Scoring theElectric Mini-Lease users pleased (Kim incorrect)

MitchJi

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Hi,

Results:
Owners: pleased
Kim: incorrect :p :lol:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/28/automobiles/28ELECTRIC.html
Scoring the Electric Mini

TURNS out there’s a sure-fire way to get the public excited about electric cars: let people have them. After reviewing 1,800 applications on a company Web site, BMW’s Mini division selected 450 people last year to lease its all-electric Mini E for a full year in New York, New Jersey and greater Los Angeles.

28ELECTRIC-span-articleLarge.jpg

PUSHING THE LIMITS Don Young, a ferry captain, took his Mini E on a 1,090-mile trip

Along with the $110,000 Tesla Roadster, of which more than 1,000 have been sold, the Mini is the only highway-legal electric vehicle on the American road in any meaningful numbers.

In a nation with 246 million internal-combustion cars, E.V.’s have spent decades on the fringes. But automakers seem ready to roll out the first E.V.’s and plug-in hybrids with the kind of range, performance and costs that might attract average Americans. Nissan plans to sell its $30,000 Leaf subcompact in a few markets by year-end; General Motors will offer its Chevrolet Volt plug-in hybrid around the same time.

While the Mini E is not available in showrooms, the company is using its “Pioneers” to give real-world feedback on a car that can go more than 100 miles on a charge and has no tailpipe emissions. Those consumers have become vocal proponents of E.V.’s.

Don Young and his wife, Dr. JoAnn Young, pay the requisite $850 a month to lease their Mini E — more than triple the lease rate for a base-model Mini Cooper. While that may seem high for such a small car, it includes insurance, maintenance and a powerful 220-volt home charger that can juice up the Mini in three to four hours. (Charging from a household outlet takes up to 24 hours.)

Despite the steep payments, the Youngs, who also own a gasoline-powered Mini Cooper S, have fallen in love with the battery version, rolling up 8,000 miles since June. A veterinarian, JoAnn Young commutes 60 miles each way from their home on Shelter Island, off the eastern end of Long Island, to an animal hospital in Islip, where the Youngs had a second charger installed to double the Mini’s daily range. JoAnn also loves the car, but notes that their Mini E — No. 364 of the American fleet — doesn’t handle as nimbly as their gas-powered Mini.

The two-charger strategy was also adopted by Tom Moloughney, a Mini lessee who owns a restaurant in Montclair, N.J. Mr. Moloughney has rolled up 21,000 miles in eight months and has gone as far as 128 miles on a charge.

While these Minis don’t use petroleum, they provide some social lubricant. Through a Facebook group, the Mini E pioneers have put together events — think a ’50s-style cruise night without the gasoline exhaust and smoking tires. And the social networks spawned an ingenious fueling network to extend the roughly 100-mile driving range: using Google Maps and a bit of planning, owners string together longer trips by recharging at the homes of their brothers-in-amps.

Mr. Young, a former circus performer who is now captain of a Shelter Island ferry, challenged notions of “range anxiety,” the idea that E.V.’s will be forever leashed near their home outlets. Last August, on a trip he calls the Mini E e-Tour, Mr. Young covered a circuitous 1,020 miles — from Shelter Island to the Catskills, through New Jersey and home across Long Island — over four days and roughly a dozen recharges.

Along the way, Mr. Young served as a Johnny Appleseed for electric cars, handing out Power Support Team T-shirts to fellow lessees, blogging along the way and doing radio interviews from the road.

“The tour showed that once there’s an infrastructure, you won’t have to stick within 50 miles of home,” he said. Several companies, including BMW and Nissan, are developing quick chargers that can fill batteries to 80 percent capacity in a half-hour or less.

Stopping for a multihour recharging break every 100 miles may be the antithesis of Americans’ scorched-earth blasts across the Interstates. Yet Mr. Young says such trips could revive travel on scenic backroads — at slower speeds that maximize E.V. mileage.

The Mini E program has had some hiccups. Some drivers were forced at first to recharge at a snail’s pace by using household current, because Underwriters Laboratory had not approved the 220-volt charging cables that BMW brought over from Europe. A few Mini E batteries issued warnings or shut down because of slightly elevated battery temperatures, a problem that was resolved, BMW says, with a software fix.

Richard Steinberg, program manager for electric vehicles at the BMW Group, said lessees encountered local red tape; some municipal inspectors saw the Mini’s wall-mounted charger as a strange or hazardous contraption, especially on the East Coast where E.V.’s are even less familiar than in California. Streamlining the permit process for home chargers would be an important step, Mr. Steinberg said, adding, “A lot of inspectors acted like they’d never seen an electric car before.”

