Qulbix Q76R Frame Kits & Complete Bikes PRE-ORDER

[Offroader]

Quokka, You mentioned that you compared the Mxus using a 24" bicycle wheel vs the QS with a 19" motorcycle wheel, you are going to have a huge weight difference with the tire weight alone, around half of the weight difference between the wheel builds will be because of the tire / rim weight.

I think you would have to compare both motors using the same wheel to get a better idea about how they feel. The Mxus 3000 may not feel so agile if built into a heavy motorcycle wheel.

 

[Rix]

Quokka, You mentioned that you compared the Mxus using a 24" bicycle wheel vs the QS with a 19" motorcycle wheel, you are going to have a huge weight difference with the tire weight alone, around half of the weight difference between the wheel builds will be because of the tire / rim weight.

I think you would have to compare both motors using the same wheel to get a better idea about how they feel. The Mxus 3000 may not feel so agile if built into a heavy motorcycle wheel.

That is a valid point Offroader, but it would still be 5 or more pounds lighter with the same rim spoke, and that would be noticeable.

 

[Offroader]

Took my bike out after sitting for a couple of weeks, never fails to amaze me just how great it rides.

I think the key to a good riding bike is, thin frame for better handling and soft suspension. If your suspension is too stiff it really kills the ride. You have to really make sure you are using most of your rear travel by riding normally without jumps. You have to mark how much travel you are using by riding normal trails (no jumps), if you are not getting 80% of the travel you have to lower your spring weight.

Jumps will bottom out anything, so better off setting it without jumps. 12-13 PSI in rear tire really helps also.

I'm using a 300 lbs rear spring on my 10.5 x 3.5 shock.

Front fork I think softer is better. Marzocchi 888 is known to be super plush and it handles very good. I found the DNM USD-8 too stiff.

 

[Quokka]

Quokka, You mentioned that you compared the Mxus using a 24" bicycle wheel vs the QS with a 19" motorcycle wheel, you are going to have a huge weight difference with the tire weight alone, around half of the weight difference between the wheel builds will be because of the tire / rim weight.

I think you would have to compare both motors using the same wheel to get a better idea about how they feel. The Mxus 3000 may not feel so agile if built into a heavy motorcycle wheel.

Yep, the mxus was supposed to be for another build that couldnt fit a moto rim. I wanted to make sure it ran given the problems i had with a older motor. The wheel is way lighter and not comparing like for like. Definately reccomend the moto rim

 

[BCTECH]

.......... You have to mark how much travel you are using by riding normal trails (no jumps), if you are not getting 80% of the travel you have to lower your spring weight........

how to find that out? what is the best way to make a mark on the shock? I found it difficult to fine turn my rear shock since I wouldn't be able to see the movement during the ride.
I actually found the dnm is soft and still couldn't' tune it to more stiff yet. maybe because my bike is heavy. I tried a couple of high end forks at the bike shop but I don't feel much different than the dnm.

 

[Offroader]

.......... You have to mark how much travel you are using by riding normal trails (no jumps), if you are not getting 80% of the travel you have to lower your spring weight........

how to find that out? what is the best way to make a mark on the shock? I found it difficult to fine turn my rear shock since I wouldn't be able to see the movement during the ride.
I actually found the dnm is soft and still couldn't' tune it to more stiff yet. maybe because my bike is heavy. I tried a couple of high end forks at the bike shop but I don't feel much different than the dnm.

What you need to do is I assume you have a rubber stop at the very bottom of your shock. You have to carefully push this up, I say carefully because if you slip with a screwdriver or something metal you will scratch your shock shaft like I have done. Best to use something wood.

Move up this stop to about half way up our shock shaft, ride around and see how far down this gets pushed (no jumping to flat ground). If you notice this rubber stop only gets pushed half way down, you need to lower your spring weight.

Your DNM is not going to be too soft, especially with your body weight. I bet if you sit on your bike the fork probably doesn't sag down much at all, even though they recommend like 30% sag.

 

[brumbrum]

.......... You have to mark how much travel you are using by riding normal trails (no jumps), if you are not getting 80% of the travel you have to lower your spring weight........

how to find that out? what is the best way to make a mark on the shock? I found it difficult to fine turn my rear shock since I wouldn't be able to see the movement during the ride.
I actually found the dnm is soft and still couldn't' tune it to more stiff yet. maybe because my bike is heavy. I tried a couple of high end forks at the bike shop but I don't feel much different than the dnm.

Get a thin elastic (rubber) band and snap it, now tie it in a knot around your shock shaft. Use this as a device to see how much travel you are getting. The rubber will not scratch the shaft and you can easily pull it off afterwards by pulling it and snapping or cutting.

As Off-roader has said there is usually a rubber bumper on a rear shock but i find it sometimes slides down to the bottom of the shock when pushed by the shock or from vibration.

