Ride the Rockies, Stories from an electric cyclist...

Very nice ride, Josh! Congrats.

I was gunna sign up for it, but got worried about having to ride in serious rainstorm(s), as has happened in some years (not this one, in a way unfortunately because it sure would help with the awful fires).

How is your bike set up for rain? A worry? Mine have sort of exposed CC HV's, wiring, and not sure I'd wanta soak an Astro.

Also, I see you used more than 40AH on one ride. Did you recharge along the way somehow?

Thanx,

H3D
Boulder, CO.
 
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the kind comments and encouragement.

Yes, we used a second battery pack for this ride, for 24 volts, and 40 amp hours.

We are developing a carbon fiber shell that will cover our batteries, and controller. We just had to run it, and risk it. Made out fine, just a little tiny bit of water, but was fine.

We will continue to develop protection from the rain. Right now, we try to keep it dry, and try not to worry in a light little rain.

Peace, Josh K.
 
Josh, it is great to see results like these! Successful completion of the worst torture test I could imagine. Great to see your reliability and power stats, day after day. Got to love the benefits of a well integrated planetary!
 
Hi Big Moose,

Hey, thank you kindly. Yes, this is the very best system that we have ever run, and this was the most challenging ride that I have ever done.

The equipment really stood up to the challenge well. I am very excited about this drivetrain set up, and the possibilities it represents.

I am starting to think about a rider controlled regen system that could freewheel when needed, and then add in the right amount of
charge as the batteries can take it.

Josh K.
 
I must Say, Ride the Rockies is a very well planned event.

Lot's of clear road markings, lot's of well equipped rest areas, lot's of water.

It was hot, and dry out there, and I must have gone through a gallon and a half of water and Gatorade a day.

It was great to pull into a rest area, fill up on fluids, eat some snacks, and head out again before cooling down too much.

I rode hard, and pounded the pedals, as much as possible. I actually rode the best ride of my life, and my body held up well.
Kinda surprised myself and my abilities at 43 years old now. I have been riding since January of this year, everyday, as I
parked my car. But, when being driven out to the event, I got a little nervous, watching these big hills and miles go by. I am
really glad I did it, and look forward to doing it again, hopefully with a crew of E bikers next time to camp with, ride with,
and to share stories from the road.

Special thanks to my partner Elana, for helping out soo much during the ride, including setting up camp, breaking it down
as we rode away, and driving to the next camping spot to set up again! Frosty tents in the am was another thing to work
with, as we had to stay warm at night. Nice to have a new sleeping bag! Life is good.

Peace, Josh K.
 

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There is something special about traveling at the speed of bicycling through the countryside.

You see soo much life, and neat things that people make, and leave out to be seen by passers by.

This is Mark, we met near a town called Paonia. They say Paonia is where everyone from Crusty Butt moves to
to retire! Mark has been on the road since January too, but he keeps on riding, from town to town. Came up
from New Mexico, and is headed up to Washington, through Colorado. 42 years old, and on the road. Nice cargo
bike. Says he has two 600 watt motors at home, for commuting, 16 miles down hill into town, and 16 miles back
up hill to home, but with the assist, he can go both ways, in under an hour now. Great for carrying groceries.

Here is a shot of some Burners, doing some fire dancing in town one night. Lot's of entertainment, if you have the
energies to go out at night, after riding hard for 6 hours or so, and scrambling to help set up camp and grab a shower,
and some pasta...

Here is Elana, protesting against the no sniveling sign in Carbondale...

Okay, got to get back to the shop to build some new frames, Peace, Josh K.
 

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Hi Folks,

Soo, what is it like to Ride the Rockies on a new Electric Mountain touring bike with over 2,000 Roadies?

What is like to pass absolutely hundreds and hundreds of roadies per hour?

How to make friends with traditional pedal Kickers...

