Need help with Lyen controller

[fiddlerpaul]

Thanks for the video. That clarified the whole polarity thing.

Ok I have an analog and digital meter.

With the digital now, I set it at 200. With no connectivity to start with it shows 84. When connecting to all the phase wires from both poles it shows about 47.

With the analog meter, I set it to 10. It starts at infinity and for all the tests it drop to about 8.5.

I hope those both make sense. If I had to trust any I would trust the digital meter, as it's newer. Are those results good? If so what next?
I"m going to do a little more direct wiring test today, taking out the alligator clips.

 

[Ykick]

How are the batteries in those meters?

My meter has a diode function on 2k scale used in the video. I don't see the same readings on the 200 scale.

 

[fiddlerpaul]

The digital is new...just put it in, so I'll forget about the other one.

Went to 2000 setting and it starts around 864 and goes to about 720-35 on all of them.

 

[Ykick]

The digital is new...just put it in, so I'll forget about the other one.

Went to 2000 setting and it starts around 864 and goes to about 720-35 on all of them.

both directions/polarity?

 

[fiddlerpaul]

I just discovered something that might be useful.

As I said before the throttle only works for a few seconds, then you have to turn it off before it will respond again for a few seconds. I discovered that if you do this 3-4 times in succession it then stops responding. Then to get it to respond again you have to spin the wheel, even a few inches backward, to get the throttle to work again.

 

[fiddlerpaul]

The digital is new...just put it in, so I'll forget about the other one.

Went to 2000 setting and it starts around 864 and goes to about 720-35 on all of them.

both directions/polarity?

Yes, doing it as in the video on all tests it's the same reading roughly.

 

[fechter]

You said the motor is hard to turn with the controller disconnected?

Quick and dirty way to test phase wires is to disconnect controller and spin wheel while noting the resistance to turning.
Then try connecting any two phase wires and repeat test. Repeat test with all combinations of phase wires. Every time the phase wires are connected, the motor should be very difficult to turn. With all disconnected, it should spin freely.

Also, inside the controller, where you can't easily see it, there should be a status LED on the board that will blink a code. When the controller cuts off, the code will tell you why the controller shut off in most cases.

 

[greg176]

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=19612

 

[fiddlerpaul]

The comment about it being hard to turn when controller disconnected before was because I didn't realize two of the phase wires from the motor were touching.

The actual reality when I do the test you say is that the wheel is slightly harder to turn with controller connected vs not connected.

I think I will leave the opening up the controller bit to the expert guy I'm bringing in on this tomorrow. I'm sure he will be able to make much better use of all this information.

 

[greg176]

In case you didn't read the link. Lyen says about this controller "Caution: You are entering the midsized motorcycle territory with this controller. The controller is designed for electric motorcycle application only, it has enough current to heat up and melt the motor phase wires of most electric bike hub motors. "

 

[Ykick]

In case you didn't read the link. Lyen says about this controller "Caution: You are entering the midsized motorcycle territory with this controller. The controller is designed for electric motorcycle application only, it has enough current to heat up and melt the motor phase wires of most electric bike hub motors. "

Seriously, this is like bringing an ICBM to an indoor shooting range. I keep getting drawn back in and trying but you've been right all along greg176, OP is barking up the wrong controller.

I made part 2 of my testing phase power MOSFETs using the 200 and 20k range on my DMM. Depending on the meter and ranges selected there can be wide ranging results. But the bottom line is that there was never any dead short measured to the battery leads.

[youtube]ezTYcY-hZOU[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezTYcY-hZOU&feature=youtu.be

 

[fiddlerpaul]

Yes if it never goes to zero I should be good right?

Are you saying this controller is too much for my motor by default? Or that it will be too finicky to make it work because it's so powerful?

 

[greg176]

Absolutely under no circumstances should you you ever use this controller on your motor. It will melt your motor, burn your battery, and fry your BMS. Could be what the cutting out is , over current on your BMS. You also should be able to sell that controller for a few hundred dollars. Should get a 6 FET controller. Price on those starts at about $40.

 

[amberwolf]

With the digital now, I set it at 200. With no connectivity to start with it shows 84.

If you have it set to ohms, with no connection between the leads, and it shows any reading other than the "infinite" reading (whatever that particular meter uses to indicate infinite, often a -1 but you'll need to check it's instructions), then the meter is not working correctly and it's readings can't be trusted.

It could just be a bad battery (even new ones often have low batteries from sitting in warehouses/stores/etc for long periods before being purchased, or just being cheaply made).

Then to get it to respond again you have to spin the wheel, even a few inches backward, to get the throttle to work again.

That indicates that the controller either has a phase that cannot drive the motor, or that it is not receiving one or more of the hall signals form the motor.

This can mean that there is a connection problem between the motor and the controller's internal board where the wires solder to it, (could be anywhere along the wire length or at the connector if there is one), on a hall or a phase wire.

Or it can mean there is a FET in the controller that is not outputting a drive signal for whatever reason.


Any of these could cause the controller to be unable to either sense where the motor is exactly and so not be allowed to try to turn it, or to be unable to drive one of the phases of the motor and the remaining phases unable to move the motor from it's present position.

Are you saying this controller is too much for my motor by default?

Yes, this has been said in different ways, multiple times, by different people, in this thread, though you haven't responded to us about that until now. If you can program the controller for much lower phase currents, and make sure any 'block time" it has is set so it can't give high continuous startup currents, it might be useable with the motro if you are easy on the throttle, but if you hammer the throttle it'll probably cook the motor under load--how soon, couldn't say, but I'd guess not long.

 

[fiddlerpaul]

Greg said it clearly "under no circumstances use this controller'
I guess that got the message through to me. Saying it was overkill didn't quite express it as clearly. I was willing to go with overkill just because it's what I have to work with.
But if it's actually a threat to the system working that's another thing.
Maybe my friends friend can ascertain if it is truly functional and then I should look into selling it.

 

[fiddlerpaul]

So my friend wasn't as skilled as I thought. He's more of a mechanical guy.

I am probably going to buy a smaller controller from GRIN.

I am interested in selling the big controller. Any ideas the best way to sell it? Is anyone interested here? I'm pretty sure it hasn't been damaged. Edward reassured me that there is protection inside. This is what he said:
"From your video, I believe it may not be the MOSFET (high power transistor > there 24 of them on a 24 FET controller) failure inside the controller since the controller is equipped with a protection circuitry that prevents it from running when it sense shorted MOSFETs. I still think it may have to do with pairing."

How much do you guys think I could ask for it?

 

[Ykick]

Major problem you’ll have selling this controller with a clear conscience for an amount close to what it “might” be worth is that you really don’t know if it’s truly functional or not?

These are performance hot rod controllers so if I were buying and aware of the problems you’ve been having I’d worry it’s been buggered in some way or another? Under that scenario, ‘don’t think it would bring much more than “parts/not-working” item?

Maybe it’s fully operational? Or maybe somebody passed along an as yet unknown problem to you? Since you’re unable to demonstrate that it works, it’s all just words and “hope” at this point.

Perhaps return it to Edward and allow him to correct the shit wiring and give it a clean bill of health? He’s very reasonable with his repair work and shipping charges. Plus having it fully checked out and assured in good working order by the creator, it’s much more likely to bring 60-90% of new retail, IMO.

A new, properly sized controller is an excellent idea but you’re going to face a similar struggle determining Phase power - Hall sensor combination.