ultra-fast charging cells

[circuit]

I am looking for cells that could accept a "normal" charge rate of at least 4C and peaks up to 10C. Has anyone seen such cells, that are available to to purchase in low quantities?
I know A123 accepts 4C as "fast charge", but these are harder and harder to get, especially quality ones. Are there other options? Some RC lipos maybe?

So what I have found so far:
SCIB: 8C (still checking prices)
A123: 4C (dicsontinued)
SAFT: 2C (too expensive and too slow)

 

[liveforphysics]

Check if Enerdel is still offering there high-C charge cell.

Likewise, if you don't need high energy density, take a look at LTO stuff, many offerings support 10C charge.

 

[Punx0r]

Turnigy Nano-tech claims 10C

 

[999zip999]

Where are you going to get 10c for your charging rate how big a pack ? For what ?

 

[DAND214]

10C charge rate, at what voltage and Ah?

Gonna need a big bad Charger.

Dan

 

[Doctorbass]

I have some nanotitanate 18650 direct from the IREQ research lab that are built to take 15C continuous

But they are only 1.8v nominal and 1Ah...

Damn it ! I still have a box of 100 brand new cells but nu real use for them...

 

[cwah]

Nanotech: 8C charge rate
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24300__Turnigy_nano_tech_A_SPEC_4500mah_10S_65_130C_Lipo_Pack.html

 

[circuit]

Check if Enerdel is still offering there high-C charge cell.

Likewise, if you don't need high energy density, take a look at LTO stuff, many offerings support 10C charge.

Can't see any high power cells on Enerdel's website. I had a couple of pouch samples from like 3 years ago, but probably they are too new

Looks like Titanate is the way to go.

Turnigy Nano-tech claims 10C

Nanotech: 8C charge rate
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24300__Turnigy_nano_tech_A_SPEC_4500mah_10S_65_130C_Lipo_Pack.html

This looks interesting. No Ti inside these? I wonder how reliable these cells are. But easy to purchase at least.

 

[riba2233]

You can buy some and test them, I would like to see those tests
These are simple LiCo chemistry.

 

[arkmundi]

I'd get some A123 cells from OSNPower.

 

[major]

Check if Enerdel is still offering there high-C charge cell.

Can't see any high power cells on Enerdel's website. I had a couple of pouch samples from like 3 years ago, but probably they are too new

Here it claims 5C charge and discharge for the CP160 cell. http://evolveelectrics.com/power-cell/
Sometimes called the PHEV or power cell, it compares very well and ranked above the A123 20Ah pouch and Altair Nano titanate cells on this evaluation: http://elithion.com/wp_short_discharge_time.php
You can also see the pulse power (10 second) charge and discharge characteristics on the last page here: http://www.enerdel.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Cell-Binder.pdf
Generally the EnerDel power cells are expensive however evolve shows a good price on the B grade CP155-365 (15.5 Ah instead of the 16Ah A grade). http://evolveelectrics.com/single-cell/

 

[999zip999]

The 15.5ah cells 31usd. How would you connect the cell tabs. Solderable ?

 

[major]

How would you connect the cell tabs. Solderable ?

The only method I've seen is compression. You have your standard tab materials of copper and aluminum, both nickel plated. I would not solder them. Punch a hole and clamp with threaded fastener.

 

[grindz145]

Even the high rate Panasonic cells can do 2C. I have no idea what would happen over time though ...

 

[circuit]

I'd get some A123 cells from OSNPower.

I have dealt with OSNpower several times and can't say anything bad. However I have used A123 cells in projects before and it was a pity to redesign when they got obsolete and hard to purchase in larger quantities. So I'm trying to avoid that same mistake.

Check if Enerdel is still offering there high-C charge cell.