My video shot live, on Location, at Ride the Rockies, 2012. I was using GoEnthusiast, which is like GOPRO, but different...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZz783LArls&feature=plcp

Josh K.
 
Hey Josh! Don't know how I missed this thread since we share a couple of interests.

I did RTR the old fashioned way this year (2012). Next year I might go electric if my compadres don't give me too much sh*t!

Josh K. said:
Hi Folks,

Okay, Just the Facts, Here are the stats:

Day one, Gunnison to Hotchkiss
81.84 Miles
39.75 Amp hours
989 Watt Hours
12.1 Watt hours Per mile
39 MPH max speed
17 MPH Average Speed !
4 hours, 42 Min
3,077 ft climb.
Here are my stats ...
Day One
http://app.strava.com/activities/10936522
18.9mph avg
44.6mph max
4hr 13min
135bpm

Josh K. said:
Day Two, Hotchkiss to Carbondale
70.68 Miles
32.68 Amp Hours
827 watt hours
11.7 watt hours per mile
37 MPH top speed
15.8 Average speed
4 hours, 28 Min.
3,901 ft. climb.
Day Two
http://app.strava.com/activities/10936523
17mph avg
49.7mph max
4hr 1min
136bpm

Josh K. said:
Day Three, Carbondale to Leadville
69.79 Miles
40.33 Amp hours
1,009 watt hours
14.5 watt hours per mile
42 MPH top speed
14.5 Average speed
4 hours, 48 Min.
7, 379 ft. Climb!
Day Three
This was absolutely killer. Still getting to the fat burning zone.
http://app.strava.com/activities/10936520
14.4mph avg
44.2mph max
5hr 56min
8th out of 99 up the mountain
130bpm

Josh K. said:
Day four, Leadville to Granby
99.52 miles
37.15 Amp Hours
949 watt hours
9.5 watt hours per mile !
49 MPH top speed
15 MPH Average speed
6 hours, 19 Min
43 amp max draw
4,058 ft climb
Day Four
Me = Drove the van forward on day 4 and had a beer or two!

Josh K. said:
Day Five, Granby to Estes Park
67.9 Miles
36.7 Amp Hours
921 watt hours
13.6 watt hours per mile
35 mph top speed
14 mph average speed
4 hours, 37 Min
57 max amp draw
4,780 ft climb
Day Five
Came back with a vengeance -
http://app.strava.com/activities/10936513
16.6mph avg
50.9mph max
3hr 47min
133bpm
8th out of 290 on the decent. Go fast!

Josh K. said:
Day Six, Estes Park to Fort Collins
52.5 Miles
26.65 Amp hours
672.21 watt hours
12.8 watt hours per mile
48 MPH max speed
2 hours, 15 Min
55 amp max draw
1,742 foot climb
Day Six
Absolutely threw it down on the last day -
http://app.strava.com/activities/10936508
23.2mph avg
51.8mph max
1hr 59min
132bpm
10th out of 276 from Sheilds North 57th to Harmony at 27.3mph

Josh K. said:
Peace, Josh K. More info? Please Check out our new website at http://www.runaboutcycles.com

I want to drop about 5 more pounds of body weight and do this with a commuter booster in June. We might do Tour of Colorado instead though.

I built up a 15.2lb (6.9kg) road bike for this ride. Next year with 444whr on tap my bike should weigh about 25lbs. But I tell you what - Wiggins wouldn't have a chance. haha.
 
So, Now that some time has passed, and we have survived the end of the world, I am taking some time to think and write about
electric cycling. I am interested in sharing some experiences, and am asking you, for your productive ideas.

This Ride the Rockies, has been the pinnacle of my cycling career. Starting out as a BMX racer as a kid, then a Mnt Bike racer,
sponsored by slingshot, I rode one of the very first suspended frames in the industry. Then for the last ten years, designing,
building, and riding bikes and trikes, with a focus on electric assist. It's been almost 40 years of pushing pedals, Ehy?

