Boric Acid + Oil = The slipperiest hardest bearing surface ever. Easily? Experimentation Reqd.

[Logic11]

1st of: I'm proposing an Experiment:
I'm not recommending anyone try this on any bearings or chains they are not about to replace anyway.

I have tried this in car engines, where there's a lot of heat, turbulence and WATER (HC+O2= H20 via blowby) in the engine oil.
The 1st one was near death and about to be reconditioned. There it worked... lets go with well, as miraculously sounds too good to be true.
Let's say; so well that I expect it will lower rolling and pedaling etc resistance to a noticeable degree.

In a bicycle bearing or chain I expect the (experimental) process to take much longer for the reqd reactions to occur and the treatment to 'take'.

So 1st the patent:

"This invention was made with Government support under Contract...awarded by the Department of Energy.​

The Government has certain rights in this invention...​

​

...the most preferred...particle size for boric acid is from about 0.2 to 40 microns to facilitate the formation of a stable suspension with the boric acid being present in a amount of at least 0.1 to 0.2% by weight.​

The amount of solid particles that can be mixed and/or dispersed in the oil will be dependent on the size of the particle. The smaller the size of particle, the greater the amount of particles that can be suspended in oil.​

... the most preferred range being 1-15% for oils and 1-20% for greases.... [by weight]​

​

...a mixture of boric acid and an oil lubricant, the friction coefficients are reduced by 10 to over 1000% below those of the unmixed lubricant itself. The wear rates of pins are reduced by factors of 50 to 100 below those of pins tested in unmixed oil itself..."​

US5431830A - Lubrication from mixture of boric acid with oils and greases - Google Patents

Lubricating compositions including crystalline boric acid and a base lubricant selected from oils, greases and the like. The lubricity of conventional oils and greases can also be improved by adding concentrates of boric acid.

patents.google.com

Now that's WELL into 'Too good to be true' territory!
So who-TH is the patent holder; Dr Ali Erdimer!?

Argonne’s Ali Erdemir elected to National Academy of Engineering for pivotal discoveries in tribology​

Distinguished Fellow Ali Erdemir from the U.S. Department of Energy’s (DOE) Argonne National Laboratory has been elected a member of the National Academy of Engineering (NAE), one of the highest professional distinctions accorded to engineers.​

​

The NAE recognizes Erdemir for his distinguished contributions to the science and technology of friction, wear and lubrication. Erdemir, a program lead in Argonne’s Applied Materials Division, develops new materials, coatings and lubricants with his research team to reduce friction and wear, maximizing efficiency and durability in moving mechanical systems. The discoveries and innovations stemming from his work have earned him six R&D 100 Awards and 23 U.S. patents.​

https://www.anl.gov/article/argonnes-ali-erdemir-elected-to-national-academy-of-engineering-for-pivotal-discoveries-in-tribology

I found this on the US Dept of Energy's website.
I have posted the 1st couple of pages below.

Here's the link to the complete presentation;
https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/03/f13/vss_17_fenske.pdf

Parasitic Energy Losses

NB the "Emulsion of Boric Acid" in Oil..!

Here is another link showing a test engine used in these experiments etc;
https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/03/f11/merit08_fenske.pdf

There is one hell of an argument (for your amusement ) with links to tons of research here:
BORPower additive? - Page 3 - Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum - EcoModder.com
(uBlock Origin is a browser extension that will clean up all the ads etc in the above site)

This post is just to gauge interest.
If anyone is interested in testing plz do post so we can get into various ideas on how best to treat bearing and chains etc to do so.

(A velomobile would be ideal, so that aero drag has less influence on results. Electrified would mean that one could see any reductions in reqd power and increases in range)

 

[Chalo]

Bearings and chains are so small a percentage of the energy losses in a bike that their effect is basically unmeasurable. Reducing their friction by some fraction would be even more unmeasurable, even assuming these suspect claims are accurate.

Folks have been discussing this stuff for almost 20 years now, so I suspect there's a catch.

 

[fechter]

That's pretty interesting. Boric acid is pretty cheap and easy to find.
The gears in a geared hub or mid drive will be a better target for testing as the losses in the gears will be more significant than the chain or bearings. I've melted some gears before, so obviously there's some heat there.
Not sure if boric acid would cause corrosion issues over time. It might absorb water also.