 

[BCTECH]

I thought that rubber pad was to protect bottom out for the shock. mine seems always in middle position. I might try lower the spring rate to 300lb (that's the spring came with the shock). I am currently using 400lb. hope I don't need buy a whole bunch of springs just to try

 

[Offroader]

I thought that rubber pad was to protect bottom out for the shock. mine seems always in middle position. I might try lower the spring rate to 300lb (that's the spring came with the shock). I am currently using 400lb. hope I don't need buy a whole bunch of springs just to try

If it is in middle position then spring weight is way too high. I had the same issue.

You can try a 300 LBS, but if you are constantly bottoming out the shock then you may need a 350. A 300 may work and that is what I use.

Don't feel bad about buying springs, I have a 300-350-400-450 spring,

 

[Quokka]

I went the complete opposite way to offroader. I have a really heavy spring on mine-700lbs. I use mine at fairly high speed and found that the bike lurches and rocked under braking with a 350lb spring. it doesnt use much of the availible travel but to me feels more predictable under braking at high speed. I guess the best option is try a few different ones and see what suits your riding style

 

[Merlin]

a mtb or "offroad" geometry is not for "higher" speed.

everyone who ever ride a enduro or cross-bike know what happens on top speed (160kph)
if you dont lean BACK as long you can, so bike wobbles really dangerous.
up to a crash(!)

i have to deal with both. i like the plush ride where suspension eats up everything under my ass.
but riding really fast (up to 120kph) it is to dangerous for ME.

from 1 (plush) to 10 (maximum hard) i have setup my daily suspension to 7.
not funny to cultivy farmland with my dog, but iam more on the road so i can live with that.

theres no "best spring"
everyone have to find out their needs, calculating own weight + bike and what you want to ride.

there are alot of videos how to setup. just start with a video like that, and may watch some more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhTZtLJ79J0

 

[BCTECH]

I went the complete opposite way to offroader. I have a really heavy spring on mine-700lbs. I use mine at fairly high speed and found that the bike lurches and rocked under braking with a 350lb spring. it doesnt use much of the availible travel but to me feels more predictable under braking at high speed. I guess the best option is try a few different ones and see what suits your riding style

700lb is very heavy spring. are you using 9.5in or 10.5 shock?
"high speed" is different for everyone, for some extreme guy like Merlin going 160kph then go for highest rate spring makes sense. Maybe a spring is not even needed, like riding a train.
I also think that very few people here riding the raptor offroad extensively, most are on-road speed player and with higher and higher spring rate is ok. When I search youtube, I couldn't find much / no video of people riding high end ebike off road like some crazy downhill / dirt bikers will do. Most are riding on a flat land or on street, and it makes harder to get some tips on offroad settings.
The only time I will be on the road is on my way to the trail, I don't care the ride quality on road but off road riding wanting to be perfect. my speed usually around 50kph going through woods or downhill trails with rocks, mud, log, ... up and down hills. I always trying to beat up my bike as much as I can, and seems impossible considering how strong and well built the Qulbix is. I don't see anyone can damage the frame in any way. But then maybe not enough people out there trying to abuse the bike as what the Raptor is designed for.

 

[Merlin]

i mean kph not mph
but i understand and you are right.

for my understanding "offroad" this bitch is too heavy or the suspension to week comparing to a small mx bike.
we are using downhill parts.

i jumped some times on a bmx track....works well if you hit the right angle of landing.
if you jump to short or to far your suspension have to safe 200-300% for what they are build.

i have a fat fox 40. i think this is great fork stuff. but did you ever take a look what happend with the fork when you make a wheelie up to 80kph and the 19" 5Kg Wheel hits the road?
scary shit i can tell you. the frame, yes. its steel. will work for hard offroad. but our suspension are not for that kind of weights. no matter what spring you are using.

ill faced it with my first raptor allready. my ass is getting older so i stopped myself breaking some bones again with that fat ass bike

funny to read that a day later. yesterday i had a NORMAL BIKE in my hand...yes...a normal..no motor, no batteries
wow a LIGHTWEIGHT 21Kg DH Bike. If you deal 3 Years with a 60Kg Raptor and touching that you could never imagine that you were pissed of a 21Kg bike riding downhill.

i think allex found also out with his 38kg "Lightweight" FLX that weight is more important then blunt power

i had the same decision between a 76 and 140 frame.
2,4Kg less weight....but no place for lipo batteries. if i jump on the traing for a q76 ever.
i would make it light as possible.
Battery juice for 30km, MTB Rims 24", midi-E,bicycle tires.
a real fun bike.

