Philistine's Yuba Mundo Station Wagon

[Cicada]

thats pretty funny..just as well his name wasn't Ben.

 

[chroot]

@Philistine- Your Greyborg bike is so beautiful, I wanted see whats inside the canopy, I see you mentioned 20Ah and I hoped it have enough room for possible have 20s in 30 or 40Ah. Please take a picture so it would be giving me crystal clear picture what is the lipo pack inside the frame.

 

[Philistine]

Hi Chroot,

I will take a good photo next time I take off the side canopy, is a bit of a pain to remove unless I need to.

Hal quotes the two battery chambers as having the dimensions: 300x105x150mm

But I made my battery chambers out of aluminium angle, so they were boxes. This meant that for the bottom chamber, it had to be slightly smaller than the top box, as the plastic canopy on the pedal side is indented (for the chain ring). This suited me as I have all my wiring (for series connections and mine wires for charging etc..) in that space. But this means that I have been able to fit 20S4P - ie 16 x 5s5ah bricks). I think you could probably fit 25ah, but I think much more would be a real squeeze.

You can see a photo of my Greyborg with the cover off half way down this page: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=25973&hilit=comradegerry&start=15

Cheers, Phil.

 

[grindz145]

Nice! I love the cargo bikes. I wish I would have went with a Yuba Mundo, but I still love my cargo ebike. Mines ugly at the moment, but here it is loaded up with cargo for the scooter rally this past weekend. Those AMMO cans are a much better look!

View attachment 1

 

[Philistine]

Nice Grindz. I like it. Is that an Xtracyle? How do you find the front suspension effects handling? When I have both kids on the back, I find I have to hold control a lot on the front, and so I am wondering how front suspension would effect control when you have decent weight on the back?

 

[chroot]

Philistine- When I went the event for Kingfish welcoming at SF last sunday. One of ES member mentioned Hal9000 is in progress building the full suspension bike with a modular gear reduction and RC motor set-up. I was skeptical, I am gonna buy one from him for sure! I hope it has 2 stage RC motors set-up. :lol:

 

[nomad85]

Nice Grindz. I like it. Is that an Xtracyle? How do you find the front suspension effects handling? When I have both kids on the back, I find I have to hold control a lot on the front, and so I am wondering how front suspension would effect control when you have decent weight on the back?

My bike is really similar to Grindz, my front fork is not as nice, but I haven't noticed a difference between rigid and suspension front forks regarding stability with a load. I have hauled 200+ lbs loads (my wife and sister on the back at the same time) without issue in both configurations. I haven't ridden in a while due to battery problems, I run the same 20s lipo setup as you but my charging solution failed me and the batts are all toast. What is your system? (pm me if you dont want to sidetrack the thread )

 

[ohjanna]

Hey All,
I'm a newbie here. I just ordered an El Mundo after spending many hours researching all the options, deciding that a Stoked Yuba was just a bit more than I can spend right now. It should come in about a month. In the meantime, I can shop around for fun accessories like kid seats and panniers. I have three kids, ages 1, 5, and 7 and plan to use the Mundo as the minivan and grocery getter. My first question for you all, what kind of lock up system do you use? I live in Pittsburgh, in what I'm guessing is a pretty high bike stealing area. I'm figuring I need a U-lock and a cable lock. Suggestions on sizes and technique for this big beauty?
-Joanna

 

[Joseph C.]

Hey All,
I'm a newbie here. I just ordered an El Mundo after spending many hours researching all the options, deciding that a Stoked Yuba was just a bit more than I can spend right now. It should come in about a month. In the meantime, I can shop around for fun accessories like kid seats and panniers. I have three kids, ages 1, 5, and 7 and plan to use the Mundo as the minivan and grocery getter. My first question for you all, what kind of lock up system do you use? I live in Pittsburgh, in what I'm guessing is a pretty high bike stealing area. I'm figuring I need a U-lock and a cable lock. Suggestions on sizes and technique for this big beauty?
-Joanna

Hi Joanna,

I hate to be the harbinger of bad news...

The sad reality is that all locks can be opened/cut/broken by thieves within seconds, no matter what the manufacturer claims.