 

[Chalo]

That's pretty interesting. Boric acid is pretty cheap and easy to find.

It's almost like folks could have been doing this trick for ages, if it worked.

The gears in a geared hub or mid drive will be a better target for testing as the losses in the gears will be more significant than the chain or bearings. I've melted some gears before, so obviously there's some heat there.

Given that the hypothesized magic involves "diamond-like" deposited material, I doubt nylon or PEEK gears would benefit. But you never know. I think proven solid lube additives like graphite, moly disulfide, or PTFE would probably work better, but that's just an old mechanic talking.

Not sure if boric acid would cause corrosion issues over time. It might absorb water also.

It will absorb water wherever it's present. pH buffers and alkalizers in modern motor oil might mitigate corrosion to some degree, but that isn't typically a concern for bicycle lubricant, so they probably would not contain such protection.

 

[marty]

Marty The expert in lubrication here:

bearing or chain

Bearings? Not sure?

Bicycle chains. DON'T BUY NOTHING. Just use whatever ya got. Motor oil is best. Any old motor oil. Look in the garage, shed, basement, or under the kitchen sink. How to get oil from bottle to chain? If you don't have one of these - oil can. Drill a little hole in oil bottle cap.

I use paper towels to wipe up excess oil.

 

[marty]

Marty The expert in lubrication here:

Bearings? Not sure?

Bicycle chains. DON'T BUY NOTHING. Just use whatever ya got. Motor oil is best. Any old motor oil. Look in the garage, shed, basement, or under the kitchen sink. How to get oil from bottle to chain? If you don't have one of these - oil can. Drill a little hole in oil bottle cap.

I use paper towels to wipe up excess oil.

And don't even think about oil till ya learn about oily rags spontaneous combustion.

 

[scianiac]

While this may work (as well as some of the claims I don't know) so do all the other additives found oils and greases. Many of which function in a similar if not the same way. So saying a dramatic improvement from base oil is kind of a cheating claim since most any decent additive containing oil will be dramatically better than it's base oil let alone if you made and oil and only use additives to accomplish one goal and ignored the side effects and drawbacks.

The problem I see with the function mentioned, that is forming an ultra hard surface layer, which is also how numerous other wear and friction additives operate, is just like those other additives that doesn't always work. In some conditions it works great but that super hard layer is also often quite brittle so under some loads it will tend to crack and break apart. Some other additives form a thicker and somewhat softer layer that while may not be as good at friction performs better for wear in those conditions. The conditions inside an engine are probably some of the hardest ones to make an oil for imaginable. An additive that does one thing often will have negative effects on other aspects leading to adding other additives to counter that and so on and so forth.

 

[Logic11]

Bearings and chains are so small a percentage of the energy losses in a bike that their effect is basically unmeasurable. Reducing their friction by some fraction would be even more unmeasurable, even assuming these suspect claims are accurate.

Folks have been discussing this stuff for almost 20 years now, so I suspect there's a catch.

Probably.
I only have experience of treating car engines and some house and computer fans and such, which is why I think it may make a noticeable difference.
Any difference will only be noticed by a rider if one can get it to take in the same short time-frame as in engines where there's heat, turbulence and water in the oil.

(The water is actually important here: It's whats required to get the layer formed.
Crazy as it sounds, you actually want to make an acid to 'attack' the metal!
The boron oxide layer formed then stops any further 'attack', in much the same way as the layer that forms on cut or filed aluminum stops it from oxidizing away before your eyes.

ie: The "...friction coefficients are reduced by 10 to over 1000% below those of the unmixed lubricant itself..." may well be noticeable?

This stuff does form a ~0.5 micron thick layer on metal surfaces.
So for a worn ball or roller bearing you'll lose about 4 microns of play, which is why I think testing it in bearings and chains that need replacing anyway is an idea worth experimenting with.

I found no catch on engines. Quite the opposite!
So I think maybe the 'catch' is that engine etc manufacturers don't like what it will do to their sales..?
The oil also stayed way cleaner in the engines. Around twice as long as normal. That wouldn't make people selling oil's bank balance 'happy' either.

