New Crystalyte Motor series (HT35 / HS35 and HT24 / HS24)

[bikesport1000]

please excuse me for the question...but what's the maximum KW that HT3525 can handle?
I'm planning to use 100V battery and 50A controller...

I have read that the saturation point of the stator is around 10KW but anything over 2-3KW (depending on ambient temps) will need to be thermally monitored to prevent overheating. 5KW will definately need monitoring as others have cooked the windings on less power than that.

I would also be more carefull on the HT than on the HS, because the HT certainly has more but thinner windings.

 

[fractal]

please excuse me for the question...but what's the maximum KW that HT3525 can handle?
I'm planning to use 100V battery and 50A controller...

I have read that the saturation point of the stator is around 10KW but anything over 2-3KW (depending on ambient temps) will need to be thermally monitored to prevent overheating. 5KW will definately need monitoring as others have cooked the windings on less power than that.

lfp wrote somewhere on this thread that its 7.5KW anything more results in heat.

 

[fractal]

please excuse me for the question...but what's the maximum KW that HT3525 can handle?
I'm planning to use 100V battery and 50A controller...

I have read that the saturation point of the stator is around 10KW but anything over 2-3KW (depending on ambient temps) will need to be thermally monitored to prevent overheating. 5KW will definately need monitoring as others have cooked the windings on less power than that.

lfp wrote somewhere on this thread that its 7.5KW anything more results in heat.

there it is (it was in the modding the HS 3540 thread http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=31240

«We did a full custom re-wind, upgraded to ceramic bearings, CNC milled dicks into the side covers, and fit 7awg phase leads through. No matter how much power you put into one, you can't exceed 10hp out. If you plan on hotrodding, throwing more than ~7.5kw at that hub just makes more heat but zero additional power output.

We tried to find the saturation point on a 5304 hub, but we smoked it before we even got to get decent data off it. :'(»

 

[DimGr]

using the simulator of ebike.ca,results are the following:

Mtr Torque 45.8N-m
Mtr Power 2561W
Load 2535W
Efficiency 81.6%

question is: how does it calculate the power and it writes 2561W?

 

[bikesport1000]

Watch that video http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24593&hilit=Ring+of+Fire&start=360
On a custom wind with 10 kw in you get 9,4 hp out. Thereafter 'Ring of Fire' . That is the maximum achievable on this motor design. Absolutely impressing

 

[hjns]

With outside temps now below 0 degrees Celsius, I have had some nice stretches of 126V 45A (5.7kW) going uphill 15% for a couple of minutes without my HT3525 motor even getting warm to the touch. I have not installed the temp probe yet myself, but it is high on my priority list, and I would definitely recommend it.

I usually commute with 84V 45A (>3.5kW) and my motor never gets warm on flat surface.

 

[bikesport1000]

Hi Henk,
sounds remarkable
What was your speed uphill 15%
Do you have any modifications on your HT (phase wires, cooling holes)
What is your 'normal' ambient air temperature
Have a great day

 

[hjns]

Hi bikesport,

speed uphill was around 30km/h, no mods, pulling 45amps consistently. As mentioned, the last days it has been freezing cold, with outside temps during the day around zero degrees Celsius.

 

[The Mighty Volt]

We tried to find the saturation point on a 5304 hub, but we smoked it before we even got to get decent data off it. :'(»

Slightly off-topic......how did you think the X5304 stacked up against the HS3540? I'm a bit alarmed/surprised that you smoked the X5 before you could get data out of it. I would have thought the cast-iron stator should have soaked up the heat for a bit first, no?

 

[Andje]

I have owned two hs motors and one x5304. Same bike, 18 fet lyens running 24s3p. 26 inch rim.
The x5 gets about 95km/h wot, the hs hit 110km/h. The x5 can take 10kw peak and about 9k continuous for about 40 minutes; i can run my whole battery to empty at wot if I want, but would certainly burn even the x5 if I was accelerating at wot over and over and over. The hs's I owned saturated at about 8500 watts, and both died doing only 6500 continuous for about 15 mins. To me it seems the hs have thinner guage stator coils, that could contribute, and then the overall stator weight of the x5 also obviously contributes.
I have an old x5 without disk brake covers; it may only be heresay but the pre-disk cover x5 is supposed to be heavier duty then the newer ones. The hs motors I got were in the methods pre buy with the thinner stator, so with a few extra mm of stator you may see slightly better heat sinking.
In the end my gut reaction was that the hs design wasn't up to the power levels I wanted to run it at. Stick to under 6500 watts is my humble opinion. The x5 for sure can take 10kw; i have put about 6000 km on my x5 and it is rock solid, the hs got barely 300km each.

Rapid acceleration builds heat like nothing else. Doing it over and over from red lights on a commute (ie wot from zero) will burn a motor in no time. That same motor could take those peaks all day as long as it's up to speed first. It's all down to responsible power usage.

 

[bikesport1000]

....and both died doing only 6500 continuous for about 15 mins.