If you can get a cheap motorcycle lock like one of these that would be best.

http://www.aldi.ie/ie/html/offers/special_buys3_16088.htm

If a thief really wants your bicycle they will take it. With a motorcycle lock like that - they will at least have to be a professional thief with either massive bolt cutters or a decent cordless mini-angle grinder to take it. The lock above will dissuade most from stealing as it will take too much effort to steal your bike.

Above all, do yourself a favour and don't buy really expensive locks. It would be wiser to save that money for bicycle insurance.

Joseph.

 

[Philistine]

My bike is really similar to Grindz, my front fork is not as nice, but I haven't noticed a difference between rigid and suspension front forks regarding stability with a load. I have hauled 200+ lbs loads (my wife and sister on the back at the same time) without issue in both configurations. I haven't ridden in a while due to battery problems, I run the same 20s lipo setup as you but my charging solution failed me and the batts are all toast. What is your system? (pm me if you dont want to sidetrack the thread )

Hi Nomad,

Thanks for the feedback on the forks, sounds like that is my next buy.

On my Yuba I run 13S4P (20ah), and I charge that as a single pack using a 26V 30 Amp PSU with a Hyperion 1420i, which allows me to charge 13S @ 10amps - I have dedicated charge leads that come out of the two battery boxes, which allows me to keep the two ammo boxes locked down, and the single set of charge leads are outside dedicated for charging. This means my whole system is totally waterproof. On my Greyborg I run 20S4P(20ah) and for that I split it into two 10s packs (ie I disconnect the series connection) and I charge as 2 x 10S packs, for which I charge with two ICharger 3010B on the same PSUs (I have 2 x 26V 30 amp PSUs), again charging at 10amps. But I am thinking of buying one of those BMS battery chargers, being a single 84V 14amp charger. That way, on the Greyborg I could have a single set of charge leads like on the Yuba.

I have found I rarely have to balance my packs (i have parralelled the balance leads), mostly I blind charge with my RC chargers, and only balance charge every 20 charges or so. I find my packs (because I have bought them at the same time and they are all the same vintage) stay in balance amazingly well.

@Ohjanna - on locks, I use a Ulock, and have never had problems, I agree with Joseph though that a theif can beat any lock if they want to. I once came across the aftermath of some guys who had just nicked some really expensive mountain bikes. The people standing around said that these guys (there were two), pulled up in a truck, one sprayed the Ulock (it was a Kryptonite Ulock) with some type of freezing spray, the other hit it with a hammer and it shattered. It happened so fast by the time people worked out what they were doing they had slung the bikes in the back of the truck and were off. So I agree no lock is unbeatable, but to get through a Kryptonite Ulock you are either going to need a portable angle grinder or freezing spray, and in my opinion that is much less likely than someone carrying around bolt cutters, so I would always go Ulock.

I also think a cargo bike would be less attractive to a theif (I could be wrong), just because it is pretty niche, and not the sort of thing they can easily offload without it attracting attention/being unique. I might be wrong, but I generally think theifs want something they can quickly sell on Craigslist without attracting any attention.

 

[Kiwi]

30 amp hours of lead acid battery should slow them down!
There are alot of tracking devices out there now, mainly for motorcycles and cars. But as you will have battery boxes, you could hide one away. Just text your bike, and it will text you back its position.

http://www.dinodirect.com/gps-position-tracker-pocket-gadgets-currency-GBP.html

Google GPS tracker, there are lots out there.

 

[Joseph C.]

I once came across the aftermath of some guys who had just nicked some really expensive mountain bikes. The people standing around said that these guys (there were two), pulled up in a truck, one sprayed the Ulock (it was a Kryptonite Ulock) with some type of freezing spray, the other hit it with a hammer and it shattered. It happened so fast by the time people worked out what they were doing they had slung the bikes in the back of the truck and were off.

They obviously didn't realise that those locks could be opened with a pen.

