Thread for new battery breakthrough PR releases

Sanyo is currently shipping a 4.3V/3400 mAh 18650 LiCo cell... 4.3V is a minor improvement over 4.2V, but they seem to be the only one to make it a commercial reality. Raising lithium chemistry voltage is tough to pull off in the real world...
 
Not practical as an eBike battery due to weight and low discharge, but if thats right - 9000 cycles, imagine that for an off the grid house use. 25 years effectively, if there isnt also a shelf life component.
 
4.3v fully charged, i assume.. not nominal.. most lico cells are 3.6-3.8v nominal.
 
Sunder said:
Not practical as an eBike battery due to weight and low discharge, but if thats right - 9000 cycles, imagine that for an off the grid house use. 25 years effectively, if there isnt also a shelf life component.
Click to expand...

dude, check out edison iron batteries 100 year life span :shock: and still going strong, watering once a year or so, electrolight replacement, every 10 years or so, your good to go.

there's examples of them running 80 odd years without problems.

you dont need to use a charge controller just top up with water if you overcharge them :D

plus no off gassing of dangerous gasses, well unless you count hydrogen :shock: lol only really happens if u way overcharge them, that where the extra distilled water comes in :D
 
Why do they have such low energy density?
I thought they were supposed to be on par with LiPo, i.e. about 150Wh/kg.
 
theres some here with a higher C rate:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/627190393/2_3V_11Ah_Lithium_Titanate_Battery.html
*edit*
got a responce for pricing
apparently the model i just linked is stopped (cant imagine why its a much better model)
they now sell the 2.4v 15ah cell capable of 3C charge/discharge for 60$ each; cant imagine why anyone would want to buy them at that price point though with just a 3c rating. the 10c rated cell was much more tempting.
 
darren1678 said:
Sunder said:
Not practical as an eBike battery due to weight and low discharge, but if thats right - 9000 cycles, imagine that for an off the grid house use. 25 years effectively, if there isnt also a shelf life component.
Click to expand...

dude, check out edison iron batteries 100 year life span :shock: and still going strong, watering once a year or so, electrolight replacement, every 10 years or so, your good to go.

there's examples of them running 80 odd years without problems.
Click to expand...

Thanks. Just had a read up on several articles on it, including how they're using carbon nanotubes to boost recharge time to about 2-3 minutes from completely flat. Looks very interesting and promising.

However, looking at sites like Wikipedia and Manufacturer's sites, they're saying about 25 year lifespan and about 2000 cycles to 80% capacity. The former doesn't scare me, but 2k cycles... That's like 7 years. I guess you could over spec, and perhaps partial charge/discharge cycles don't count as much?

Finally, looks like they're impossible to get in Australia, and having them shipped over here costs as much as the battery themselves costs! The Lithium Titanate wouldn't have that issue, as the same capacity would be much smaller and lighter. Definitely a step up over current SLA though.
 
Managed to get more detailed specifications for the 15ah cell: according to this its capable of 90 amps and 20,000 cycles which makes it much more worth the 60$, but not sure how many seconds its capable of doing those amps.


cell

单体电芯


Model 规格型号


TK2012-2.4/15　

Capacity 容量


15Ah

Nominal voltage 标称电压


　2.4 V

Impedance standard 内阻标准


　<3 mΩ

Assembly standard 配组标准


A. capacity endurance(,容差)≤1% B. inner-resistance(内阻)=2～3 mΩ C. current-maintaining ability(荷电保持能力)≥90% D. voltage(3C discharging state)电压(3C放电态)=2.3～２.6V

Cycle life 循环寿命（常温环境）


20000 cycles

DOD (放电深度)


100%

Max continous discharge current

最大持续放电电流


90A

Nominal capacity 标称容量（3C5A）


15Ah

Minimal capacity 最小容量（3 C5A ）


15Ah

Rated voltage 额定电压


2.4V

Max. charge voltage 最大充电电压


2.75 V

Discharge cut-off voltage 放电截止电压


1.5V

Charge current充电电流


45A(3C)

Working current 工作电流


3A（0.2C）

Output and input terminals

输出端与输入端


P+(red) / P-(black)

Weight 电池重量 (Approx.)


