Anyone used the 1500w ebay hub motor?

[Hummina Shadeeba]

But they could halve the shipping cost if they had distributors in different countries. Slow-boat ship 500 to USA and I can buy them from there instead of having the single motor coming all the way from china.

 

[Balmorhea]

But they could halve the shipping cost if they had distributors in different countries. Slow-boat ship 500 to USA and I can buy them from there instead of having the single motor coming all the way from china.

On the other hand, I've never gotten smacked with a punitive import tariff when buying one of something directly from China, but the container load will have to absorb that cost (and then you will). Then they have to pay all the taxes and baksheesh for the privilege of doing business here.

I don't blame Leaf if they don't think it's worth it.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Ive gotten tariff fees when importing small quantities or singles from china. Generally the carrier pays it and then gives me a bill

 

[E-HP]

The number of options for efficient, thin lamination hub motors are pretty limited now. Leaf may be one of the only games in town. I don't see the Edge, a similar motor, but with a cast stator, available from anyone still in business anymore.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Leaf is encouraging me to do one cross lacing. Is that good?
They also don’t have a drawing of their hub to figure what spoke lengths to get and are just telling me to go with 166mm and 1x with my sun rhyno lite 24” rim after first telling me 1x isn’t good enough. Not that it’s that hard to measure the hub flanges but still they should have a drawing available.

Why they can’t just post a pic with dimensions so I can figure what spokes I need myself I don’t understand

The eBay hub has the exact same case as the Leaf. The leads are a bit fatter on the leaf. Haven’t gotten around to comparing the electrical resistance

 

[Balmorhea]

Leaf is encouraging me to do one cross lacing. Is that good?

Probably. What's the rim size?

Hub motors are usually large in diameter enough that the choice of lacing pattern is between 0 and 1. Little wheels with big hubs get radial lacing; full sized wheels get cross-one lacing. It's a function of how extreme the insertion angle to the rim is. Spokes can go about 15 degrees from perpendicular into the rim, depending on a lot of factors, before things get funny. If you push it too far, your spokes will break annoyingly often.

Motorcycle rims often have their holes oriented towards one side of the flange or another. While this limits your lacing pattern options, it allows more extreme insertion angles.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

It’s 24” rim. It has holes oriented with the sides. I’ll do 1x then thanks.

 

[Balmorhea]

It’s 24” rim. It has holes oriented with the sides. I’ll do 1x then thanks.

That's probably fine.

When I was talking about spoke holes on MC rims being oriented towards one side or the other, I didn't mean right or left flange. I meant clockwise versus counterclockwise, leading versus trailing. Bicycle rims almost never have that feature, but MC rims often do. Here's an example; check out the "eyeball" orientation of the spoke holes:

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

I had a bunch of torque arms made that also adapt the hub motor to fit in the common bmx 14mm dropouts and while the fit is very tight between the dropout and the part the interface between the part and the axle has a bit of play and I’m wondering if using regen, with the axle being twisted back and forth, is it worth getting some made that have a tighter fit?

 

[E-HP]

the part the interface between the part and the axle has a bit of play and I’m wondering if using regen, with the axle being twisted back and forth, is it worth getting some made that have a tighter fit?

Yes.

 

[Balmorhea]

I had a bunch of torque arms made that also adapt the hub motor to fit in the common bmx 14mm dropouts and while the fit is very tight between the dropout and the part the interface between the part and the axle has a bit of play and I’m wondering if using regen, with the axle being twisted back and forth, is it worth getting some made that have a tighter fit?

Even the smallest amount of reversing torsional movement, between otherwise very tight parts, can cause the threaded fastener (axle nut in this case) to gradually back off. The looser the axle nut becomes, the greater the force transferred to the flats on the axle and the torque arm, either of which can be damaged that way. Bottom line is, a tight fit is good, but it may not make the difference.

A clamping torque arm works around this problem by establishing a static preload force that must be exceeded before the axle is able to move relative to the torque arm.

Another method some folks use is Nord-Lock washers, which if they are installed to spec, won't loosen until they reach a threshold torque value. There are requirements regarding part surface hardness, absence of other washers, etc., to make them work as designed.

Folks on this forum don't talk much about safety wiring or cotter pinning fasteners, but that's another method that's proven to work.