[youtube]LahDQ2ZQ3e0[/youtube]

 

[Philistine]

Philistine wrote:I once came across the aftermath of some guys who had just nicked some really expensive mountain bikes. The people standing around said that these guys (there were two), pulled up in a truck, one sprayed the Ulock (it was a Kryptonite Ulock) with some type of freezing spray, the other hit it with a hammer and it shattered. It happened so fast by the time people worked out what they were doing they had slung the bikes in the back of the truck and were off.


They obviously didn't realise that those locks could be opened with a pen.

Yeah but Joseph apart from the fact that we don't know if that guy had a specially modified lock for his demonstration (not saying he did, just saying we don't know), he took waaaaay longer than these guys did. That's exactly what I am saying, these guys with their freeze spray and hammer apparantly took a matter of seconds. Ie, a bunch of people watched them do it and didn't even have time to react before they worked out they were stealing the bikes.

Those types of Youtube videos where people show you how to scam things are notoriously staged, have you seen the one that shows you how to program a coke machine through its keypad to get it to spit out all its money?

 

[boostjuice]

Heya there Phil & others who might give a toss,
So i finally got around to installing my Rockshox Domain Dual crown forks in an effort to prepare my Mundo for ridiculous electromotive speeds. Unfortunately I had to sacrifice 2" of suspension travel due to the super long headtube vertically spacing the two crowns so far apart, so its effectively only a 6" travel fork which is a shame

Ride impressions? Suspension = Plush , altered geometry = Fail :x
I really wasn't expecting it to feel sooo different, but all the nimbleness that the standard geometry offered with the low slung rigid fork is gone (something that originally surpised me considering the long wheelbase). It just feels gumby/clumsy to lean into corners now. I'm pretty pissed-off to say the least considering the coin i dropped on these, but then those more educated in altered frame geometry probably could have told me what to expect with this mod

My advice to anyone looking for a plusher ride for their Mundo? stick with the standard fork and use balloon tyres or at the very most choose a short travel suspension fork that doesnt raise the front so much...

 

[Philistine]

THanks for that update Boostjuice, very much appreciated. What you say about handling is what I had feared, and why I said I would let you be the first mover to test the waters. When you mentioned using such big forks my concerns were born out of how my Boxxer triple clamps feel on my Greyborg, they feel sweet as, but they are so spongy that I wondered how that might effect control of the front, as I had noticed when I have both kids on the back of the Yuba, flailing aroung moving their body weight randomly as they do, I really have to hold the front down for control sometimes, and I had wondered how that would be effected by such spongy plush suspension.

Thanks for the update though, as I said really do appreciate the review. I have been finding the rigid frame on the Yuba a bit painful sometmes, but I think if I go suspension forks it will just be small ones. What sort of handlebars have you got on there? That is my next purchase I am looking at.

I just took delivery of 10 8ah 6S 30C Zippy packs, so I will be running 12S 40ah, I will never need worry about range again.....

 

[Joseph C.]

Philistine wrote:I once came across the aftermath of some guys who had just nicked some really expensive mountain bikes. The people standing around said that these guys (there were two), pulled up in a truck, one sprayed the Ulock (it was a Kryptonite Ulock) with some type of freezing spray, the other hit it with a hammer and it shattered. It happened so fast by the time people worked out what they were doing they had slung the bikes in the back of the truck and were off.


They obviously didn't realise that those locks could be opened with a pen.

Yeah but Joseph apart from the fact that we don't know if that guy had a specially modified lock for his demonstration (not saying he did, just saying we don't know), he took waaaaay longer than these guys did. That's exactly what I am saying, these guys with their freeze spray and hammer apparantly took a matter of seconds. Ie, a bunch of people watched them do it and didn't even have time to react before they worked out they were stealing the bikes.

Those types of Youtube videos where people show you how to scam things are notoriously staged, have you seen the one that shows you how to program a coke machine through its keypad to get it to spit out all its money?

No, does it work? :wink:

Oh the thing with the bic pen is genuine. People have known about it for years but it took Kryptonite until 2005 to finally change their key system and effectively admit their lock was fatally flawed. Their new keys are no longer tubular they use I-keys now. I was doing a bit of research into locks a while back and found that they were all easily broken with the right knowledge.