The challenge for me, is to get acceptance, to find our place, and ride with our people. Sometimes, you just feel like the ugly
duckling, trying to fit in somewhere. While this ride was very rewarding, and enjoyable, and amazing, it was very challenging.
Not only because I designed, and hand built the bike. Not only because I spent months riding each week to be as prepared as
I could, somewhat training for the ride. Not because it cost so much to do the event, both energy and monies, But because
of the people, the mentality, and the comments.

Now, just to let you know, I do ride my bike, because I love to ride, and feel the freedom that comes with it. I ride hard, and
Push myself to ride at the very best of my abilities, every-time I ride. Not that I am racing everyone, it's just a natural push
that we all feel, when riding in groups, and with people who love to ride, and go through time and space like in flight.

So, I guess it was kinda weird for me to sign up to ride with 2,000 roadies, for a week through the mountains. Lot's of serious
lycra clad folks, some with race aspirations, some in teams, some from the Tour De france, some for long distance solo riding.
For me, it was an opportunity to ride with real riders, who love to ride, and were going for distance, and to challenge
themselves to some of the most difficult riding available to us, with a great support team to make it happen. The crew on
ride the rockies was great, providing great shelter, food, snacks, medical care and marking the roads to ride. But, the
challenge was with the riders, who seem to have a total distain for this budding industry.

I mean, I got hundreds of nasty looks per day, and hundreds of non supportive comments, to flat out attacks against me. We
had folks who would say the meanest things while riding out on the road, and climbing for hours on end. Cheater, was the
most common comment, along with faggot, asshole, why would you be here, why not just ride a motor cycle, here comes
that guy again, Cheat, motor man, and even from the special Olympics support team, why pedal? Sigh.

Most of the time, I would slow up for a moment, and explain that I had designed, engineered, hand built this bike, and
that I am testing it out in hopes to produce it to help people with invisible disabilities to ride again. And many times,
people would get it, and have a positive comment, like keep up the good work. In which, I would feel better, knowing
that another person may have a new idea about what we are trying to do. But sometimes, it would not matter, and the
attacks would keep on coming. Most of the time I would shake it off, and keep on riding as hard as I could, doing the
best that I could, climbing these mountains for three to four hours at a time. Granted, I was flying past hundreds of roadies
per hour at 15-17 mph, while they were grinding away at 5-6 mph. Sometimes a true athlete would dump over 750 watts
and catch up to talk with me, and I would ease up to talk for a moment, then they would fade back with the rest of the
pack.

One guy on a recumbent, flat out attacked me, my bike, my character, who I am as a person, and went on and on. I almost
lost my composure, and wanted to just knock him off the cliff that we were riding by. I wanted to really hurt him, as he
had been hurting me. He had no idea of who I am, what I had done, and do, to be at places like this. Turns out, he claims
that he is a designer of oil refinery plants, and maybe he saw a disruptive technology passing him by. The second day he
attacked, I almost let him have it, and am thankful another rider broke us up, and helped me to get back on track. I know
that hurting him, would not help anything, and it would not show the rest of the crowd not to mess with me. I had to be
better than that, but, I was at my threshold for being able to continue on. And I did, I lay the hammer down, sped up to
almost 20 mph on that climb, and dusted him, big time. Then I backed off, and brought my cadence back to a proper
speed, my amp draw back to reality, to make the long haul, and settled in to continue on. Sigh.

So, how do we gain acceptance? I am a life long cyclist, and I am riding the next generation in advanced technology. They
chose to use gears, chains, heart rate monitors, GPS, Enhanced water supplements, maybe some dopers out there from
the racing industry...where do we draw the line. This was not a race. We all choose our equipment. We all rode at our
ability. These advanced technologies are here, and are making a place at the table, one way, or another.