Roughly 10 Mini Pioneers live in Manhattan, including Rebecca Hough, the sales and marketing director of Evatran, which is developing a wireless E.V. charging system. Ms. Hough had the Mini-provided charger installed in the public parking garage she uses.

As for owner complaints, the biggest by far is reduced range in cold weather — a bugbear for any E.V. battery, whose chemical reactions are slowed by cold. Running the Mini’s battery-powered heater (or air-conditioner) cuts the range as well. A Mini E driver in New Jersey, Timothy Gill, discovered the downside when he overestimated his range during a cold snap.

“Towed! After only 87.8 miles — sheesh!” he wrote in a blog post at myemini.wordpress.com. Another lessee blogged on G.M.’s Volt site that his Mini’s power gauge fell to zero after just 55 miles on a 23-degree day. BMW acknowledges that range can drop as much as 30 percent in frigid weather.

Aside from practical issues, E.V. makers are continuing to cut costs and improve battery performance to make the the vehicles more attractive to average consumers. Analysts say a lithium-ion battery pack powerful enough for an E.V. adds $12,000 or more to a manufacturer’s costs.

But those obstacles aren’t preventing automakers from jumping into the E.V. market. BMW’s next electric car, a version of its 1 Series coupe called the ActiveE, will undergo consumer testing next year. That car is part of BMW’s Project i, an environmental initiative that will develop an electric city car.

This month, BMW decided to offer one-year extensions of Mini E leases at a reduced rate of $600 a month. Among lessees who have responded to the offer, about half have decided to keep their cars, the company said.

BMW executives said they were mindful of the public relations nightmare that followed G.M.’s 2003 decision to destroy its EV1 fleet after the leases ran out, partly to avoid being stuck with long-term maintenance and warranty costs. The episode ended up with G.M. cast as the villain in a documentary, “Who Killed the Electric Car?”

Mr. Young, who ended his tour last summer by pouring Champagne over his Mini’s hood, said he would prefer to extend his lease. But he is open to other options and would gladly turn over a new Leaf as well.

“I’m loyal to Mini, but now I’m also loyal to clean cars,” he said. “Whatever’s available would be of interest.”
 
Not exactly sure how i am 'incorrect' ? Please explain?

Don Young and his wife, Dr. JoAnn Young, pay the requisite $850 a month to lease their Mini E more than triple the lease rate for a base-model Mini Cooper"

What sort of person is happy about spending more money for something that has inferior
performance to the ICE version mini?!@?!?@# Some rich tree hugging lentil eating 60's hippy throw back
with more money than sense maybe ?-->

View attachment E-mini_lentil_eating_hippy_owner.jpg
^^^How he would look if he could grow hair and his Dr wife allowed him to dress as he wished..the poor whipped bastard.

:mrgreen:

KiM
 
You can buy a brand new Lotus for less money, and then you OWN it, rather than leasing, which is just like renting.

Mini's are dodge neon's with a re-body fitted to make them heavier, worse handling, less utilitarian, etc. They are marketed to the inept buyer who purchases based outside appearance only, and likewise why they teamed up with BMW to try to further gleam some pseudo-prestige for suckering the "appearance-buyer" demographic.

With the intensely disconnected painfully poor driving experience of the standard Mini, it's a little boggling what the electric version must feel like.

BUT! None of that matters in the end does it? Only the person driving the car has to enjoy the car, and it seems they've managed to select people who do like it, and made them pay out the nose for it, so it looks like the mission is a complete success. :)



PS: It's a crying shame they took the name of a fantastic true sportcar manufacture with rich racing history, and drug it through mud by applying it to a 2,600-2,800lbs neon drive-train powered platform using macphereson strut fronts, and trailing arm rear... Every aspect that matters, the car is a sh*t can packed with concentrated fail.
 
I have to agree, the current mini coopers are dogs. But people buy cars for all the wrong reasons all the time. Not the only one out there. A lady at work bought a Smart car recently. My wife took one look and said, " They shoulda named it the dumb car" and " for half the money she coulda had a focus" . (refering to the hatchback version that she drove for years)

Electric cars are really gonna catch on now, at $850 a month. Rich slobs can feel good about the drive to the airport where they have a huge carbon footprint.
 
Hi Kim,


AussieJester said:
Not exactly sure how i am 'incorrect' ? Please explain?
Most of us are very well aware of the shortcomings of EV's. What's incorrect is all of your posts distorting and exaggerating those issues. I assume you are trolling so it shouldn't surprise you when I state you are incorrect.