Hi Andje
110 km/h with one of the thinner stator HS WOW
Did you had any special cooling - e.g. side cover holes on your two HS
Original phase wires

Bikesport

 

[Alan B]

Is a pair of ebikes.ca torque arms, one on each side, sufficient for the HT3525? Anyone else running that setup?

 

[hjns]

Is a pair of ebikes.ca torque arms, one on each side, sufficient for the HT3525? Anyone else running that setup?

I am running the HT3525 with one torque arm only and it is not enough. Either use a minimum of 2 (one each side) or weld your own steel plates...

 

[ohzee]

Yea I am running doc torq plates on mine and recommend those if you can. I had a bolt come loose mid ride
yesterday and I have no doubt those things are what saved me from spinning out.

 

[The Mighty Volt]

I have owned two hs motors and one x5304. Same bike, 18 fet lyens running 24s3p. 26 inch rim.
The x5 gets about 95km/h wot, the hs hit 110km/h. The x5 can take 10kw peak and about 9k continuous for about 40 minutes; i can run my whole battery to empty at wot if I want, but would certainly burn even the x5 if I was accelerating at wot over and over and over. The hs's I owned saturated at about 8500 watts, and both died doing only 6500 continuous for about 15 mins. To me it seems the hs have thinner guage stator coils, that could contribute, and then the overall stator weight of the x5 also obviously contributes.
I have an old x5 without disk brake covers; it may only be heresay but the pre-disk cover x5 is supposed to be heavier duty then the newer ones. The hs motors I got were in the methods pre buy with the thinner stator, so with a few extra mm of stator you may see slightly better heat sinking.
In the end my gut reaction was that the hs design wasn't up to the power levels I wanted to run it at. Stick to under 6500 watts is my humble opinion. The x5 for sure can take 10kw; i have put about 6000 km on my x5 and it is rock solid, the hs got barely 300km each.

Rapid acceleration builds heat like nothing else. Doing it over and over from red lights on a commute (ie wot from zero) will burn a motor in no time. That same motor could take those peaks all day as long as it's up to speed first. It's all down to responsible power usage.

Thanks for that.

 

[Andje]

Hi Andje
110 km/h with one of the thinner stator HS WOW
Did you had any special cooling - e.g. side cover holes on your two HS
Original phase wires

Bikesport

i drill "cooling" holes in all of my covers. i run 8 gauge silicon wires from the controller to the motor and then I was using 12 gauge teflon coated into the motor.
[youtube]p_gpp9q6-YE[/youtube]
that's with the hs

[youtube]9cT_jRMRzZg[/youtube]
that's with the x5; at the end of the vid (6:27) i do some road riding at about 85k/h

 

[nicobie]

Is a pair of ebikes.ca torque arms, one on each side, sufficient for the HT3525? Anyone else running that setup?

That is what I am running and so far all is good at 22s lipo, total weight ~280 lbs

 

[Alan B]

Is a pair of ebikes.ca torque arms, one on each side, sufficient for the HT3525? Anyone else running that setup?

That is what I am running and so far all is good at 22s lipo, total weight ~280 lbs

Glad to hear it is working. Planning to run 18S myself. What current do you allow? Did you see that Neil spun a 12mm axle in a different torque arm? Not the same motor, and only one torque arm, but these 12mm axles are hard to stop from turning. It is over in the "quality torque plate" thread here:

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=34150

 

[nicobie]

Glad to hear it is working. Planning to run 18S myself. What current do you allow?

If memory serves, I've got the controller set at 50a battery, 120a phase. I've seen 5000w peaks.

The bike goes like hell, tops out at 40mph hot off charger. Since I drilled the side covers, I can't get it over 75*c no matter how hard I push it. For my use it's better than a hs3540. Having 5% more copper fill than the hs doesn't hurt either. :wink:

 

[bikesport1000]

What about your phase wires Nicobie - still original or something special?

 

[nicobie]

What about your phase wires Nicobie - still original or something special?

I use 10g up to the motor but the wires are still stock inside.

 

[RVD]

anyone know the replacement spoke length and size for the HS3540?

i measured and it looks like mine is 170mm 12 gauge? can anyone confirm? i read some reports that look like it might be 165mm. i originally through 180mm so i bought some spokes but they were too long.

yes, i have a ruler but it's in inches only...

too lazy to go buy a new ruler today.

 

[sn0wchyld]

anyone know the replacement spoke length and size for the HS3540?

i measured and it looks like mine is 170mm 12 gauge? can anyone confirm? i read some reports that look like it might be 165mm. i originally through 180mm so i bought some spokes but they were too long.

yes, i have a ruler but it's in inches only...

too lazy to go buy a new ruler today.

im using 164mm, but thats on a DT swiss fr600 rim - it can vary depending on your ERD.

 

[RVD]

ok looks like i'll be buying a ruler tonight. thanks for your help.

 

[bikesport1000]

I just laced with 163 mm spokes in a Mavic 26" Downhill Rim (see pic on the right-hand side)- length was just perfect. Give me the diameter of your rim from the spoke entrance point into nipple and I calculate the spoke length for you.