约：0.713Kg

dimension 外形尺寸（L×W×H）


215×110×12mm

Charge method

适用充放电


Standard 标准


3A×5hrs (0.2C)

Quick 快速


45A×20min (3C)

Operating temperature 适用温度


charge充电


-30℃～55℃

discharge放电


-30℃～55℃

Recommended storage temperaturet推荐储存温度


50%-70% SOC储存

50%-70%SOC storage


-10℃～45℃
 
Colbert is a dipshit. He has NO business interviewing people that are intelligent. I could not watch that video because of his stupid shit.
 
I can view it either. I don't understand how this can be cost effective where we have water running down hill. Using our current free battery of a lake cost the consumer $0.10 per kWh. Using my average of 50Kwh per day means I need a $12,500 liquid metal battery. I need help with the math. :mrgreen:


myzter said:
http://www.ted.com/talks/donald_sadoway_the_missing_link_to_renewable_energy.html

Monday October 22, 2012 - The Colbert Report
MIT Professor Donald Sadoway plans to minimize the world's oil dependence with the first liquid metal battery.
http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/420372/october-22-2012/donald-sadoway
- I cant watch the colbertnation clip from my location on the west coast of Canada !

Journal of the American Chemistry Society Paper
Click to expand...
 
It seems Boston power have increased their cell capacity and energy density ( if the specs can be believed ?) to over 200Whr/kg.
Discharge rate is low, but its hard to fault the energy/weight performance.
5300mAhr cell and 93.5 gms per cell.
Could be well suited to "commuter" or Touring bikes who need the capacity without the high discharge rates.
Has anyone tested these cells ?
http://www.boston-power.com/sites/default/files/documents/2012-03%20Swing5300%20DS%20Rev1%200.pdf
 
These look quite promising for epic battery packs in cars and ideally suited to commuter e-bikes. Terminating bunches of them would require some innovative strategies...
 
What? 2C rated and >200whr/kg? that's not too shabby.

Unfortunately it would take some ninja maneuvers to get your hands on these, given that it is an American company selling them at all. ( yay for our crazy liability laws)
 
http://www.boston-power.com/sites/default/files/documents/2012-03%20Swing5300%20DS%20Rev1%200.pdf


not sure which one he linked , but you can get to them here

http://www.boston-power.com/products
 
Terminating bunches of them would require some innovative strategies...
Click to expand...

They seem to have that taken care of too..
Assembly blocks for making up parallel packs .
Battery_9_10_12-1875.jpg

http://boston-power.commpreview.com/sites/default/files/documents/Swing%20Key%20442%20Datasheet%20%28Preliminary%29.pdf
 
panasonic ncr18650b:
Discharge Curve
orbtronic has them for $15 each right now / 45g

But for a few bucks less they also have
IMR 26650 MNKE Battery Cell 3.8V 3800mAh / 92g
$13 per cell
 
Have some boston swing 5300 engineering samples here, one module, too.
Well, these cells have quite poor discharge rates and swell if cycled at max rated current without cool-off between cycles. They also have quite high Ri. Especially I don't like their shallow discharge curve. It might be good for very low-end applications, where SOC is determined from cell's voltage, but the cell itself is really expensive, so I doubt these will be used in low end applications.
 
crossbreak said:
panasonic ncr18650b are available since months. These get more than 250wh/kg and they are also rated for 2c. Sry I have no discharge curve for you :?
Click to expand...

Those will perform awfully at 2C.
They will not perform too well at 1C either. Acceptable, but not too good.

Those batteries are fine though if you want a very large pack in a low power setup tho.

The higher the whr/kg, the higher the internal resistance seems to be.
There's no 'have your cake and eat it too' in lithium batteries just yet :/
 
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