Revopower

[Lowell]

Not electric, but does anyone know anything more about this motor than what's in the popular media?

http://www.revopower.com/the_wheel.html

 

[sabrewalt]

I wrote them late last year and offered to buy a beta test but all I got back was "join our news group and keep watching". They keep changing their videos so they are actually doing something and they are still posting an "early 2007" release date. Pretty quiet over all. It would be nice if they would post a projected release month.

 

[Lowell]

Guess I'll check back them them around xmas... :lol:

 

[xyster]

I'd be interested in it for >50 mile rides were it a four-stroke, flex-fuel engine with the potential for 3+ hp. Else for me, compared to electric possibilities, the revo is way too dirty, probably too loud, and lacks sufficient hill-climbing ability.

Why do you like it, Lowell? Am I missing something?

 

[Lowell]

Just another interesting product that might make it to market someday. I don't know about the Revopower motor specifically, but here's a 15cc motor that makes 3hp:

http://www.osengines.com/engines/osmg1981.html

The Revo motor can probably be tuned for some higher RPMs and corresponding higher speeds without changing the gearing. For tiny engines (like one that will fit in a bike wheel) 2 stroke is the best solution. I don't think there's anything else that will give 1+hp for only a 12lb weight increase.

They claim 65db which seems pretty quiet, and a catalyst to scrub emissions. I wouldn't be surprised if catalyzing a 2 stroke chokes up a significant amount of power though.

 

[xyster]

I don't know about the Revopower motor specifically, but here's a 15cc motor that makes 3hp:

Wow! It's only 20 ounces too! I wonder for how long it can maintain that 3 horsepower rating...

Any idea how many ounces of fuel it takes to run wide-open for an hour or so?

These engines must require an awful lot of maintenance and upkeep and/or be very noisy (?), else I'd think we'd be seeing them in more products like ICE hubmotors.

 

[v_tach]

I've been flying R/C aircraft for many years. Take those hp ratings with agrain of salt. Very narrow powerbands and that power comes at a pretty high rpm and noise output. Its been a few years since I've flown alcohol/nitro engines but a .91 I have uses about 12 ounces of fuel in about 8 minutes probably at 3/4 throttle the majority of the time.

 

[Lowell]

Yeah the high strung 2 strokes are pretty obnoxious for noise, kind of like 2 stroke race bikes. That's why I fly electric 8)
Detuned and suitably muffled though, I'm sure a 25cc 2 stroke could make in the 2+hp range while still being civilized.

How about a 25oz, 1.5hp 4 stroke with a 2 year warranty?

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567998

Edit: This looks even better, 21.3cc, 2hp.

http://www.rcvengines.com/rcv130cd.htm

 

[xyster]

Instead of the typical 10+ kg commercial generators, has anybody tried connecting one of these to a motor/power regulator to make a serial hybrid small-ev ?

 

[Lowell]

Now that's an interesting idea! The Yamaha 1000i is the lightest commonly available generator that I've seen. Does anyone know of a lighter one around 1kW?

 

[xyster]

Now that's an interesting idea! The Yamaha 1000i is the lightest commonly available generator that I've seen.

And that Yamaha generator weighs 28 lbs and produces 1000 watts.
Those rc engines weigh 28 ounces and produce twice the power. Even with 50% conversion efficiency, the rc-based system should produce the same 1000 watts of electricity for a lot less weight and money. And you can run the lil' engine only at it's peak efficiency or power point. The rest of the stuff for the power conversion shouldn't be heavier than a 1000w motor plus pwm controller....

 

[Lowell]

Now that's an interesting idea! The Yamaha 1000i is the lightest commonly available generator that I've seen.

And that Yamaha generator weighs 28 lbs and produces 1000 watts.
Those rc engines weigh 28 ounces and produce twice the power. Even with 50% conversion efficiency, the rc-based system should produce the same 1000 watts of electricity for a lot less weight and money. And you can run the lil' engine only at it's peak efficiency or power point. The rest of the stuff for the power conversion shouldn't be heavier than a 1000w motor plus pwm controller....

Sign me up for a palmtop 1kW generator

 

[fechter]

After 100 hours of operation, I think one of those RC airplane motors would be about worn out.
Someplace I saw a prototype that was converted to run on standard diesel fuel and powered a small generator. It fit in the palm of your hand.
Hmm... biodiesel ! I suspect they had trouble getting it started when it was cold.

The Honda equivalent 1kW generator has a permanent magnet alternator that gets converted to dc first, then goes into an inverter to make 120vac.
I suspect the Yamaha works the same way.
If you could replace the inverter with a dc-dc converter, you could make it pretty efficient for charging batteries.

 

[v_tach]

My experience with the tiny R/C motors would keep me from seriously considering any such project. They simply are not designed for the purpose.

The diesel conversions do not use typical diesel pump fuel. I'm not sure the difference but I know they wont run on on the common stuff.

The alcohol/nitro fuel typically used isn't very economical at $15+ a gallon either.

Now... how about a turbine powered generator... or even a turbine powered scooter/bike? Not exactly inexpensive but an interesting novelty...

 

[bobmcree]

the "diesel" rc engines run on a mix of ether and kerosene. a true diesel engine needs enough compression to cause diesel to explode at low temp and none of the available engines can do it.

the revopower guys have been claiming their motor will be legal in all states which is an outright lie. NO gasoline engine of any size can be used in most states without a license and registration and classification as a moped.