 

[99t4]

Might you be able to fit in some shim stock?
https://www.mcmaster.com/shim-stock/

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

think ill get others made with tighter fit and rather not shim. dumb i had 10 made. they are nice and tight against the frame but a bit loose against the hub. if anyone wants any i'll sell them cheaper than i got them..half the price. but I guess the torque arm is really just a backup anyway and should be relying on friction? guess i'll get those Nord locking washers.



but what of the spoke crossing on a rear hub or a front wheel with disk brakes? i think i was told radial lacing 36 spokes with this motor and a 20" rim would be necessary...right?
and if i can do that can i just do radial on the front 32 spoke 20" wheel as well and run a disk brake or do they need some crossing?


And selling torque arms for 3/8” axle as well as adapters for 14mm bmx dropouts:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=108583&p=1588655#p1588655


Took the bolts out of the motor and it’s not coming apart that easily and I guess pressed or glued together.

 

[E-HP]

but I guess the torque arm is really just a backup anyway and should be relying on friction?

No, if your frame is aluminum, the torque arms are your primary protection against spinning your dropouts.

 

[goatman]

i have the xf40 that looks like your motor, Grin laced it in the dh rim on their site with new dual gauge "bent" sapim spokes. i think i have 5000kms on the wheel build and no issues.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=103834&p=1563109&hilit=scorpion#p1520878

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

looks like one-cross in the pic. should i do that instead of radial? id just be using standard spokes and rim. it's been a while and my memory is going but i thought radial was best as it wont be bending the spokes...and that's how that pic of the eyelet rim got posted to explain.


the frame is steel.

 

[goatman]

to do the bend like that, its working, when it got hot in the summer i had to tighten a couple spokes about 2000kms ago.
i think the rim holes are drilled at an angle also and Grin knows what theyre doing.
that maxx daddy tire, i cut the bead off, got a moped tube and stuffed both inside that fiction night moves tire at the end of that thread, so its heavy mass now and i do 75km/h on it sometimes pulling a trailer at that speed.

 

[markz]

.

So you buy the 1500W off ebay link from 1st post or you buy Leaf or both?

Open up the motor and see if the ebay link motor from 1st post is 35mm lamination thickness.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

I got both. they look identical except for a bit fatter phase wires with the leaf. i havent compared the resistances yet.

i took the screws out but its not falling apart and i guess pressed or glued together and i gave up looking inside. i think i remember someone here having opened it to get a look and maybe was even this thread.

can i do radial laced 13 gauge or should it be 12 gauge?

probably more important by my measurements the spokes should be 78mm if laced radially and i only see 80mm spokes available. i read better to be on the shorter side not longer. Or should i do 1x or will it be too sharp a bend for the spoke?

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

i have the xf40 that looks like your motor, Grin laced it in the dh rim on their site with new dual gauge "bent" sapim spokes. i think i have 5000kms on the wheel build and no issues.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=103834&p=1563109&hilit=scorpion#p1520878

so you think 1x is better than radial? i see leaf sells it radial but worried the spokes will be too long and the shortest i can get is like 2mm too long

are they special spokes or standard? ill do 1x to be safe as long as a regular spoke can bend that much. what spoke you recommend? its a 388 ird rim and the hub is 233mm diameter flange as far as i can tell. they dont say on their site and it's actually kinda hard to measure exactly.

 

[markz]

I got both. they look identical except for a bit fatter phase wires with the leaf. i havent compared the resistances yet.

i took the screws out but its not falling apart and i guess pressed or glued together and i gave up looking inside. i think i remember someone here having opened it to get a look and maybe was even this thread.

can i do radial laced 13 gauge or should it be 12 gauge?

probably more important by my measurements the spokes should be 78mm if laced radially and i only see 80mm spokes available. i read better to be on the shorter side not longer. Or should i do 1x or will it be too sharp a bend for the spoke?

