What are the Most Powerful Hub Motors in 2016?

[DotScott]

For $25, the Ferro Fluid upgrade can put the MXUS V3 from Kinaye in a whole new category...
http://electric-fatbike.com/2015/12/18/ferrofluids-join-the-ebike-motor-cooling-revolution/

3000W continuous, 6000W peak
142mm drop-out axle shoulders
temp sensor
dual hall-sensor set
$380 bare unspoked hub, from a US distributor (Washington)

http://kinaye-motorsports.myshopify.com/

That is awesome! Thanks for sharing!

 

[sketchism]

the ferrofluid has been out of stock for agesss, i'm almost resorted to buying a litre of it direct from the factory so i can use some for my builds and maybe sell the rest off here in aus if anyone wants 995ml of it

 

[spinningmagnets]

It sounded like Justin only wanted to sell a few samples to builders who understood it is still experimental, and he only sold it in the first place to get long-term data, to see what issues might pop up. Don't get the organic oil-based FF, because it will evaporate away and get thicker. Also, if you put in the minimum amount to keep the unloaded drag down, shrinkage due to evaporation will break the thermal coupling...

 

[sketchism]

haha yeah i spent a few days emailing back and forth with the manufacturers at ferrotec and they were quite interested in its use for motor cooling, they agreed to sell me an amount to test and use for that reason, but minimum was 1L and that worked out quite expensive indeed.

 

[bowlofsalad]

http://www.electricmotorsport.com/ev-parts/motors/brushless-motors/enertrac-mhm602-brushless-10kw-hub-motor.html Probably worth adding to the list.

 

[zombiess]

Cromotor V4 is the QS V3 core with a improved axle.

Before anyone gets on about Cromotor Vx, I started the naming to keep track of changing specs.

 

[ecycler]

I spilled the beans in another thread, but I have concocted my own ferrofluid formula and it is looking very promising so far. Once I get a few hundred more miles in each of the motors and crack them open I will share the results and spread the love.

 

[Samd]

Well the ferrofluid formula ain't so secret. It's just MICR toner and peanut oil for the oxidation profile.

Anyone see that insane Honda grom last month with the 9c custom version of the qs273? I gotta find pics.

 

[ecycler]

Samd, that may be a simple version for science demonstrations on youtube, but I assure you there is no toner or peanut oil in my experimental formulas. Peanut oil is a much cheaper source of Oleic Acid than what I have been using and has a relatively high smoke/flash point, so perhaps I will look into trying it in the formula one day. For now I can only do one batch at a time and it takes about a week.

There is a reason why ferrofluid costs so much. Fe3O4 must be synthesized as or broken down into nanoparticles (20~30nm or less) in the presence of the modifiers or they will not be able to graft onto the surface of particles small enough to produce excellent dispersion capability. Ink toner particles are between 8-20 microns, so they are 3 orders of magnitude off the mark from ideal particle size for a ferrofluid.

 

[Samd]

No doubt you've got the detail. But so far I've got ten kilos of toner for thirty bucks and three of my Mxus motors are showing ok results after a few hundred KM each. It comes out about fifteen cents a shot. I may be underengineering it - but I'm thinking that there's a real risk here of overengineering it. ES is all about open source for the masses.
Although be careful there - MICR toner is conched to a super small particle size for gravure printing. It's not regular toner.
~8 microns strikes me as ideal given the gap size? Actually I just googles a few different specs, there seems to be MICR down to half of one micron?

 

[ecycler]

That's cool that you are giving it a shot. Are you seeing similar temperature reduction on the coils of ~20-30c? I did a few tests with larger particles (though still not micron sized) on the bench over the past few weeks and they will definitely agglomerate pretty quickly, but if kept in the presence of a magnet it slows down the process which is good news. I will read up on MICR toner and see if I can source some as well. It would be great if you have found a major shortcut!

I fully agree it is all about putting our heads together to achieve the desired result with the least amount of work and resources necessary!

 

[DotScott]

http://www.electricmotorsport.com/ev-parts/motors/brushless-motors/enertrac-mhm602-brushless-10kw-hub-motor.html Probably worth adding to the list.

NICE! Thanks for sharing!