 

[BCTECH]

i mean kph not mph
but i understand and you are right.

for my understanding "offroad" this bitch is too heavy or the suspension to week comparing to a small mx bike.
we are using downhill parts.

i jumped some times on a bmx track....works well if you hit the right angle of landing.
if you jump to short or to far your suspension have to safe 200-300% for what they are build.

i have a fat fox 40. i think this is great fork stuff. but did you ever take a look what happend with the fork when you make a wheelie up to 80kph and the 19" 5Kg Wheel hits the road?
scary shit i can tell you. the frame, yes. its steel. will work for hard offroad. but our suspension are not for that kind of weights. no matter what spring you are using.

ill faced it with my first raptor allready. my ass is getting older so i stopped myself breaking some bones again with that fat ass bike

funny to read that a day later. yesterday i had a NORMAL BIKE in my hand...yes...a normal..no motor, no batteries
wow a LIGHTWEIGHT 21Kg DH Bike. If you deal 3 Years with a 60Kg Raptor and touching that you could never imagine that you were pissed of a 21Kg bike riding downhill.

i think allex found also out with his 38kg "Lightweight" FLX that weight is more important then blunt power

i had the same decision between a 76 and 140 frame.
2,4Kg less weight....but no place for lipo batteries. if i jump on the traing for a q76 ever.
i would make it light as possible.
Battery juice for 30km, MTB Rims 24", midi-E,bicycle tires.
a real fun bike.

160 kph on road maybe more dangerous than flying off the mountain or cliff at 60kph. When I on the road, 70kph is pretty much max for me considering the traffic and the max speed of my motor can go. Off roading at 70kph is getting pretty scary, on a flat wide trail 60kph maybe that's all.

why you think the suspension might have problem? our bikes are heavy like 100-120lbs?! but not crazy heavy like dirt bikes. the suspension should be fine, some people weight 200lbs still good on MTB suspension.

you are very correct on the bike weight. every time I ride I have been thinking what if I had a lighter bike. I have to avoid a lot of trails because of the heavy bike, the main problem is it's heavy to a point that I can not lift up the bike to cross big log or a few stairs. it sucks when this stops you going beyond and need to turn around same route back.
I think the q76r is designed for people want lighter bike, but better using 18650. my next step is to make my bike lighter, but maybe building another light q76r is easier then doing anything to my current 140. I don't need supper light but happy to be able to lift up the bike crossing a few stairs at least.

 

[Quokka]

My experience was doing over 70km and need to stop quick. The front fork will compress down into the weeds and because your rear is spongy with a light spring, it will make it worse. One solution to this i have found effective is to use your regen to wash off speed down to around 40 km/hr. Springs are cheap, get some different ones and get testing. Another thing i would like test but have not yet is a stiff front fork and lighter rear set-up. That could help stop the face plant feeling, i just need new forks to test that, in the meantime i prefer my beefy shock.

 

[Tats]

I've wondered at what point motorbike suspension components would be required and sounds like it's about now lol. Let's face it you have motorbike rims spokes tyres, front forks brakes head bearings must follow soon. Coming from road motorcycling I'm a fan of a stiff front fork and push the front into corners probably more like quokkas preference but that's definitely not what off road needs. No one size will fit all and everything is a compromise somewhere.

 

[Rix]

I've wondered at what point motorbike suspension components would be required and sounds like it's about now lol. Let's face it you have motorbike rims spokes tyres, front forks brakes head bearings must follow soon. Coming from road motorcycling I'm a fan of a stiff front fork and push the front into corners probably more like quokkas preference but that's definitely not what off road needs. No one size will fit all and everything is a compromise somewhere.

Tats, you make a good point, if you look at the the toughest down hill suspension components for MTBs and compare them to trials motorcycle shocks and forks, not much difference in weight. A while back I had a Beta EVO 250 trials bike. the forks weighed 11 pounds. The forks on my Fighter weigh 7.5 pounds, only 3.5 pounds more. Don't get me wrong, the toughest DVO or Manitou Durado, or USD 8 or any other DH MTB fork won't handle landing 100 foot triples like a WP Fork on a KTM, and I won't delude anyone into thinking otherwise. But DH Forks are comparable toughness wise and much lighter to what was available on motocross machines from the late 70s and 80s, and IMO, thats fine for our Ebike purposes.

 

[Tats]

I agree Rix - are their any anti-dive forks for bicycles out there? Or has the technology moved on to the point their not really required these days?

 

[Rix]

I agree Rix - are their any anti-dive forks for bicycles out there? Or has the technology moved on to the point their not really required these days?

One can get lost in all of the MTB shocks and forks that have come and went over the years. I remember the smart valve concept one manufactured tried on cross country forks when MTB bikes only had front suspension. The smart valve circuit closed when it detected a certain angle on ascents and prevented the fork from compressing. Theory was, there would be less loss from pedal induced bobbing when mashing the pedals on climbs, and act like a suspension fork on the flats and downhill sections where more speed was achieved. Problem was, that smart circuit also closed when flying down hills, and hitting G/outs. Things went sideways in hurry. Anyway variations of that has come and go several times over the years. Sometimes shit is so old, its new again with a tweak here or refinement there.