IMO revopower looks like a scam to soak investors and will never be a real product. i have never seen one and know nobody else who has.

 

[sabrewalt]

Hey Mcree,

You wrote:

"IMO revopower looks like a scam to soak investors and will never be a real product. i have never seen one and know nobody else who has. "

Cut em a little slack dude. Most peeps are driving around in 3000 lb trucks. These guys are just trying to help. You say you havn;t seen one. Well GO SEE ONE or quit slinging slanderous statements. They are exhibiting at the powersports show next week.

See:

http://www.dealerexpo.com/

BTW: I have no financial interest in these guys.. But if they pull this off, they will have a pretty cool platform.

 

[Lowell]

In Canada, the Revo wheel would certainly be illegal. Your bike would need to be registered and insured like any 50cc and under scooter, and you would need a license. Kind of defeats the purpose in my opinion and I'm not even sure if you can register a bicycle since it has no VIN number.

Now for areas with lax regulations, it would be a great bolt on, but I'd be worried that with one stroke of the pen, the laws could change.

 

[bobmcree]

Cut em a little slack dude. Most peeps are driving around in 3000 lb trucks. These guys are just trying to help. You say you havn;t seen one. Well GO SEE ONE or quit slinging slanderous statements. They are exhibiting at the powersports show next week.

first; a 2 stroke weedeater engine can be worse than a typical car from a pollution standpoint. they are designed to spew out unburned oil and this one does not have a catalytic converter i can see. until i see actual verified data on emission from production versions of the revopower i will continue to doubt that it is an ecological alternative.

there is nothing slanderous about me expressing my opinion, which i clearly indicated i was doing. these guys are continuing to mislead people on their website, saying that this thing will not be a motor vehicle or require a license in most places. this is nonsense. it will certainly never be legal in California or many other states.

the fact they are exhibiting a prototype next week does not impress me, there are lots of prototypes that never make it to production. if they do manage to produce and sell them i doubt i will ever see one, as they are illegal where i live.

-bob

 

[Ypedal]

Well.. along those lines.. 80v x 40 amps is not exactly " legal " either :wink:

I plan to get my hands on one if they ever do produce them.. have been waiting and checking in every few months.. for a few years now...

Would be convenient for extended range use..

 

[Lowell]

Well.. along those lines.. 80v x 40 amps is not exactly " legal " either :wink:

I plan to get my hands on one if they ever do produce them.. have been waiting and checking in every few months.. for a few years now...

Would be convenient for extended range use..

True, but a cop would have to do some work to prove it's over the legal limit. It would be pretty hard to convince a cop that the Revo wheel isn't internal combustion. Maybe it could be disguised as an electric hub motor, and put some fake batteries and wiring on board? If the Revo is as quiet and non smokey as they claim, you probably would not hear it over the sounds of normal traffic.

 

[TechWriter1]

They sent out a note to the people on their mail list and now have folks the email back. I think the delays in conversations to early adopters were that they are a start up with a product that isn’t even on the market yet. Can’t blame them for not putting toms of staff on to pay to answer everyone.

They will be at the PowerSports show, I checked out the website for the show and see them listed. I can’t make it to Indy, but I did meet them at a show this past summer and got to watch the videos they have, listen to the motor and talk to the lead folks.

The Wheel is due out later this year. I am on the early adopter list to get one. I am excited to use my bike again. It’s been in the garage collecting dust. At least when the Wheel comes out, I can pedal and get exercise if I want or use the motor to assist me when I need it. Best of both worlds… Now I can leave my car behind. Love this idea!

Well.. along those lines.. 80v x 40 amps is not exactly " legal " either :wink:

I plan to get my hands on one if they ever do produce them.. have been waiting and checking in every few months.. for a few years now...

Would be convenient for extended range use..

True, but a cop would have to do some work to prove it's over the legal limit. It would be pretty hard to convince a cop that the Revo wheel isn't internal combustion. Maybe it could be disguised as an electric hub motor, and put some fake batteries and wiring on board? If the Revo is as quiet and non smokey as they claim, you probably would not hear it over the sounds of normal traffic.

 

[xyster]

Well.. along those lines.. 80v x 40 amps is not exactly " legal " either

Illegal does not necessarily mean more harmful. On the continuum of environmental and noise pollution, two-stroke engines reside far towards the 'bad' side. So long as you don't run me over by riding fast and reckless with extra electrical power, that 'illegal' use is no skin off my nose.

 

[TechWriter1]

Noise, I wouldn’t worry about it….
Normal conversation (3-5') = 60-70dB
RevoPower Wheel =71 dB
Telephone dial tone =80dB
City Traffic (inside car) =85dB
Subway train at 200' 95dB

Engine, It is a modified 2 stroke with dual exhaust, runs efficient, no order. Not like a 2 stroke you might have in your lawn mower.

Well.. along those lines.. 80v x 40 amps is not exactly " legal " either

Illegal does not necessarily mean more harmful. On the continuum of environmental and noise pollution, two-stroke engines reside far towards the 'bad' side. So long as you don't run me over by riding fast and reckless with extra electrical power, that 'illegal' use is no skin off my nose.

 

[Ypedal]

yeah.. problem there..

You know guys like uh.... Fetcher !.. yeah.. he'd rip that extra exhaust right off.. i'm sure ! :wink:

hehe..

 

[fechter]

Ooh, and we could add a nitrous oxide tank for turbo boost. The ICE equivalent of over-volting. You could also use the nitrous to spray uncooperative law enforcement officials.