Right Cycle Analistv3 setup for this dummy?

[BBSHDHans]

Hey guys, I’ a totally newby struggling hard to setup my DIY E bike :
Motor: Bafang BBSHD no stock controller, no Bafang display
Controller: Grin Phaserunner MT latest model , configured with BBSHD settings from Grin website
Original Grin harness
Cycle Analist v3 connected to Phaserunner
3 button dig/Ana. Aux switch Grin
Battery: 48v 18Ah
Bafang Thump trottle, connected to CA 3 with jst plug

Everything set up ok, but ONE BIG problem:
Configured 5 step PAS level, level 1 is no assist.
When I switch to level 2 my motor start spinning much to hard and the system shuts off when I hit the road.
On throttle without level pedal assist riding works fine....
I think some adjustments are not ok....

Would you guys be so kind to correct them for the best settings of this configuration?

I took some pics of my settings

Thanks in advance!

 

[E-HP]

When I switch to level 2 my motor start spinning much to hard and the system shuts off when I hit the road.

Can you provide more details on what you mean?

 

[BBSHDHans]

E-HP , Thanks for your reply:

As I said I configured my 3 button slim D-aux to switch pas levels (5)
Level 1 no assist
Level 2 -5 a no smooth start issue ( like the way it did with the stock Bafang controller) therefore sudden uncontrolled power and shutdown of the system by CA3 or Phaserunner
I think some settings are not ok
I need a setting list for the CA3 to manage my Bafang BBShd .
Perhaps someone with the same specs?

Thanks !

 

[ZeroEm]

by BBSHDHans » Oct 31 2020 5:57pm

E-HP , Thanks for your reply:

As I said I configured my 3 button slim D-aux to switch pas levels (5)
Level 1 no assist
Level 2 -5 a no smooth start issue ( like the way it did with the stock Bafang controller) therefore sudden uncontrolled power and shutdown of the system by CA3 or Phaserunner
I think some settings are not ok
I need a setting list for the CA3 to manage my Bafang BBShd .
Perhaps someone with the same specs?

Thanks !

I don't have a phaserunner or have been connecting the CA3 to my PC to look at settings.
I do run a Digital switch for my PAS and have a analog switch which is currently being used to limit max motor power.

I set up my Digital switch with the CA3 buttons, so your screen shots do not match exactly what I have seen on the CA3, but close.

(PAS Config Settings) What caught my eye is Assistant Start Level shows 500 w. I'm not sure if it's 500 w on level 2 or if it's the max power for PAS that is divided by 5 = 125w. But if it takes off with to much power it is not 125 w.

I have a PAS max power but not a starting level. Mine is set to 5 levels and level 1 is set to 0 w. level 2 is 25% of max power is over 100 w.

 

[E-HP]

(PAS Config Settings) What caught my eye is Assistant Start Level shows 500 w. I'm not sure if it's 500 w on level 2 or if it's the max power for PAS that is divided by 5 = 125w. But if it takes off with to much power it is not 125 w.

Based on the manual, with the digital aux levels set to 5, using basic power for PAS, the levels would be 250W, 312.5W, 375W, 437.5W, 500W. I'm wondering if it's something electrical, rather than the setup.

 

[BBSHDHans]

Thanks for your replies guys,

As you described I programmed my digital ( aux) switch in 5 levels, (500W level 5 max assist)
I have the same result with lower power levels.
1 ). no assist ( ordenary human power)
2 ) 500/4= 125w gives a huge abrupt wheelie
3 ) 250w
4) 375w
5) 500w —————-all the same effect and shutoff the system

I already read the manual 10 times but can’t figure out.

Already sent this story to Grin for some official help ( perhaps some electrically wrong)

As I described I did the advised Phaserunner suite startup proces several times, following the setup of the CA3.

E bike shops in my surrounding (The Hague , Netherlands) neighborhood won’t -or -aren’t able to help (hate DIY Bafang bikes and services only their own expensive brands.

 

[ZeroEm]

by E-HP » Oct 31 2020 7:45pm

ZeroEm wrote: ↑Oct 31 2020 7:01pm

(PAS Config Settings) What caught my eye is Assistant Start Level shows 500 w. I'm not sure if it's 500 w on level 2 or if it's the max power for PAS that is divided by 5 = 125w. But if it takes off with to much power it is not 125 w.

Based on the manual, with the digital aux levels set to 5, using basic power for PAS, the levels would be 250W, 312.5W, 375W, 437.5W, 500W. I'm wondering if it's something electrical, rather than the setup.

I will need to read that part. Two areas to setup PAS in CA3. "Basic" and "Config". I have never setup the Presets in CA3. I can setup as many levels of PAS as desired. Had 7 levels at one time. My current max PAS power is 700w. I may have 6 levels set. I have it reduce power as cadence is increased. When i'm peddling at 80 cadence it is assisting at 75w but at 50 it's more like 150w.

I will read up and see what all of you are doing. because if his first level is 0 and the basic 5 are " 250W, 312.5W, 375W, 437.5W, 500W." I count 6 levels not 5.

 

[ZeroEm]

Did not mean to show bad math, my brain just sorta figures ahead. 5 levels at 500w is not 125w but it is if the first is 0, so it is 4 levels, first is not counted.

I see in the manual in Basic setup you can pick a pre-configured device if listed. It would load default setup values. I did not do that. So is it still pre-configured if you modify one setting?

 

[E-HP]

Did not mean to show bad math, my brain just sorta figures ahead. 5 levels at 500w is not 125w but it is if the first is 0, so it is 4 levels, first is not counted.