Can't see any high power cells on Enerdel's website. I had a couple of pouch samples from like 3 years ago, but probably they are too new

Here it claims 5C charge and discharge for the CP160 cell. http://evolveelectrics.com/power-cell/
Sometimes called the PHEV or power cell, it compares very well and ranked above the A123 20Ah pouch and Altair Nano titanate cells on this evaluation: http://elithion.com/wp_short_discharge_time.php
You can also see the pulse power (10 second) charge and discharge characteristics on the last page here: http://www.enerdel.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Cell-Binder.pdf
Generally the EnerDel power cells are expensive however evolve shows a good price on the B grade CP155-365 (15.5 Ah instead of the 16Ah A grade). http://evolveelectrics.com/single-cell/

Yes, I actually did have one of these B grade cells tested. Did not look like power-optimized cells at that time, probably worth a second look.

The 15.5ah cells 31usd. How would you connect the cell tabs. Solderable ?

EnerDel suggests using mechanical clamps with screws. Similar to what folks at ES do to connect 20Ah A123 pouches.
EnerDel also offer their assembly kit. Probably not a bad idea to order those together with cells or as complete pack.
5C is a little on the edge, probably will try other solutions first.

Even the high rate Panasonic cells can do 2C. I have no idea what would happen over time though ...

I have tested several genuine Panasonic NCR18650B (3300mAh) cells at 1C, 0.5C and 0.25C charge rates. Capacity drops very dramatically just after few cycles even at 0.5C. I wouldn't go over 0.33C with these. Those higher-rated cells, like -PD, probably will take faster charge, but I don't expect it to be anything near 4C or even 2C.

 

[riba2233]

Maybe he was talking about ultra high drain panasonic, like K, KA, and Y.

 

[grindz145]

Even the high rate Panasonic cells can do 2C. I have no idea what would happen over time though ...

I have tested several genuine Panasonic NCR18650B (3300mAh) cells at 1C, 0.5C and 0.25C charge rates. Capacity drops very dramatically just after few cycles even at 0.5C. I wouldn't go over 0.33C with these. Those higher-rated cells, like -PD, probably will take faster charge, but I don't expect it to be anything near 4C or even 2C.

Great feedback, great to know.

 

[grindz145]

Maybe he was talking about ultra high drain panasonic, like K, KA, and Y.

I was actually considering the -pd cells, but on paper, the 18650Bs will do 2C, so this was definitely where I was going.

 

[grindz145]

I'm getting some NCR18650PDs in for evaluation, so I'll have to give it a shot.

 

[circuit]

Maybe he was talking about ultra high drain panasonic, like K, KA, and Y.

I was actually considering the -pd cells, but on paper, the 18650Bs will do 2C, so this was definitely where I was going.

Here are my findings:

More info and tests:
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=lt&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fe-motion.lt%2F2013%2F07%2F30%2Flicio-celiu-pasirinkimas-4%2F
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=lt&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fe-motion.lt%2F2013%2F07%2F22%2Flicio-celiu-pasirinkimas-3%2F
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=lt&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fe-motion.lt%2F2013%2F04%2F10%2Flicio-celiu-pasirinkimas-2%2F
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=lt&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fe-motion.lt%2F2013%2F04%2F07%2Flicio-celiu-pasirinkimas%2F

 

[riba2233]

@grindz145: I don't know where did you found 2C charging rate? B cells are 0.5C charge max, and PD or PF are 1C charge max.

 

[Cephalotus]

Toshiba SCiB (LTO technology) can be charged at 20C+

 

[circuit]

Toshiba SCiB (LTO technology) can be charged at 20C+

But where do you buy one?

 

[pm_dawn]

Have you seen the info from ev-power/I4WIFI about LTO cells......
http://www.ev-power.eu/LTO-Cells/?utm_source=HOMEPAGE&utm_medium=LTONews1&utm_campaign=LTO

They seem to be testing some brands.
Could become interesting.

I have been looking alittle on this site.
http://www.cpecpower.com/index_en.html
they seem to have both LTOF and LTOM cells.
I ahve no Idea about the price and quality.

Regards
/Per

 

[circuit]

First one is just talking, no links to actual products.

Second one does now load right now.