 

[Logic11]

That's pretty interesting. Boric acid is pretty cheap and easy to find.
The gears in a geared hub or mid drive will be a better target for testing as the losses in the gears will be more significant than the chain or bearings. I've melted some gears before, so obviously there's some heat there.
Not sure if boric acid would cause corrosion issues over time. It might absorb water also.

Thx fetcher. I thought so too.
I wondered about the gears in motors.
This stuff treats metal. It wont treat plastic though I don't think..?
But I suppose; as one of the gears in the set is metal it may well work very well.

Water:
Crazy as it sounds, you actually want it to absorb water.
It's whats required to get the layer formed and what makes BA so slippery.
You actually want to make an acid to 'attack' the metal!
The thin boron oxide layer formed then stops any further 'attack'!

I don't know if you are aware but an oxide layer forms on cut or filed aluminum almost immediately.
That layer then stops the rest of the aluminum from oxidizing away before your eyes.
This is a similar thing, but requires water instead of air to form the layer.

If you're interested and have some old stuff, I can get into some ideas on how to get oil and (a tiny bit of) water (with BA in it) to 'play nice' together.

 

[Logic11]

Marty The expert in lubrication here:

Bearings? Not sure?

Bicycle chains. DON'T BUY NOTHING. Just use whatever ya got. Motor oil is best. Any old motor oil. Look in the garage, shed, basement, or under the kitchen sink. How to get oil from bottle to chain? If you don't have one of these - oil can. Drill a little hole in oil bottle cap.

I use paper towels to wipe up excess oil.

Yes that is exactly what I have always done marty.

But plz do have a very good look at the 1st post.
If mixing some BA into that same "whatever ya got" oil decreases friction by "1000%" (Not a Typo! See the patent) one might actually be able to notice a difference if you did all the bearings etc involved in pedaling and coasting.

It may even be noticeable in extended range on E-bikes.

 

[Logic11]

While this may work (as well as some of the claims I don't know) so do all the other additives found oils and greases. Many of which function in a similar if not the same way. So saying a dramatic improvement from base oil is kind of a cheating claim since most any decent additive containing oil will be dramatically better than it's base oil let alone if you made and oil and only use additives to accomplish one goal and ignored the side effects and drawbacks.

The problem I see with the function mentioned, that is forming an ultra hard surface layer, which is also how numerous other wear and friction additives operate, is just like those other additives that doesn't always work. In some conditions it works great but that super hard layer is also often quite brittle so under some loads it will tend to crack and break apart. Some other additives form a thicker and somewhat softer layer that while may not be as good at friction performs better for wear in those conditions. The conditions inside an engine are probably some of the hardest ones to make an oil for imaginable. An additive that does one thing often will have negative effects on other aspects leading to adding other additives to counter that and so on and so forth.

From swatting up on BA; the super hard layer is just the 1st er... layer in the layer.
After that it transitions to something of a frangible (for lack of a better word) super slippery layer.
In sleeve type bearings; any layer that is scratched off turns back into acid and fills in the scratch again.

Of all the additives I have looked at, nothing comes close to BA.
See the graphs at the bottom of the 1st post.
(Graphene is the new thing being researched atm. It's is not nearly as easy to get or integrate into lubricants IMHO so I havent got into it, vs BA where I've seen it working for years)

My experiences with BA in car differential (~5 years +) where there are ball/roller bearings has been good, so no breaking of the brittle layer as far as I can tell.

 

[scianiac]

From swatting up on BA; the super hard layer is just the 1st er... layer in the layer.
After that it transitions to something of a frangible (for lack of a better word) super slippery layer.
In sleeve type bearings; any layer that is scratched off turns back into acid and fills in the scratch again.

Of all the additives I have looked at, nothing comes close to BA.
See the graphs at the bottom of the 1st post.
(Graphene is the new thing being researched atm. It's is not nearly as easy to get or integrate into lubricants IMHO so I havent got into it, vs BA where I've seen it working for years)

My experiences with BA in car differential (~5 years +) where there are ball/roller bearings has been good, so no breaking of the brittle layer as far as I can tell.

I have no doubt that it works, although it sounds like it works just like any number of other additives, the resulting structure is probably exactly the same as some of the other boron based additives. Why Boric Acid specifically doesn't seem very common compared to those I don't know, perhaps due to how it changes PH and messes with other stuff. I think specifically alkylated borates and borate esters would be the commonly used additives as they are just boric acid bonded to other stuff to make them more oil soluble and play nicer.