The ebay motor is a confirmed 35H motor with the thinner laminations (same as Leaf 1.5kw) and same number of laminations?
Also the wire diameter of a winding would be good info to have. I will try to search for that other thread you talk about.
The problem I dont like about that ebay motor is you cant specify what Turn Count you want, they probably package up whatevers laying around or whatever they want to get rid of. A good comparison between two ebay motors of different winds would be good to but asking to much. Can't go wrong with that price. I'd be in for a front motor.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

I got both. they look identical except for a bit fatter phase wires with the leaf. i havent compared the resistances yet.

i took the screws out but its not falling apart and i guess pressed or glued together and i gave up looking inside. i think i remember someone here having opened it to get a look and maybe was even this thread.

can i do radial laced 13 gauge or should it be 12 gauge?

probably more important by my measurements the spokes should be 78mm if laced radially and i only see 80mm spokes available. i read better to be on the shorter side not longer. Or should i do 1x or will it be too sharp a bend for the spoke?

The ebay motor is a confirmed 35H motor with the thinner laminations (same as Leaf 1.5kw) and same number of laminations?
Also the wire diameter of a winding would be good info to have. I will try to search for that other thread you talk about.
The problem I dont like about that ebay motor is you cant specify what Turn Count you want, they probably package up whatevers laying around or whatever they want to get rid of. A good comparison between two ebay motors of different winds would be good to but asking to much. Can't go wrong with that price. I'd be in for a front motor.

whats the flange diameter on this 35H if it's the same as this? so frustrated with figuring the spokes and with them being custom cut and non-returnable i dont want to screw it up.
radial or 1x? 12 or 13 gauge?

 

[markz]

whats the flange diameter on this 35H if it's the same as this? so frustrated with figuring the spokes and with them being custom cut and non-returnable i dont want to screw it up.
radial or 1x? 12 or 13 gauge?

Yeah well, your going to have to measure it yourself and hopefully you can post up the dimensions on this thread. Its frustrating for sure, as you want to order the hub motor and the spokes so when the motor comes in the mail you can lace it up then and there, rather then waiting longer for your spokes to come.

I measured the Leaf 1500W but that piece of paper is long gone, it matched up close if not exact to what was found in the Leaf 1500W thread, and of course I triple checked with my own measurements and of course I have a local store that cuts spokes to length.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

whats the flange diameter on this 35H if it's the same as this? so frustrated with figuring the spokes and with them being custom cut and non-returnable i dont want to screw it up.
radial or 1x? 12 or 13 gauge?

Yeah well, your going to have to measure it yourself and hopefully you can post up the dimensions on this thread. Its frustrating for sure, as you want to order the hub motor and the spokes so when the motor comes in the mail you can lace it up then and there, rather then waiting longer for your spokes to come.

I measured the Leaf 1500W but that piece of paper is long gone, it matched up close if not exact to what was found in the Leaf 1500W thread, and of course I triple checked with my own measurements and of course I have a local store that cuts spokes to length.

i got 233mm for the flange from hole to hole. i'll look for the thread and see what others got. but should i do 1x or radial you think and 12 or 13 gauge ok?

also i have two 20" rims and one says its 390mm ird but i line it up with the other rim that's written up as 388 and it's got a greater distance not less. Envy rim at 390 and the Promax claims 388. i see the Promax at at least 400mm assuming the envy is even 390

 

[markz]

i got 233mm for the flange from hole to hole. i'll look for the thread and see what others got. but should i do 1x or radial you think and 12 or 13 gauge ok?

also i have two 20" rims and one says its 390mm ird but i line it up with the other rim that's written up as 388 and it's got a greater distance not less. Envy rim at 390 and the Promax claims 388. i see the Promax at at least 400mm assuming the envy is even 390

1X is ideal, but smaller rim 20" may need a radial lace. I would start off with a 1X and see how it goes with a dry run and if its too tight go for a radial. Looking at spoke angle from here https://ebikes.ca/tools/spoke-calc.html?pair=false&rim=20P17

Spoke Angle: This is the angle between the spoke and the tangent line of the rim. Generally speaking, if the angle is more than 80 degrees then it can be laced with relative ease. If the angle is less than 75 degrees, then the spoke nipples will have some difficulty in angling in the same direction as the spokes, and you may need to either put a bend in the spoke so that it enters the rim a bit more radially, or drill out the rim holes slightly larger so that the nipples have more freedom to pivot. Angles less than about 70 degrees are quite problematic and best avoided.

Two rims that close you wont notice any difference and its measured from just beyond the spoke hole inside the rim to the other side.