot and can get so hot that the nylon casing gets on fire. If you use this battery carefully (where it's well ventilated, etc.) and you consider getting a more fireproof case for it (e.g. lipo sack type of thing), the unit should be fine.

The only reason for the battery pack's cells to get this hot during the charging process is due to an imbalance in state of charge (SOC) between series cell groups. The standard charger is 8.4V CC/CV (2-stage charge profile: Constant Current > Constant Voltage) as would be an expected match for the battery pack that is built as a 2S2P 3.7V nominal LiCoO2 cell configuration. If during charging, one parallel pair of cells reaches 100% (SOC) well before the other pair, then a situation can occur where you have greater than the intended 4.2V maximum charge voltage across the higher SOC parallel pair, whilst total series charge voltage is increasing steadily toward 8.4V CV. This means you could end up with....say..... the lower SOC 2P cells @ 3.8V whilst the already fully charged parallel pair are forced to a level nearing (8.4V - 3.8V) = 4.6V
As the cells are already full, this extra energy being pumped into them is dissipated as heat. If they get hot enough, thermal runaway can occur. I seriously doubt that anything less than true thermal runaway would cause the battery pack casing to ignite and start a serious fire.

Well matched cells (Internal resistance and capacity) are far less likely to become unbalanced during charge/discharge cycling, particularly under moderate rates of discharge consumption (not discharging beyond ~80% of total capacity). It's when deep discharge regimes occur that unmatched cells in particular can become seriously unbalanced and start to suffer significant drift in relative SOC. Compounding of such imbalance can occur through repeated deep discharge cycling, further inducing the likelihood of thermal runaway.

The inclusion of a BMS balancing circuit with every battery pack would mean that imbalances could be corrected with every charge cycle. Unfortunately, penny-pinching Chinese companies resist such an added cost if it is not an ABSOLUTE NECESSITY for the short > medium term reliability of the product. Despite this shortfall, I am still impressed at the value for money of these Magicshine light kits. However I would happily pay up to an extra 10 bucks (well more than would be needed) for the inclusion of such a cheap but fundamental safety feature. After all, even with this added production cost, the light-sets would still be significantly cheaper than the vast majority of competitors in its performance category.

 

[rscamp]

that's what im doing with mine.
i got a custom 8.4V DC-DC converter made by ebikes.ca and use that to power the magicshine from the main 48V pack.

i learned later that the magicshine headlight (MJ-816) can run from voltages up to 16V, so i could have just got the 12V
converter instead, but didn't discover that until after i had already ordered and paid for it.

almost all of my lighting on the bike runs from the main 48V battery.
only my red helmet light and a small brake light run from AAA power.

Jason.

FYI

One of these can be set to any voltage using a computer I/F: http://www.castlecreations.com/products/ccbec.html

 

[Diamondback]

FYI

One of these can be set to any voltage using a computer I/F: http://www.castlecreations.com/products/ccbec.html

those would be useful for people running lower voltage systems.
i checked the specs, and it says maximum input is 25V. no good for me, im running 48V (close to 60V fresh off the charger.

Jason.

 

[auraslip]

those would be useful for people running lower voltage systems.
i checked the specs, and it says maximum input is 25V. no good for me, im running 48V (close to 60V fresh off the charger.

I have one 72v to 12v dc-dc left. I'll order more in a bit, and this time I'll get 72v to 5v as well.
12v seems easier to work with because they're so many automotive assecories you can use. A lot of LED stuff uses 5v though. If the magic shine works at 12v, maybe 5v isn't the way to go.
What do most people here use?

Also, Lyen sells a 5v dc-dc for $15. It's only rated at 3a though. Whats the amp draw on the magic shine?

 

[ebent]

The kiss method demands 12v. As mentioned, most bling can be had in 12v. When pluging in to the cigarette lighter to charge the iphone there is a second conversion of volts happening. I think it is 5 volts. It works.

 

[docnjoj]

I've run my Magicshine on 13 volts from Lyen's converter for about 6 months now with no problens at all. I think DocBass said it can run on 8-18 volts. Wonderful devices!
otherDoc

 

[Diamondback]

What's the amp draw on the magic shine?

the current draw will vary with the voltage fed to the light.
on 8.4V it's around 2A on the highest setting. as the input voltage rises (within the light's acceptable voltage range)
the current drawn will decrease.

i have not actually measured the current draw, but that isn't too hard to do.

Jason.