How does the electric cyclist gain acceptance, in the cycling community. I recently read through a book at our local
bike/coffee used book store, and it was about the bike tribe. BMX, roadies, fixies, mnt bikers, touring bikes...no
electrics included. The National Handmade Bike Show is coming up in my home state, and they would not even write
back to me, when I submitted my application with this bike, and our trikes, as I have been hand making these since
1999, when I got into it. Rocky Mountain Flyer Magazine refuses to write back to me, as I have sent them a very nice
write up upon this ride, with these photos that I have shared with our E bike community on endllessphere. The only
folks I can get a little recognition from are the motorcycle gang folks, like when I went and climbed Mount Washington
at the Harley days, part of a biker rally. Or during the Portland International Raceway, human powered championships,
when we worked hard to get a electric assist devision. The Pikes Peak folks are about done with us, after the Optipunk
shenanigans.

I want to see electric cyclist groups of riders, riding at races, riding with riders in cycling event, allowed on bike paths,
welcomed to be there, as one of the group of cyclists. We are part of the solution, we have values to create in society,
we help people to be able to ride with others, and to do work. It seems to be catching on, as more and more companies
are making it to the industry trade shows. But, how do we become legitimate in the eyes of other cyclists. How do we
separate ourselves from the people who slap weed wacker motors onto junk bikes, and make everyone cringe...how
do we find our place at the table. At least we don't have Lance Armstrong screwing up our public image right now!

Ideas? rants and raves welcome. Peace, Josh K.
 

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i think the real answer is that it will become mainstream when the car becomes unaffordable for most people.oil was $12 in 1997-98, $112 now. 15 years. wanna guess 2023?

there are a lot of peole talking how the shale gas and oil revolution will make oil cheap again but they ignore the reality of how expensive it is to produce from the source rock, and ignore the chinese and indian markets and africa after that. and the saudis are still having to cut bacck on exports so they have enuff oil to run their air conditioners.

this also assumes the luddites can not stop the continued development of multistage hydraulic fracturing. if they do that, all bets are off.
 
hi josh
wonderful work you and ron are doing with the rocha edrive, we need more quality edrives like this to help keep the cheap off shore edrives
out of north america

i was very dissapointed with the recumbent rider on the RtR tour that treated you so badly, i r one
i always imagined that recum riders were intelligent people that have shown that they can think outside the diamond frame box
that we know that a bike can be safer, more comfortable and more efficient and
because of the great creativity and diversity of designs of recum bikes, we show our tolerance of differences
to get that comfort and safety we rider 'goofy' looking bikes, sometimes taking abuse and ridicule but confident in the knowledge that we're
riding the 'right' bike and they're riding the 'wrong' bike but that anyone riding a bike is one less person in a car, so it's all good
but that that rider couldn't accept the next step in the evolution of the bike, just shows the misconceptions and prejudices
that society has about ebikes
i've been called a cheater for riding a comfortable recum, that you're supposed to be uncomfortable on a bike,
so i'm not surprised that ebikes are seen as 'cheating' as being electric motorcycles or escooters
the cycling world, never mind the non-cycling world don't understand that mid or BB edrives must be pedalled
as the motor depends on the 60-100 cadence for it to be in it's 'efficiency band'
in actuality, when pedalling on the flat at a 'normal' 15kph, the speed that most recreational cyclists are comfortable at,
an erider is using all pedal and no e-assist and so is getting exercise
edrive's great advantage is to negate any hills and headwinds you may encounter so you get to your destination, the grocery store say
refreshed and that you have gotten some exercise but you're not all heaving and sweaty from that killer hill that you had to climb