 

[boostjuice]

THanks for that update Boostjuice, very much appreciated. What you say about handling is what I had feared, and why I said I would let you be the first mover to test the waters. When you mentioned using such big forks my concerns were born out of how my Boxxer triple clamps feel on my Greyborg, they feel sweet as, but they are so spongy that I wondered how that might effect control of the front, as I had noticed when I have both kids on the back of the Yuba, flailing aroung moving their body weight randomly as they do, I really have to hold the front down for control sometimes, and I had wondered how that would be effected by such spongy plush suspension.

Yeah, a valid concern for sure. I can't decide through imagination whether suspension would be a hindrance or a help in that situation. I mean suspension is more forgiving when you've got rough obstacales/terrain and your body weight is positioned correctly in anticipation, but then rigidity might be more beneficial for the unexpected flailing of childrens limbs pulling everthing off balance....i really dont know :| I certainly got sick of jarred wrists and spat chains everytime i hit an imperfect piece of road or a short ramped gutter, so whilst that is largely cured, it is replaced with newfound handling issues.

What sort of handlebars have you got on there? That is my next purchase I am looking at.

They're some steel BMX bars i picked up off eBay years ago cos i liked the styling. I was told by a BMXer that they are 'flatland' style, whatever that means. They have a sticker on them saying 'Genetix components' but thats all i know about them. I had to shim them to fit my standard MTB stem, as being BMX they have a 22.2mm clamp point diameter. Me being the tight ass resourceful type recognised that a small section of standard 1" OD copper plumbers pipe hacksawed into two halves was a perfect shim fit. If your after some nice REAL riser bars (3.5>5" = hard to find in standard Bar clamp diameters [non BMX] that you dont need to shim) then check out this mob >> http://www.comcycle-usa.com/Handlebars-Stems-Grips-9760/MTB-Handlebars-9762.aspx. BTW They also happen to be one of very few places you can get 11T freewheel clusters which might be handy for you if you are spinning out trying to assist your hub motors at high speeds....although knowing you, you probably never pedal :lol:

I just took delivery of 10 8ah 6S 30C Zippy packs, so I will be running 12S 40ah, I will never need worry about range again.....

Pure envy...i barely have enough coin after paying rent to buy bread/milk these days. Student budget holds back all my projects...:sigh:

 

[Philistine]

Thanks for the handle bar link Boostjuice, much appreciated.

although knowing you, you probably never pedal

Damn straight, only pedaling I do is ghost pedal when the Po is around, and when I have a failure.

Pure envy...i barely have enough coin after paying rent to buy bread/milk these days. Student budget holds back all my projects...:sigh:

Yeah but think of all that sweet student poonani you get to stretch. What use is having money when you are paunchy and lumbered with domestic chains? If only fat rich amoral debased Philistine could go back in time to counsel and help out wide eyed, fit, poor and idealistic young Philistine. Proctologists and Gynos would cheer in anticipation.

 

[urbancommuterstore.com]

Thanks for posting pics and your thoughts on the front suspension upgrade. Yes, the yuba will really feel weird because of the change in the head angle's geometry. I believe if I am not mistaken, stock head angle is 71 degrees. If you wish to have the same stock handling of the Yuba, which I think is great even out in the dirt trails, you need a shorter suspension fork travel, maybe an 80mm or 100mm just to keep the front tame when going over bumps on the road. I still need to measure the axle to crown length to find me a suitable front suspension fork. I have been thinking of an upgrade because riding rigid out in the dirt trails sometimes gets me too beat up.

 

[amberwolf]

What about using a smaller wheel in front? And if possible, a larger in back? (I can see there's not much room, an inch or two max, for tire on the front of teh stay area).

 

[spinningmagnets]

Thanks for posting the side-by-side pic of the fork postures. Is it at all possible to trim the tubes of that brand of fork to shorten its height to the minimum? (I realize when loaded with rider/cargo it will sit lower, and it may now be as low as it can be, but....I have to ask?)

 

[boostjuice]

Thanks for posting the side-by-side pic of the fork postures. Is it at all possible to trim the tubes of that brand of fork to shorten its height to the minimum? (I realize when loaded with rider/cargo it will sit lower, and it may now be as low as it can be, but....I have to ask?)

