Finally RUNNING!! page 5 ride vids Here!! need better qualit

[Whiplash]

Ih yeah as for the paint, nothings painted yet, its a prototype! Lol!

 

[waynebergman]

Now we are talking Whiplash! .......I would like to see a climbing video. If possible it would be nice to see the bike climb something from a by standers point of view. Helmet cams are cool but it would be nice to see the bike actually climb, so a person could see the whole bike and rider in motion rather than the view from an on board camera. Any chance of an assistant taking the video of a short climb up something steep!

I am also wanting to eventually head down the mac mid drive route and my reasons are weight, low end power and silence so I am watching your thread with interest. Thanks for sharing your progress to date.............wayne

 

[Whiplash]

Yeah, I was going to do that, I am not a fan of the helmet cam to be honest, it kind of runs the perspective in my opinion unless you do different angles and such or a little of both...

in other news,
I got to work today on 6.2AH in BRUTAL wind the last 3-4 miles so its a HELL of an improvement over the in wheel hub. Normally in that kind of wind I would see in excess of 8AH consumed!! With the wheel hub, normally it would slow down but build heat trying to pull it, in this case I shifted down a gear, and it went about the same speed, but pulled it easily with about 1000 watts continuous rather than over 1600...

-Bryan

 

[Whiplash]

Had my first --EPIC-- Trail ride! I officially will never go back to anything but this!! I rode to work, charged up, rode home and stopped on the way and decided to try the trail behind our local Target store. Needless to say it ROCKED! EVEN WITHOUT the granny gear it still climbed effortlessly over trails only a hard core biker could tackle and they would have to kill themselves to do it!

Ill have video of actual climbing this weekend!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qII-HHywIwg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Whiplash]

The best part is I rode from work over 10 miles, detoured through the mountains climbing at least 1000 verticle feet, up and down and around twisting trails, back on the road shifted into high gear and flew home another 3 or so miles on get this------7AH! It used to take 8 to get home on the STREET! LOL! Can you tell I'm pumped??

I took this trail here but veered off and went farther to the south at the top...

http://www.hiking-in-ps.com/bumpngrind.php

 

[sn0wchyld]

STOP IT DAMNIT! your making me want to buy a mac and play copycat! I think I'll get my 8085/100 build finished first but then I might just have to try my hand at a modded frame to fit a mac as a mid drive but im thinking more like 3-4kw from a 12fet.

Reaaaalllly want to see some running shots - even if its only a stationary camera showing a few steep climbs or whatever. please???

edit
what voltage are you running? I'm sure you've said already but cant find it in this thread from a quick look....

 

[Whiplash]

12s. Its the best compromise of size/power.. Ill try to get some video climbing tomorrow on the way home. Ill just set the phone up on a rock or something.. But remember, I still can't use my low gear and I use a mega range so it will do considerably better when I get it totally setup.

 

[Whiplash]

Hey all some vids for ya!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxEDtZDW1l8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRcnfPotFo8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Powdersummit]

Looking great man, glad to see that your life is on the mend from the past few weeks. We have all been there in one way or another. Those are some impressive trails you have there. Hell I woke up to an inch of white crap on the ground this morning, doubt I'll even be out for a hike today. I really like how simple this setup is, considering how complex some people have made these systems. How is your front freewheel holding up to the torque? and how much range do you suppose you gained let alone ride ability from your old setup? I'd be real interested to see what that thing does with use of a decent granny gear. Keep up the good work and look forward to people copying your design.

Carl

 

[Whiplash]

Thanks! Its hard to guesstimate how much is range it gained, but it has to be at least 15-25%. Off road there is no comparison. Ii should have the bracket system for sale soon so hopefully if they copy my design they can use my system! Thanks again!

The real cool part I have noticed is when I pedal it makes a more significant improvement in the cower consumption, I am guessing its because its a mechanical link to the pedals vs me helping the hub motor in the wheel. I can actually cruise at less than 300 watts if I moderately pedal doing 30+MPH if there is no headwind !

 

[Tom Tom]

. Ii should have the bracket system for sale soon

Any idea what the system is gonna include?

Just received my 12t mac yesterday. Weighs in at 10 pounds. Although a little heavy? I love the simplicity
of a direct drive to the crank.

Which controller are you using?

I'm hoping to ride the peak in July. My newbiness is thinking a battery of roughly 44 to 50 volts and 25 amp hours would be plenty.

 

[Whiplash]

Yeah, if you keep the speed moderate that should be fine I would think.

As for the kit I am thinking a simple bracket kit then a kit with everything but motor, then one with everything complete.

 

[French]

I can actually cruise at less than 300 watts if I moderately pedal doing 30+MPH if there is no headwind !