I guess my only point here is yes I think boric acid works and probably works quite well but it's nothing magical and in fact more advanced versions of it are already quite commonly used in various oils. It's just that most additives are only talked about in very specialized fields of lubricant engineering, you rarely ever know what additives are used in any given product and buying them is quite a pain although not impossible. For instance I did manage to get some Barium Dinonylnaphthalene Sulfonate additive awhile back for a project but it was quite a pain.

I would expect that these would perform well with things like roller bearings and many modern gears. Things like engine valve train and less tight tolerances gears maybe less so, hard to say, this stuff is complicated.

As for the amazing claims of wear and friction I think they are probably correct but also a bit deceptive. Basically any additive will make the oil perform vastly better at the job that that additive is for so if you test just the things that additive is really good at vs a base oil. But that kind of ignores the point because you need to compare it against other additives and balance all the conditions. If you put straight base oil in your engine it will be total garbage and similarly if you put straight base oil with only anti-wear additives it will also be terrible because it will only be good at that one thing and terrible, probably worse, than just base at all the other things.

 

[Logic11]

I have no doubt that it works, although it sounds like it works just like any number of other additives, the resulting structure is probably exactly the same as some of the other boron based additives. Why Boric Acid specifically doesn't seem very common compared to those I don't know, perhaps due to how it changes PH and messes with other stuff. I think specifically alkylated borates and borate esters would be the commonly used additives as they are just boric acid bonded to other stuff to make them more oil soluble and play nicer.

I guess my only point here is yes I think boric acid works and probably works quite well but it's nothing magical and in fact more advanced versions of it are already quite commonly used in various oils. It's just that most additives are only talked about in very specialized fields of lubricant engineering, you rarely ever know what additives are used in any given product and buying them is quite a pain although not impossible. For instance I did manage to get some Barium Dinonylnaphthalene Sulfonate additive awhile back for a project but it was quite a pain.

I would expect that these would perform well with things like roller bearings and many modern gears. Things like engine valve train and less tight tolerances gears maybe less so, hard to say, this stuff is complicated.

As for the amazing claims of wear and friction I think they are probably correct but also a bit deceptive. Basically any additive will make the oil perform vastly better at the job that that additive is for so if you test just the things that additive is really good at vs a base oil. But that kind of ignores the point because you need to compare it against other additives and balance all the conditions. If you put straight base oil in your engine it will be total garbage and similarly if you put straight base oil with only anti-wear additives it will also be terrible because it will only be good at that one thing and terrible, probably worse, than just base at all the other things.

Nice to find someone who knows a bit about tribology here scianiac.

My reading of the alkylated borates and esters is that they are ok but, as you say, nothing special.
Molybdenum disulfide only seems to be effective in dry conditions, as in way drier than what is found in normal air.

IMHO the thing that makes BA so effective is in fact the water I added and moisture in the air and in engines where around a liter of water is produced for every liter of fuel burned and around 4ml/min of water gets into the crankcase, but as steam/vapour.

I don't want to sound like some sort of BA evangelist here, but will say that BA has worked VERY well in the 20 or so engines (and some gearboxes etc) I have tried it in.

As I have this paper open:

Tribology for Greener Combustion Engines​

"...the fuel consumption in cars and stationary diesel generators was reduced with an average of 6 and 10% respectively.​

...When a large transportation and logistics company used the fuel additive in ten of their light trucks, they observed fuel savings of more than 10%..."

https://uu.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1161025/FULLTEXT01.pdf

​

Now that's for a fuel additive so the cams etc and bearings got none.
As you know 10% is unheard of!

Most Importantly:
If you're about the replace your chain and wheel etc bearings, I'd love to see it tried. and get feedback!

 

[Logic11]

That's pretty interesting. Boric acid is pretty cheap and easy to find.
The gears in a geared hub or mid drive will be a better target for testing as the losses in the gears will be more significant than the chain or bearings. I've melted some gears before, so obviously there's some heat there.
Not sure if boric acid would cause corrosion issues over time. It might absorb water also.

I've just remembered some complaining about the wet (in the engine oil) clutches in motorbikes slipping fetcher.
That's a metal surface against a non metal surface, so yes; trying it inside geared E-bike motors may well be a very good idea!?