 

[marcexec]

Hey guys,

since I took some data from this thread I thought someone might be interested in the Wiki table I created: https://endless-sphere.com/w/index.php/Electric_Motor_Selection
Feel free to PM me if you have problems adding stuff.
Discussion here: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=69970&p=1191209#p1191209

 

[DotScott]

Hey guys,

since I took some data from this thread I thought someone might be interested in the Wiki table I created: https://endless-sphere.com/w/index.php/Electric_Motor_Selection
Feel free to PM me if you have problems adding stuff.
Discussion here: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=69970&p=1191209#p1191209

THAT IS AWESOME! This is just the type of thing I was looking for when I created this post! Thanks for sharing!

 

[marcexec]

Hey guys,

since I took some data from this thread I thought someone might be interested in the Wiki table I created: https://endless-sphere.com/w/index.php/Electric_Motor_Selection
Feel free to PM me if you have problems adding stuff.
Discussion here: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=69970&p=1191209#p1191209

THAT IS AWESOME! This is just the type of thing I was looking for when I created this post! Thanks for sharing!

You're very welcome mate. Sharing isn't the big deal, though, there are over 20 lunch breaks and "attended" server installations in that to get the data into a suitable format... :wink:

 

[markz]

Just ran across this motor myself
EnerTrac MHM602 Brushless 10kW Hub Motor
30kW peak

72 volts for 45 MPH with 18 X 3.5 tire
96 volts for 60 plus MPH with 18 X 3.5 tire

- Typical current demand:

At 72 volts and 45 MPH < 50 amps
At 96 volts and 60 MPH < 95 amps

Makes me wonder what the kV is, I need to find out how to convert.

Some additonal info here
The 602 is a 2 Turn and I can only ASSume 60mm stator.
elecbike@gmail.com
MHM602/MHM603 and the DUAL MOTOR 602/603 Now advailable with Liquid Cooling Option

I am getting a hard on

I found this website
http://www.csgnetwork.com/tirerevforcecalc.html
Punched in 96V and 60mph, 18", 2" and got 916RPM divided by 96 is 9.54Kv. 72V and 45mph works out to 9.549Kv.
Not sure how the Kv relates to other motors, think its correct though.

There must be other motors like this out there.

 

[Warren]

It is under specs:

MHM602: 10 RPM/Volt

MHM603: 7 RPM/Volt

 

[markz]

So thats 10Kv and 7Kv, I was close in my calculation. I can't believe I did not even see that when I was on that page.

 

[marcexec]

Cool, added that (and the 603) to https://endless-sphere.com/w/index.php/Electric_Motor_Selection#Overview_of_Motors - anyone have the wights and or diameter of them?

 

[Warren]

Kraig shows his built up in the motorcycle wheel with dropouts and brake installed at 56 pounds.

http://www.schultzengineering.us/d-11mar31.jpg

This article calls it a 45 pound motor.

https://www.wired.com/2010/05/hammarhead-volta/

Mark said it is 10" diameter, in his response here.

https://evmc2.wordpress.com/2010/08/10/hammarhead-volta-and-bigass-zev-hub-motors/

It is built, for Mark Gelbien, by Crystalyte.

http://www.evalbum.com/2568

 

[Doctorbass]

deleted

 

[marcexec]

You should add the DU 602 and DU 603.. these are dual Enertrac ( 20kW cont 60 peak)

We build my friend's E-GSXR 1000 with one and 40s2p of A123 20Ah poutch and 600A 180V Kelly to power that heavy hub.

Jean-Luc was not impressed by the quality build of the enertrac motor and had communications difficulty with the supplier.
[...]


That project was awsome and the motorcyle was really powerfull and had a very great powerband.. even at 160kmh there was still torque. but the dual 602 was pretty hard at very low speed on the Kelly 600Amp... as we got many cut out due to high current spike detection...

Doc

That's all cool, but there are even less details on the dual versions, not even the width. Did you happen to take any measurements? As stated before, I'm happy to put in the table whatever you're throwing at me.

Edit: Mark kindly sent me drawings and the [strike]crazy[/strike] lovely dual versions are now in the Wiki page, bringing the total to 52

 

[mk77]

Hi,
Don't mean to dredge up an inactive thread; though, I still have a question
after searching the ES site for the Enertrac MHM602 motor number of poles.
I was only able to find one reference to the motor having 12 poles but this reference seems to be
just a statement vs a parameter on a specification sheet. I was also looking for the spacing of the Hall
sensors (in degrees). It seems to me this data should be on the Enertrac website but it is not.
Is Enertrac still active? Website is up but not getting response to email questions.
Thanks in advance -- I appreciate the assistance.