Want an example? I post an article that states that half of the lessee's of Mini EV's are pleased enough with them that they plan to renew their leases and you respond with the following. I'm sure its fun trolling but in terms of correctness its not even close.
AussieJester said:
Don Young and his wife, Dr. JoAnn Young, pay the requisite $850 a month to lease their Mini E more than triple the lease rate for a base-model Mini Cooper"

What sort of person is happy about spending more money for something that has inferior
performance to the ICE version mini?!@?!?@# Some rich tree hugging lentil eating 60's hippy throw back
with more money than sense maybe ?-->

^^^How he would look if he could grow hair and his Dr wife allowed him to dress as he wished..the poor whipped bastard.

:mrgreen:

KiM
 
Hi Luke,

liveforphysics said:
BUT! None of that matters in the end does it? Only the person driving the car has to enjoy the car, and it seems they've managed to select people who do like it, and made them pay out the nose for it, so it looks like the mission is a complete success. :)
Exactly! Its how the free market economy works (Econ 101). Build something that customers want at a price they are willing to pay. Plus we all know that if they scale up production the prices will come down.

liveforphysics said:
PS: It's a crying shame they took the name of a fantastic true sportcar manufacture with rich racing history, and drug it through mud by applying it to a 2,600-2,800lbs neon drive-train powered platform using macphereson strut fronts, and trailing arm rear...

I"m not defending the handling of the current Mini but I'm not totally with you on the quality of the original Mini:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini
The suspension system, designed by Issigonis's friend Dr. Alex Moulton at Moulton Developments Limited, used compact rubber cones instead of conventional springs. This ingenious space-saving design also featured rising progressive-rate springing of the cones, and provided some natural damping. Built into the subframes, the rubber cone system gave a raw and bumpy ride which was accentuated by the woven-webbing seats, but the rigidity of the rubber cones, together with the wheels being pushed out to the corners of the car, gave the Mini go kart-like handling that would become famous.
A friend owned one and it did handle like a go-kart. Unfortunately it also rode like a go-kart and the build quality was closer to a Yugo than a BMW.

Our BMW 2002 had excellent handling and ride plus build quality the original Mini could only dream about.
 
I loved my 2003 Mini(would've rather had an original)... But it did have a lot of problems. And getting the dumbies to fix them was an incredible feat. I mean at idle the thing sounded like it was going to blast off into outer space when the secondary fan kicked in. The service tech was like, "its supposed to sound that way." Me, "Really? Because my noise neurotic wife is going to shove it up your arse if it is'nt fixed." Tech, "Okay I'll look into it." Later, "yeah it was malfunctioning." Always had a "tick" after that when the 2nd fan kicked in.

We got rid of it when we started having children. It was biatch to get em into that back seat... Definately a DINK car!

Kim, nice photo chopping. That dude needed something. Too bad you couldn't give em a brain..... :lol:
 
number1cruncher said:
Kim, nice photo chopping. That dude needed something. Too bad you couldn't give em a brain..... :lol:

Cheers...my point exactly... You would have to have rocks in your head..according to Mitch though HALF
of those that have leases are renewing them so that again according to Mitch is success :shock: well Mitch if you
gauge success in that half the product produced buy a company being successful power to you i think the accountants would disagree as do I
and the company wouldnt remain afloat relying on these sort of 'sales' would they buddy :p ...
Seems to me only half the people with leases have common sense. Once again i asks, how does this prove me wrong though?
I say e-vehicles are not going to be popular to the masses until they are able to go 300kilometers on a charge traveling 110km/hr
far as i can tell mitch half of the people agree with me hardly the majority and the mini is hardly up to the specs i specified ...
I believe it is VERY damn close to the truth Mitch and you haven't come close to proving otherwise...half the leases
were renewed mitch really, your basing your whole asumption on my being wrong on that, pretty flimsy mate, surely you can do better than that :mrgreen:

KiM
 
Earlier this evening I viewed the Blu-Ray remake of “The Italian Job” (2003). During the movie I was thinking that those mini-Coopers would be ideal for an EV conversion. It turns out that while watching the extra features the movie producers did just that with three cars for the scenes shot down in the subway because it was a safety problem with internal combustion motors in the tunnels (probably due to poor ventilation).

The producers asked BMW to make an electric version but none was available, so they contracted out their special effects team to make three electric mini-Coopers for the shot. I just thought that was pretty cool for 2003.

Although after reading this and the other mini-cooper thread it looks like the electric version is not very EV worthy. Sad; there is so much potential here for a great little car.

Waiting to view TIJ 2, KF
BTW - the original version with M. Caine is on Netflix’s instant-play right now…
 
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