but you're looking for love in all the wrong places, if you think you and your ebike will ever be accepted by the hairshirt lycra crowd
it's their rigid mindset that a bike is just an exercise machine, something to test them,
they will think nothing of going on a gruelling 2 hour training course but
it wouldn't even cross their mind to use their bike as a transportation tool and
take their bike to the grocery store, no they'll jump in the car! and they call you a cheater!!!
the large number of riders doing the RtR aren't doing it for the wonderful scenery and the comraderie, etc.
it's just a test, a challenge, so they can say they survived the RtR!
it's like doing the hawiian ironman triathlon or doing the boston marathon, those same riders will be back next year
trying to shave time off, to do a personal best
course it didn't help that you kicked sand in their faces by blowing by them on the climbs!
had you been a handicapped person using e-assist they would have been patting you on the back but because they see you as an able bodied person who should be capable of gutting it out, you're a cheater but that's their mindset again
edrive is going to allow anyone, old, young, handicapped to come back to cycling and to participate in events like RtR
that would never have been able to even think of doing it, before edrives
maybe the lycra crowd see that and realise that it's the end of the exclusivity and prestige of saying they conquered the RtR
because edrive makes it accessible to anyone
as i use that word accessible i think that everyone would say that buildings etc. should be accessible to all people whatever their 'handicapp'
but lyrcas don't want rides like the RtR to be universally accessible, kind of close minded and selfish, perhaps NIMBY !
where you will 'find the love' and acceptance you pine for is the 90% of the population that will see the ebike as a cheap form of transportation, to run errands, to make their recreational rides 'flatter'
to possibly replace the second car in a family for the 80% or the trips we now use a car for,
that are taken solo, that are under 7km one way (i'm a city slicker) and it's already happening in europe, we're just 10 years behind!
in europe, manual pedal bike sales are flat but ebike sales are exploding but it has taken a huge organized effort on the part of extraenergy
an LEV advocacy group to help bring about that acceptance
with a transport truck loaded with a demo track (simulated hills) and various ebikes donated by participating manufacturers
they have travelled all over europe setting up demos at fairs, shopping malls where joe average can try them out
no sense having demo tracks at events like interbike, you're preaching to the converted, joe public needs to try them and
extrenergy says that everyone that does, leaves with a smile on their face and
a new appreciation of what an ebike can bring to the quality of their lives

i think we should move away from an on demand throttle system as it gives the impression to the general public that ebikes are just stripped down escooters and promotes the idea that an erider is 'cheating'
a torque sensor, software controlled pedelec that must be pedalled for e-assist to kick in,
helps dispel that 'cheating' misconception
also these are highend sophisticated BB or mid drive ebikes, that are generally german designed and built, that as yet,
the off shore manufacturers can't come close to
and that's where north american ingenuity can shine too, to keep cheap off shore products from invading our market by providing high quality edrive systems, the rocha edrive among others,
yes more expensive but if the quality and reliability are built in, people will buy into it
as with cars, why did the japanese get such a hold on our market, high quality and reliabilty
i'll buy a cheap pair of off shore jeans, what's the worst that can happen to me if they fail? the embarrassment of a blown out ass!
if an cheap ebike battery or motor fails in the middle of nowhere, a bit more serious!
i know i'll take flack for this but we should move away from hub drive motors for the same reasons
we should move towards quality bb mid drives, off shore manufacturers dominate the hub drive market
hub drives can't touch BB drives on hills and consumers want to have the confidence in their ebike
that they can travel unconcerned over any terrain
and BB drives are more efficient and so don't need huge battery packs like the mega hubs do, saving $$$ on an already expensive component
a prominent futurist, can't remember his name, predicted that an ebike, multifunction, leaning towards a worksbike,
will be the next PC, iPhone, iPad and it's on that kind of a bike, hauling loads uphills, that the BB drive shines
a multifunction, one size fits all, low step through frame, with a safer, crankforward flat foot geometry,
could the next wave, the 'VW Beetle' of the bike world!

keep up the work on the rocha edrive josh and next year, carry a can of pepper spray for those yappy lycra mutts
 
Josh,

Sorry, but not surprised, at the reaction you get from "serious" bikers. The bicycle is the perfect machine, but the people who ride them aren't.

Glad to see your post. It has been awhile, and I was worried since I can't seem to get your site to come up lately. Is it down, or is it me?