IIRC it was on this forum where a good number of people tried it in various engines, mostly mixed into acetone:

My Experience With adding Boric Acid in Engine oil

My Experience With adding Boric Acid in Engine oil

www.team-bhp.com

 

[fechter]

It would be great to test it on some kind of dyno to see if the difference is measurable. Also, you can get metal gears for some motors like the BBSHD. Might be good for internally geared hubs too.

 

[Logic11]

It would be great to test it on some kind of dyno to see if the difference is measurable. Also, you can get metal gears for some motors like the BBSHD. Might be good for internally geared hubs too.

Ye! All metal would be great!
I think the treated metal gears would be way quieter too.

I would want the gears well run in 1st though:
The initial layer is as hard as the hobs of hell, so you don't want to lose any edge by them not being run in.
Then there's the 2 microns of play removed to consider.

I dyno would be nice, but just range would tell a lot.
Top speed too, in bikes not KV limited.

(NB That there are company's selling stuff in engine oils and greases. IIRC:
Motorsilk
Boron CLS
There are others to.
They're waaay expensive for something you can make yourself and their stuff takes a long time to kick in and doesnt have the effect I saw form what I have read)

 

[AZeBikeGuy]

I'm more of the attitude with chains is to use whatever oil you have on hand that's easiest to grab and apply since in my experience... frequent lubrication is the most important factor (by far) and any little obstacle can too often be an impediment to doing it... maybe I'm just the only lazy one but I sure as heck aren't going to be wasting time mixing some concoction when I'd rather just go ride... and even a good chain is cheap... I can't imagine ther's enough efficiency differnce in any lube to make any kind of meaningful difference... and after all, I got a big box of 'trons to make up for any that might exist...

Then again I'm old and counting down the days... no time to waste on frivolity...

 

[scianiac]

I'm the opposite, I wax my chains with a custom additive package for the same reason (because I'm lazy), I do it once and it lasts a long long time, isn't messy, no dirt sticks to it so I just don't have to think about constantly applying oil that is just going to attract dirt and fall off right away. I'm wondering if BA might make it into my next wax version.

 

[AZeBikeGuy]

I dunno... takes me about one minute to lube the chain... let's say I do it every 100mi... naw let's say every 50mi... so 1000mi ~20minutes... easy peasy, no muss no fuss, no tools/equipment short of a paper towel and the oil dripper (or spray can)...

 

[scianiac]

Perhaps but if I can wax my chain every several hundred miles even if it takes twice as long per mile it's way less times so just less messing around. That combined with the waxed chain will be far better protected and last far longer than oil and it's not an oily mess attracting dirt which is grinding up everything else in the process. And I mean the wax will protect the chain far better than a good additive oil, against just regular oil it's not even viable to compare them. The pressures on a chain with any amount of real power through it are immense, easily enough to break through the film and unmodified oil will have. Additives like PTFE, MoS2, WS2, ZDDP, BA, etc and the extremely long hydrocarbon chains of wax are what is actually preventing metal on metal contact. Also with my riding I put miles on slowly but they are very hard on the chain so the grit rejection, corrosion protection and EP protection while I'm putting 5kw though a bike chain are more important.

The question now is how BA factors into play with other additives, where are it's strengths and weaknesses vs those, when do they compete vs compliment.

 

[Logic11]

I'm more of the attitude with chains is to use whatever oil you have on hand that's easiest to grab and apply since in my experience... frequent lubrication is the most important factor (by far) and any little obstacle can too often be an impediment to doing it... maybe I'm just the only lazy one but I sure as heck aren't going to be wasting time mixing some concoction when I'd rather just go ride... and even a good chain is cheap... I can't imagine ther's enough efficiency differnce in any lube to make any kind of meaningful difference... and after all, I got a big box of 'trons to make up for any that might exist...

Then again I'm old and counting down the days... no time to waste on frivolity... View attachment 363158

I get ya!

See the attached pic.

(from: https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/03/f11/merit08_fenske.pdf)

That's over a 8X drop in friction, so you might just be able top notice a difference..?

You might ride to a chemist shop, buy some Boric Acid powder, and sprinkle it on your chain and into the wheel etc bearings and carry on riding.