Because both upper and lower crowns bolt-clamp to the stanchions (rather than being fixed like on a single crown fork), i can adjust the effective fork length as short as i like (back to stock height if need be). At the moment it is at a maximum fork length to gain maximum suspension travel (although restricted from its 8" travel capacity due to the beforementioned long head tube clamp spacing dillema). I will experiment with shortening the travel and tightening the head angle to try and find a happy compromise between ride comfort and handling. Unfortunately though, because these Rockshox forks have a bit less rake/caster than the standard rigid forks i will shorten my wheelbase as the head angle tightens and the original compensation through slackness of the head tube diminishes. I feel that it might well be this reduced rake/caster on top of the raised front and slacker head angle that is also responsible for a significant portion of the negative change in handling.

What about using a smaller wheel in front? And if possible, a larger in back? (I can see there's not much room, an inch or two max, for tire on the front of teh stay area).

A fine suggestion. A 20" front wheel would drop the front 3" whilst gaining 3" of suspension travel clearance, which would be a significant help. However it would be aesthetically intolerable for me, and i dont want to have to buy/build another expensive 20mm hubbed wheel. Changing the rear wheel to a 29er would probably fit, but it is hard enough to find 48spoke rims in 26" let alone 29", so whatever happens the wheels will have to remain as they are.

 

[boostjuice]

Thanks for the handle bar link Boostjuice, much appreciated.

although knowing you, you probably never pedal

Damn straight, only pedaling I do is ghost pedal when the Po is around, and when I have a failure.

Also check out some of the local bike shops for riser bars. I remember 'The Bike Shed' in Phillip used to stock tall riser bars in MTB stem clamp diameters, but that was like 2 years ago... Postage from overseas might be more than made up for by shopping at a do-ya-dry-bricks-&-mortar local ripoff merchant.

Pure envy...i barely have enough coin after paying rent to buy bread/milk these days. Student budget holds back all my projects...:sigh:

Yeah but think of all that sweet student poonani you get to stretch. What use is having money when you are paunchy and lumbered with domestic chains? If only fat rich amoral debased Philistine could go back in time to counsel and help out wide eyed, fit, poor and idealistic young Philistine. Proctologists and Gynos would cheer in anticipation.

I've never had the amoral aptitude to be the man-slut like i used to think i wanted to be.... Recently started dating a girl, been 2 months now and already i can feel the involuntary chains of commitment clamping down, but im moving to Victoria next year so that should help moderate things. However though, funny story: this girl im with now was sleeping on the floor -or at least trying to- at a loose/drunken/student house party next to the couch where i was 'tenderising' another bird a few months back (2 weeks before we started dating) I did have dating intentions for the first girl until i found out a week after the party that a pissed-off close friend had been dating her lightly for a few weeks thinking they were already exclusive.... I bailed on her for my current lady as soon as i realised i was mowing his lawn.... mates before dates. None of this is even moderately intersting compared to the whack shenanigans you got up to in your 20's though....

 

[full-throttle]

BJ,

Be careful dropping the lower crown. The fork legs are 4130 series tapered wall steel. As long as the crown is not in the thin wall region it's fine.

I see you already got a long drop upper crown, you might be able to get a longer drop one. Changing the headset might give you an extra 5-10mm.

The best way to shorten the travel would be to go for a shorter (stiffer) spring.

 

[boostjuice]

BJ,

Be careful dropping the lower crown. The fork legs are 4130 series tapered wall steel. As long as the crown is not in the thin wall region it's fine.

I see you already got a long drop upper crown, you might be able to get a longer drop one. Changing the headset might give you an extra 5-10mm.

The best way to shorten the travel would be to go for a shorter (stiffer) spring.

Good idea, i might wail on the spare packaged 'firm' spring with my angle grinder and swap it in. Im not sure if the internal damping system will screw with things though as i imagine its progressive to give far greater damping at near-to-full travel limits? Something that will be effectively emulated during low impact conditions by the shorter spring...