That's impressive. If I'm cruising at 30mph (I don't really "cruise" at that speed as much as it's just a short burst), I usually pull 1200-1300 watts. If I help pedal, the best I can reduce that to is 1,000/1,100 or so. That's really cool that you can get that 12T to go 30mph, given that in the standard hub setup with 48v you'd be lucky to hit 20mph.

Edit: That sounds like a good set of combos. I might be interested in the middle package (all but the motor).

 

[Whiplash]

Yeah my MAC 6t couldn't do less than 900+ watts no matter how hard I pedaled or how light the throttle! I was amazed to say the least!

 

[recumpence]

You have something wrong with your numbers there.

Rolling resistance alone will take 300 watts or more at 30mph. Typically, you will pull 1,000 watts or over in an efficient system on an upright bike to run that speed. The highest efficiency systems I have ever seen are in low recumbents and those require nearly 800 watts to cruise at 30mph.

Maybe your shunt it bad or something.

Matt

 

[Whiplash]

It could be a VERY slight downgrade but I just climbed a 4-5% grade at around 25mph using only 900 watts so I am fairly certain im pretty close. I have done 12+ miles three of which were climbing up that trail, with only 4.5AH!! Its EFFICIENT. FAR more than the MAC in the wheel for sure and they are pretty good! Im not saying I didn't pedal, I did a pretty good amount but still!

 

[Whiplash]

All in all I'm LOVING IT!!

 

[deecanio]

Hi Whipash,

thanks for doccing your mid drive, very interesting reading, i've been following along with Tenchs mid drive as to use a hub to power the crank does indeed give the best of all worlds as far as far as i can tell, efficiency, quietness etc
If you get chance could you do some more vid of the bike in action and tell us what speeds you see in each gear and what teeth sprocket of the cluster is engaged for each gear, for myself i've been waiting on a second build until something "better" comes along with timmas custom frame and cyclone being the current fave, but your's and tenchs builds using hubs as mid drives giving me real food for thought.

Cheers,

D

 

[Whiplash]

Sure thing! I just yesterday got to try it with the actual gearing it was designed around and it seems awesome! The 34T rear cog really opened up the climbing ability! It has the power now even with only 1300 watts to flip the bike over backwards when climbing so more power really wont get you any better climbing ability, probably want just some extra speed doing so in a taller gear if you want to. My main goal was climbing power with reasonable top speed (which seems like about 35-40 on the flat) while being VERY power conscious on the trails. I feel I have achieved all goals, it just needs some polishing for public sale very soon. My next goal after flogging the drive well, is to draw the parts in CAD so I can have them produced via water jet or laser cutter. Hopefully this will happen very soon, hopefully in the next week or two so I can order up a test run to sell a few cheaply as BETA versions basically at cost for some testing outside my shop. Ill keep posted about the progress for sure!

 

[M1k3]

Wow mid drive hub IVE SEEN THE LIGHT ! just read your entire build after being tipped off by Knoxies comment on Tenches build .Love it, please more vids

 

[Whiplash]

Here's a link to my last ride, only 7.4AH consumed!!

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msa=0&msid=212342213542489424670.0004bb8e5ff0b468fdc6b

 

[veloman]

Are you going to sell the brackets/freewheel parts, or an entire kit?

 

[Ypedal]

You have something wrong with your numbers there.

Rolling resistance alone will take 300 watts or more at 30mph. Typically, you will pull 1,000 watts or over in an efficient system on an upright bike to run that speed. The highest efficiency systems I have ever seen are in low recumbents and those require nearly 800 watts to cruise at 30mph.

Maybe your shunt it bad or something.

Matt

I have to agree with this.. 30mph on 300w is not happening, no matter what system you run or how efficient is it.. pls check your calibration.

direct plugin CA or standalone ?

 

[Thud]

from methods:

Of course, your controller needs to have a 6 pin CA connector for me to be able to perform this service.
Here is how I do it:


1) I plug the CA into your controller
2) I attach a power supply to your controller (typically 48V)
3) I set the iCharger constant current source (Foam Cut) to 20A
4) I attach the (+) iCharger output to your main ground
5) I attach the (-) iCharger output to one of your phase leads
6) I turn on the controller to power the CA
7) I activate the iCharger to drive the constant current
8) I note the value displayed on the CA
9) I turn off the current source

10) I calculate your new CA setting and program it
11) I then repeat the test to confirm settings are +/- 0.1A

This procedure works by driving a constant current through the main ground, through the shunt, through the body diode of the main fets, then out the phase lead. Credit for this procedure goes to Justin from ebikes.ca

-methods

this is idiot proof....even I can make my CA read dead nutz with this. & it comes direct from the Brains of the CA.

 

[Miles]

I just climbed a 4-5% grade at around 25mph using only 900 watts so I am fairly certain im pretty close.

Let's say pedal contribution was 200 Watts and that 800 Watts is required in total (4% gradient). 600 Watts from drive system @ 66.6 % Eta = 900 Watts. Not completely out of order.... Of course, we need data without pedal input.