You won't notice a damn thing for ages IMHO as you're now just relying on the moisture in the air to do the reaction.
I'm guessing it could take months of: Oil-sprinkle, oil-sprinkle.
IF and when it kicks in the process will have been so gradual you still wont have noticed a damn thing!

Some steam would speed up the reaction process thx to heat and moisture.

This stuff reacts with the metal surface in your chain, creating basically a ceramic layer of Boric Oxide, with Boric Acid on top.​

BA can be thought of as a pack of microscopic playing cards sliding over each other and filling in an microscopic valleys in the metal surfaces.​

​

The initial ceramic layer is 85% the hardness of diamond and a barrier to rust and even the acids that form in engine oil due to combustion products reacting with water etc in the oil.​

ie: I doubt if you'd ever be buying or wasting ride time fitting another chain or bearing..?
"...just go ride..."

 

[Logic11]

Perhaps but if I can wax my chain every several hundred miles even if it takes twice as long per mile it's way less times so just less messing around. That combined with the waxed chain will be far better protected and last far longer than oil and it's not an oily mess attracting dirt which is grinding up everything else in the process. And I mean the wax will protect the chain far better than a good additive oil, against just regular oil it's not even viable to compare them. The pressures on a chain with any amount of real power through it are immense, easily enough to break through the film and unmodified oil will have. Additives like PTFE, MoS2, WS2, ZDDP, BA, etc and the extremely long hydrocarbon chains of wax are what is actually preventing metal on metal contact. Also with my riding I put miles on slowly but they are very hard on the chain so the grit rejection, corrosion protection and EP protection while I'm putting 5kw though a bike chain are more important.

The question now is how BA factors into play with other additives, where are it's strengths and weaknesses vs those, when do they compete vs compliment.

What wax do you use scianiac?
I'd like to swat it up a bit and see if I can come up with a 'Add BA plan' for you.

 

[99t4]

I waxed my chain in the late '80s. Soaked/agitated the chain in a large coffee can on a stove burner. I liked how the chain stayed clean but it did not last very long in wet conditions. And it would skip on the small rear cogs in the cold.

The wax I used was standard bricks of paraffin wax sold for candlemaking.

 

[scianiac]

Ok I actually had the chance to read through the patent from the patent it sounds to work a bit differently than you explained. From the patent it seems the boric acid is acting just like MoS2 or WS2 that is through slipping of the layers in it's lamellar crystalline structure. The only reference to reacting with water is "Boric oxide particles mixed with polymers form boric acid particles on the exposed surface by reacting with moisture in the surrounding atmosphere." So just another way to get the boric acid but only on the surface of a polymer instead of adding it directly. I don't see anything about forming a super hard layer by reacting with the metal.

If this is the case I wonder the differences in performance of BA, MoS2, and WS2. I know WS2 is a fair bit lower friction than MoS2, I used MoS2 in my wax but only because I didn't know about WS2 at the time. Regardless these types of additives have are not magic, they are very effective EP additives and lower friction nicely under EP conditions but they don't lower friction at lower pressure levels. Basically you need enough pressure to squeeze the layers in between the base metal and get the layers to start slipping, at low pressures the particals just sorta move around and can actually increase wear if the base material is too soft. This is why you don't want to use this these additives with polymer gears. Anyway an interesting thing I noticed is that the patent talks about combing it with other additives. I've seen interesting papers that show PTFE additives acturally work very synergisticly with MoS2 because the PTFE lowers the friction at lower pressures where the MoS2 does not and vise versa. For a chain lube through I see no reason why BA wouldn't work well, better than the current benchmark that is WS2 I'm not sure. And there is also the issue of the BA being acidic of course which can be beneficial or harmful depending on conditions I think.

I don't see anything on BA forming any super hard iron boron compouds like in boron treated steel which typically requires very high termperatures.

Edit:
Here is an interesting comparison: Table - PMC

 

[marty]

So what is Boric Acid? I got the internet. Roach powder, Don't be breathing that.

Boric Acid vaginal suppository. Lets not go there.

Boric Acid eye solution. I see.

Boric acid is used in some nuclear power plants as a neutron poison. Sounds dangerous?

According to Marty's 5 minutes of Boric Acid research. Magic powder that is anything you want it to be. Like most medicine, as long as you believe it is good, it will be good for rusty chains, vaginal issues or anything that's bothering you.