Warren
 
Unfortunately a lot of people are immature/hypocritical/un-educated/pack-mentality... fill in the blank.

Many members on the Sphere aren't saints either because all "lycras" are a-holes in their mind. OK - whatever. :roll:

Hmmmmmm... I think life is a little more complex than that.

Some of the guys I race Mountain bikes with actually think an e-bike will corrupt me somehow. What!?!?? Then they turn around and ride their motorcycle during the week. <Very interesting.>

Nope, I put in the miles for myself... and myself alone. Be it on an e-bike or regular bike. My goal is not to drive my car and keep my fitness as high as I can. That is all. E-biking really helps since my commute is 25 miles one way. Try doing that day after day into a 15mph headwind. No dice.

So don't sweat it. An e-bike is a transportation tool... a hobby... an experiment. An art project for some. A technical challenge. Part of a green movement. You name it. It's fun and satisfying.

People verbally attacking you just shows that they are ignorant on many levels. Lead by example. What you could do is type up a few paragraphs about the benefits of e-bikes, fold a bunch of them up and hand them out and just say - "Please read". 8)
 
I took a trip to my local REI today which is about 15+ miles. Took the scenic route which means I explored routes I've never taken. Probably wouldn't have done it if it weren't for the electric assist. A few years ago, I probably would have just drove my car there and taken the ohso ordinary drive to get there. Now that I've been car free for 2 years now, I know the pleasures of simply slowing down and just enjoying the outdoors. I applaud your commitment to see how this quiet electric revolution can coexist with other traditional forms of transportation :!:
 
Josh K. said:
Sneak Peak at a new frame design coming together...Sassy-

Josh K.

Beautiful work Josh !
I'm not a competitor, but a DIYer, and am curious how you made those very aesthetic and practical bends in chrome-moly steel ?
 
I think it comes down that you were making a stand for electric bikes, being the only electric bike in the entire competition.

It's not really fair for an electric bike to compete against pedal bikes...in essence you were in a class of your own.

Maybe if there was a class of electric bikes with 10 bikes in it or something it would be different.

Oh never mind.....

tiger.jpg
 
Green Machine said:
I think it comes down that you were making a stand for electric bikes, being the only electric bike in the entire competition.

It's not really fair for an electric bike to compete against pedal bikes...in essence you were in a class of your own.

That is what makes some peoples behavior so bizarre. Ride the Rockies in NOT a competition. It is just a really long tour over the Rock Mountains that is a week long. You would think that most are out there for personal reasons. But I do watch how fast everyone else is riding just get an idea of my current fitness level. Because fitness goes up and down like the tide goes in and out. But if I ever get passed I don't get mad that someone is in better shape than me - that's just crazy.

Josh, wish I would have ran into you out there last year. Although you might have got annoyed after I peppered you with a 101 technical questions. :mrgreen:

Hearing all the bad mouthing you had to deal with actually makes me want to do it electric even more. I need to crunch some numbers. If I weigh 155lbs and my bike weighs 25 how many watts would I need to go up a 7% grade at 20mph? I can put out about 250 watts continuously. But definitely more if it would only take 45 to 70 minutes to summit. 300w might be doable multiple days in a row since it would be a short period of time.

OK. Using this calculator - http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm

I would only need an additional 395 watts. That's only 300 to 460 watt*hours. So 4 to 5 packs of 6S 5000 mAh LiPo on any given day. Beautiful. The extra weight would help on the decent as well. Now I just need to get my hands on a commuter booster or equivalent. Weight is key.
 
Thank you guys so much for your supportive words and ideas, I do apreceate that.
It's been a long haul, and I am taking a break right now to rebuild, rethink, and
To become empowered to take this preproduction prototype to market.
I will make a presentation at interbike on my new book that I am writing, to empower the electric cyclist with vital info on improving efficiencies to go the
Distance.
On a note about bending chromoly, it took about ten years to relize how to not let it slip, as we pull it through the dies. Now, with expensive rollers and proper dies, we are able to recreate these bends at will.