 

[madin88]

But DH Forks are comparable toughness wise and much lighter to what was available on motocross machines from the late 70s and 80s, and IMO, thats fine for our Ebike purposes.

from my experience what it needs is a harder spring because our >80kmh e-bikes are simply more heavier than a normal bike. the compression and rebound should be adjusted according to speed and terrain.
roughly: high speed on smooth roads -> more hard, low speed on uneven roads -> more soft
if youre hitting a pothole and the dampening is set very hard, the parts will get stressed alot due to the high force impact.

 

[Rix]

But DH Forks are comparable toughness wise and much lighter to what was available on motocross machines from the late 70s and 80s, and IMO, thats fine for our Ebike purposes.

from my experience what it needs is a harder spring because our >80kmh e-bikes are simply more heavier than a normal bike. the compression and rebound should be adjusted according to speed and terrain.
roughly: high speed on smooth roads -> more hard, low speed on uneven roads -> more soft
if youre hitting a pothole and the dampening is set very hard, the parts will get stressed alot due to the high force impact.

So true, siffer springs and more aggressive valve settings would allow us to dial in our machines for our idividual tastes without needing to revalve and respring our suspension.

 

[Offroader]

I find softer suspension much better, especially on the rear. My shock has 3.5 inches of travel, or that is the stroke length. If I'm riding off-road and only using half or 1.75" of that, then what is the point of having all that rear travel?

The biggest problem I have is when I ride over anything large and going fast, the rear gets thrown up violently. What helps with that is lowering the spring weight and making sure I am using most of my suspension travel for those hard hits.

That is the point of having the suspension travel so that the rear wheel will lift up and over the large object, without lifting up the rider and whole center frame.

Since I softened up my suspension, my bike seems like it just sticks to the ground. I still can't ride over things nearly as smoothly with the rear suspension as compared to the front suspension, but the lighter spring weight helped a lot. Also running low PSI in the rear tire helps a lot also.

Harder suspension for the street? I don't see any benefit of hard suspension. I prefer the soft suspension so when I hit rough road the ride is a little bit smoother. I also assume a softer suspension will give you more sag which will help with pot holes, isn't that the point of sag?

Braking? I lock up my rear wheel all the time, and also jam on the fronts hard, I don't notice any issues with braking and soft suspension.

WIth everything said I am still not at the recommended sag of 30% for downhill suspension. It would seem I could even run a softer suspension. I'm not sure if those values are valid because of our heavier bikes.

It just doesn't make sense with what you guys saying and goes against what I have learned about suspension on downhill bikes. I wonder if maybe my suspension components are just better or setup better.

The only issue I have with softer suspension is if I do a high jump to flat ground. Unless I land perfectly flat, I will bottom out the suspension, especially the front fork. Because of this I have learned to land my jumps flat or with a very slight drop to the rear first.

 

[Merlin]

did you ever asked yourself why a streetbike has a stiff suspension and a dirtbike a (more) plush suspension?
if you like what you have set-up fine. (make no sense to the suspension rules but its only for you )

to be honest: if we take a look to racers not all guys have a same setup.
some prefer hard riding, some plush...

about sag or different springs is only the line where you working around.

if i talk about higher speeds, i mean something above 50-60mph.
for my gf is allready "high speed" 40mph.

or you talk often about "jumps"
what does it mean? 10cm? 2 meter drops?
this we have to clear first before we can talk about "suspension" or whatever the unique guy understand about soft or hard.

with a plushy couch suspension setup you can ride up to a certain speed over everything.
low tire pressure on top eats up rolling over a cat without notice

take that couch setup....wear your best helmet, gloves and what you have to protect you.
set your OVS to 7. top out 60-70mph and in a nice corner, lift your feets from your crank and spread them to the sides.

maybe not even need a bump or groundwave for a guaranted crash.


no offroader dont do that.



i think its all about the personal needs.
i wish i could say my 60kg raptor can easy jump around, is plush like hell and also topspeed feels really nice without a care of a crash.

but i cant. its to fat for that with best suspension FOX offerd to the mtb market.
so i live with it.
that sounds maybe like a think before buy...nonono....its only the "drawback" on the try to setup the own bike "perfect"

for every ~80mph run/try i setup everything to maximum hard.
rest of the time iam on the plush side (YEAH because i like that too )

 

[Qulbix]

Hi guys. Here's a new ride video for you. Enjoy!
[youtube]g_Mo48b-nKs[/youtube]

 

[Dumsterdave]

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