need help identifying battery pack LifePo4 ?

[bikeelectric]

I acquired this pack from someone and the charger was junk . It is 60 volt pack . I want to split it up to be able to use new 308 Icharger Duo I just got. But I am not sure on battery chemistry -- thought he said it was LifePo4 cells but they look like LiPo cells you would see in laptop pack. I also am not sure on the configuration. Two 7 wire balance cables.
How do I tell ? I opened up BMS to look for clues .
Thanks
Larry

 

[amberwolf]

Actual cell voltages?
Number of cells in series?
original charger's labelled voltage?

 

[Syonyk]

Whoof. If you have the charger, check it's voltage - that's going to be the easiest path here, unless there are some labels on the cells.

It looks like it's 16P, and with the dual layers, 16S.

16S packs claiming 60v are *probably* 3.7v cells (59.2v nominal, 67.2v fully charged) - so "not LiFePO4."

LiFePO4 at 3.2v/cell in a 16S pack would be typically sold as a 48v pack (51v nominal), or... something like that. But, fully charged, at 3.65v, that'd be 58.4v, which could be rounded up.

What's the current voltage on the pack?

Beyond that, you'd pretty much have to see if it acted "full" around 3.65v/cell (rapid voltage rise as you push more current into it), or "hungry" - that's right in the middle for most other lithium chemistries, and they'll soak current with very little voltage rise.

 

[bikeelectric]

I think I figured out that it is 16s 16p . The voltage is nothing so the pack is probably no good. But I will try charging it up and see if anything comes back to life. I can charge it to 48v lifepo4 and that should be okay even if it is li-ion or lipo cells right ? There are no markings of any kind on the cells. Since I got this for free not too worried if it comes back to life or not.

I also have 4 duct taped packs that are half the size of the one pictured above, but have not cut them open yet. Two of those have stickers on them that say 30v 20ah 10s20p and they have connectors to series connect them so that must be the 60v pack - the large one pictured above may be 48v.

The charger I got with it is in Chinese and I am going to have someone translate it for me. Only thing I can read on it is 60v .
These are photos of smaller pack stickers and charger

 

[Syonyk]

The voltage is nothing so the pack is probably no good. But I will try charging it up and see if anything comes back to life.

Woah, there... back up.

There's no voltage on the pack at all? Like, well below about 2.0v per cell (so 32v bulk)?

Lithium chemistries are physically damaged by being fully discharged, and are not safe to recharge from that point.

 

[amberwolf]

I think I figured out that it is 16s 16p .

Well, 60v/16(s) is 3.75v, which is too high for LiFePo4, and too low for other lithium chemistries.

So either that charger doesn't go with that pack, or that 60v isn't the actual end-of-charge voltage, or it's set higher than I would expect for LiFePO4 (and would definitely not be for a 16s pack of other lithium chemistries).

The voltage is nothing so the pack is probably no good.

So every cell is at 0V?

If so, then the pack will never be what it was. But if it is LiFePO4 and was drained very slowly over time, it might be recoverable for lower-capacity and lower-c-rate uses. (lighting packs, etc).

But I will try charging it up and see if anything comes back to life.

If it is truly at 0V, you should charge it very very slowly.

I can charge it to 48v lifepo4 and that should be okay even if it is li-ion or lipo cells right ?

Remember that "full" per-cell voltage of LiFePO4 is pretty much "empty" for the other chemistries. You'll need to know (or figure out) which chemistry it is before you use it, or you will probably end up damaging it.

 

[bikeelectric]

okay - it wasn't zero but it was under 1 volt so not much. Yes I know it may not be recoverable but worth a try. I was hoping someone maybe has seen this type of cell in a pack before and may have known.

I thought since the charger says 60v it could be that is close to the 58v a 48v LiFePo4 needs to charge. But it could be for the other 30v battery packs in series. I just had it translated and nothing on the label of it gives any more information about what battery type would be.

From what I understand though I could treat the large battery pack pictured in original post as LiFePo4 to try and get a charge in them and see what happens.
If I do try to charge the big battery pack I think I should do each section one at a time to see if it will hold charge - and I will probably do it in a fire proof location !

The smaller packs have some voltage to them so aren't in such bad shape . Here is a photo of one with meter showing it at 28.5 volts

 

[Syonyk]

Plug the charger in, stick the voltmeter on it's leads. You'll get it's no-load voltage, which is going to be what it tops the battery to.

 

[bikeelectric]

Plug the charger in, stick the voltmeter on it's leads. You'll get it's no-load voltage, which is going to be what it tops the battery to.

good idea - will give that a try next time I get the chance. I think the smoke may have come out of that cheap charger though. Won't be able to try this out until next weekend.

 

[999zip999]

Play with it outside. Outside the house and outside the garage. Maybe inside a barbeque. I know you will start charging it and will have to walk away. That's when bad things happen. It's like watching paint dry. Not very exciting.

 

[tmho]

I think I figured out that it is 16s 16p . The voltage is nothing so the pack is probably no good. But I will try charging it up and see if anything comes back to life. I can charge it to 48v lifepo4 and that should be okay even if it is li-ion or lipo cells right ? There are no markings of any kind on the cells. Since I got this for free not too worried if it comes back to life or not.

I also have 4 duct taped packs that are half the size of the one pictured above, but have not cut them open yet. Two of those have stickers on them that say 30v 20ah 10s20p and they have connectors to series connect them so that must be the 60v pack - the large one pictured above may be 48v.

The charger I got with it is in Chinese and I am going to have someone translate it for me. Only thing I can read on it is 60v .
These are photos of smaller pack stickers and charger

Below is my translation of the Chinese, hope it is helpful:
WARNING
HIGH VOLTAGE INSIDE, DO NOT OPEN
- INPUT: 110VAC/50Hz
- OUPUT: SUITABLE FOR 60V BATTERY PACK
- RED LIGHT INDICATES POWER ON, YELLOW INDICATES CHARGING, GREEN LIGHT INDICATES FULLY CHARGED
- CONFIRM INPUT AND OUTPUT ARE MATCHING
- CONFIRM OUTPUT POLARITIES ARE MATCHING
- NO COVERING WHILE CHARGING, KEEP OFF FROM RAIN

 

[bikeelectric]

thank you for the translation !

 

[dogman dan]

It's done, other than playing with it for educational purposes. Or use as a crappy, low capacity emergency power supply for when the power goes out. break into 12v sections to run 12v stuff off grid. Low rate use, like charging a computer or phone, run a light, etc.

My guess is also that it's not lifepo4 One of the chemistries that charges to 4.2v per cell more likely.