With concentrated effort, we would love to bring systems like this to market, and to be able to bring them around the country to different events and rides for people to try, to race, and to experience.
Thanks again, Josh K. On the Road.
 
Thanks Josh for the info on the 4130 bending. I knew it wouldn't be easy.
I love to design (mostly furniture) and the ellipse is one of my favorite elements.

As far as the negative comments you received, those persons have severe ego problems, rather than a more sensible respect and liking for their fellow bicycle
lovers. Of course all bicyclists, as a small minority up against oil burners, need to stick together and respect each other, having nothing to do with electric or non-electric.
I am totally behind you and your work; more power to you and all of us electric
bike lovers.

Eventually we should have "Free Energy" motors on bicycles taping the endless field of "Cosmic Energy" or "Radiant Energy" as Tesla called it. He had it working 114 years ago, and it was bettered by many since. His son said he recalled his Pierce Arrow with two electric motors working the radiant field with no batteries needed or used.
Something to think about or Google and Youtube, as I've done.
 
Great to hear from you again, Josh! Your report here inspired my own Tour of the North.

Since then, I've become more interested in Audax/Randoneuring. This involves the unsupported long-distance riding between controls within (fairly generous) time limits. Times are not taken. In fact, there is a maximum average speed limit of about 18mph. No penalty if you go faster - you just have to wait until the next control opens. As the saying goes, Sportive riders (like those on the RtR) like to pretend they are racing; Audax riders like to pretend they are not. Some like to plod on through at 10mph without stopping; others wait as long as they dare before starting the next leg. This video gives a flavour.

I think electrical assistance is ideal for making this kind of riding accessible. A good road-legal ebike should be able to complete a 100k Audax without spending too much on batteries, and the same batteries, plus a reasonably fast charger, can get you round a 200 well within the limit. The longer multi-day rides can be see as a series of 200s with a chance to rest and fully recharge. The real challenge is 300k in less than 20 hours, which many ride straight through without sleep. If you were using much over 10wh/mile it would be tricky to carry enough battery or arrange charging. That might be a nice challenge for electric-only velomobiles too.

In short, this is one form of cycle sport where ebikes could participate equally without being seen as 'cheating'. Even for someone relying entirely on electrical power, a 100k will involve more than three hours in the saddle and be by no means trivial. Why not get in touch with Randonneurs USA and make a pitch?
 
"In short, this is one form of cycle sport where ebikes could participate equally without being seen as 'cheating'."

I agree that many randonneur riders are more laid back than the average roadie. But I don't think they would take you at all seriously...besides being against the rules.

From the rules:
Any form of human-powered vehicle is acceptable. The only stipulation is that the vehicle must be powered solely by the rider.

Last June, I rode along for a few minutes with a half dozen guys doing a 600K event. They were quite friendly, but I left after a few minutes, as I was feeling a little foolish. I had been feeling pretty smug about my 60 miles, so far, but they had done 170 miles already, and would finish by the next morning. I love riding my bikes, but never had the genes to be that good.
 
Wow...

first read of this thread... Fantastic read, awesome work Josh, and love your internal machinations and thoughts on e-biking.

Getting people to change their attitudes so that they can encompass the concept that Bicycles are a form of transport, over here in AUS as well as over there in USA seems to be a hell of a challenge.

Wonder how the Europeans managed to do it...

Oh and congrats for not punching out that nasty recumbent rider... funny how these days (age of 47 prolly has much to do with it) I am more happy with myself when I dont kick someone's arse than when I do :)

Joe
 
Hey thanks Joe,

I appreciate the support. These ideas mean a lot to me, and some of our fellow Electric cyclists.

We look forward to coming over to your part of the world sometime, to ride, and see more of the world.

Josh K.
 
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