I see in the manual in Basic setup you can pick a pre-configured device if listed. It would load default setup values. I did not do that. So is it still pre-configured if you modify one setting?

Ya you're right, I downloaded the screen shots so I could zoom in and see the settings/numbers. I should go to the optometrist while they're not locked down.

 

[HrKlev]

Your PAS ramp up of 0.02V/s is unnaturally low. Dont know, but maybe it causes some erratic behaviour. If your throttle works fine at 2, try to set the PAS ramp up to 2 as well.

Also, I would set the fast ramp up to 2 as well as an initial setting, and/or set fast threshold to 0.

 

[ZeroEm]

I had to turn on windows magnifier to see did not want to down load the images.
I still don't know why it the motor kicks in hard until shut off. I have not played with all the setting in CA3 and was just wondering about the initial start at 500w but understand it better. Maybe he does have bad wiring, I have no experience with mid-drives.

 

[BBSHDHans]

Thanks for all your replies guys,
I got the original BBShd wiring harness from Grin...
I’ve been playing with Sévery setting to cure my problem: today the system didn’t shut off, but I can’t feel a difference between level 2 compared to level 5 : I feel no difference...it seems to be all the time the full watts, although on the CA3 the pop-up screen shows the right wattage...
I can’t regulate a relaxed, smooth granny startup spin,
It’s a pity I can’t find a proved safe setting for my system at Grinns website for beginner noobs, to be further modified when everything works fine ( I think I chose the wrong controller set, I am not a electric scientist )


48v 18 A battery
BBShd
Phaserunner
CA3
Grin 3-button auxD external switch

 

[ZeroEm]

by BBSHDHans

It's not that hard to set up, something is wrong I just don't know what it is! Wished I was close by would take a look. I have not explored all of CA3 just adjust the few settings that I wanted to change, learned long time ago not to just mess with settings. Unless you do it one at a time and test.

Mine as soon as my PAS engauges it show me my watts but some times it jumps up higher than set for a split second. You say it shows the right wattage. What wattage is it showing?

 

[BBSHDHans]

@ZeroEom,
As I wrote The wattage corresponding with the pas steps, but I feel no difference between them in more assisting power, step 2 seems the same as step 5.

 

[ZeroEm]

I would try to set it at a very low like 200w max and see it it would come in at 50w. If it does not then I would disconnect the digital switch and set pas at a low level and try it. Start trying isolate the cause. I'm guessing you have the Analog 3 speed switch connected with the digital switch. If it works then ok with out switches then add the digital switch with out the Analog switch and try to set it up again.

 

[HrKlev]

Thanks for all your replies guys,
I got the original BBShd wiring harness from Grin...
I’ve been playing with Sévery setting to cure my problem: today the system didn’t shut off, but I can’t feel a difference between level 2 compared to level 5 : I feel no difference...it seems to be all the time the full watts, although on the CA3 the pop-up screen shows the right wattage...
I can’t regulate a relaxed, smooth granny startup spin,
It’s a pity I can’t find a proved safe setting for my system at Grinns website for beginner noobs, to be further modified when everything works fine ( I think I chose the wrong controller set, I am not a electric scientist )


48v 18 A battery
BBShd
Phaserunner
CA3
Grin 3-button auxD external switch

Did you try the settings I proposed? It is impossible to help you without any feedback, and if you are playing with every setting. Can you post the settings you have right now? PAS ramp, fast ramp and also power feedback gain is not where they should be in the screenshots on top of the page.

I just noticed: Shunt resistance should be 1 (+/- some hundredths, it is marked on your phaserunner. But 1 works fine for now), not 40 like in the screenshot, this is imortant!

I also agree with trying to isolate the problem and forget the pas level switch for now, you need to get the PAS to work with one level first.

If you go to the menu where you see throttle in and throttle out you can observe the throttle out behaviour when the situation occurs. This is a very helpful menu. What happens when you get the abrupt starts? Does it ramp right up to 3+ V ?

 

[NCC1941]

As HrKlev pointed out, that shunt resistance value under Calibration Settings is eliminating any possibility of correct behavior, until you fix it. That should be first priority.

With the wrong shunt resistance value, the CA3 is reading incorrect wattage values, and using that bad information to send bad throttle commands back to the BBSHD. 1mOhm (Phaserunner correct value) vs. 40mOhm (your set value) is so far wrong that the wild on/off motor behavior you're experiencing makes perfect sense.

 

[BBSHDHans]

@HrKlev and helping others:
You’re right I’ve played to much to get a safe working setting:
I configured my settings just as you advised:
Even still the same behavior
Here the pic’s:

Any further advise to get the right settings?

Thanks in advance, hoping to get it right before the lockdown is over (....)

 

[ZeroEm]

Don't know much about the Bafang BBSHD, In the first pic in this thread shows the motor setup. It does not look right, Does the Bafang BBSHD have 23 poles and is it a 8Kv motor or more like 73Kv with a 23:1 gear reduction. Some one correct me.

 

[NCC1941]

Are you using an external shunt, or are you plugging your CA3 directly in to your Phaserunner?

If your CA3 is plugged in to your Phaserunner, your shunt value is still 20x too high. It needs to be set to 1 mOhm, not 20 or 40. Your CA3 is demanding 20x more power output than it thinks it is.

 

[BBSHDHans]

Problem solved!!!
Thanks to you all, giving me the right values.
I’m very happy and of course saved these precious settings.
Learnt a lot, due to this fantastic forum.
Now up to the next update: placing a Rohloff 14 speedhub driveline, and finding a space for a 48v 50Ah lipo battery (13kgs) to obtain a nice travel distance.