Best value bike for hill climbing about 10miles straight.

[dogman dan]

Without gears, he will need 500 watts. But he wants to ride normaly, pedal power, for a majority of his ride. So a real light gearmotor, light battery, and a controller that puts out low watts is the way to still get up the hill, and not get so heavy, or have to pedal through cogging resistance. Even that way, he'll be dragging along at least 20-30 pounds of extra weight while he pedals. I think, like you, that it's a lot more practical to go 500 watts, and enough battery to ride powered all the way. But to each his own. A 408 and a lifepo4 would be dandy for his ride, but he says he doesn't want it that way.

 

[Brainersan]

This is great information about climbing hills. I am in Southern Vermont with a climb that is similar to some described. 1200 foot drop over 14 miles in and then the opposite on the way back. On a road bike my best time is 46 mins in and a very comfortable time is 52-53. Home though is at least 1:25 and I'm wiped out. I don't mind pedaling on the way home but not full tilt. I would love to make it home in an hour. My project bike is good: a 2002 Trek 8500. I will remove the shocks from the front. I am thinking the Phoenix Brute 48v system should do well. If anyone disagrees or thinks my goal is unrealistic, please let me know. Thanks, all!

 

[Drunkskunk]

This is great information about climbing hills. I am in Southern Vermont with a climb that is similar to some described. 1200 foot drop over 14 miles in and then the opposite on the way back. On a road bike my best time is 46 mins in and a very comfortable time is 52-53. Home though is at least 1:25 and I'm wiped out. I don't mind pedaling on the way home but not full tilt. I would love to make it home in an hour. My project bike is good: a 2002 Trek 8500. I will remove the shocks from the front. I am thinking the Phoenix Brute 48v system should do well. If anyone disagrees or thinks my goal is unrealistic, please let me know. Thanks, all!

Welcome to the forum.
the 8500 is a nice bike, should do you well.
But the Brute is a 25 pound motor. Its more suited to building a lightweight electric motorcycle. Lots of fun, but with the battery and controller weight added, a heavy brute to pedal.

A Geared hub motor like a BMC or eZee will give you similar hill climbing torque, but with a total weight 2/3rds less

 

[Brainersan]

Thanks for that. I sent an inquiry to ebikes.ca yesterday and got these recommendations back:
Possible setups:
48v 408
36v eZee hub
36v Nine Continent hub
48v 5304 (this is fast and powerful but probably overkill and too heavy)

Any feedback? Also, I see that you list in your signature a 408 which I had under consideration - would you discount that for the ride I described (sounds like "yes" for weight reasons)? I definitely would like to avoid a casual ride home only to run out of juice and then have to pedal a 100 pound monster the last few miles uphill!

 

[tostino]

Thanks for that. I sent an inquiry to ebikes.ca yesterday and got these recommendations back:
Possible setups:
48v 408
36v eZee hub
36v Nine Continent hub
48v 5304 (this is fast and powerful but probably overkill and too heavy)

Any feedback? Also, I see that you list in your signature a 408 which I had under consideration - would you discount that for the ride I described (sounds like "yes" for weight reasons)? I definitely would like to avoid a casual ride home only to run out of juice and then have to pedal a 100 pound monster the last few miles uphill!

Well then thats all about battery capacity. A 20ah Ping battery would get you home no problem, as long as you are not against pedaling to help out. Ping batteries shouldn't be discharged at over 2c (most people try to stick to 1.5c to increase cycle life) so that means, you want to try and keep the amp draw at around 30 amps. That is TONS of power, however, your motor will ask for more if your controller can provide it. So pedaling along with will keep the amp draw lower to maintain the same speed.

 

[dogman dan]

If you want to pedal more normaly on the downhill run, the ezee, or other gearmotor is the ticket, since they freewheel. That allows more efficient pulse and glide type riding too. For powered riding all the time, then the 408 or the 9 continents will work very well, as also will the other makes of mid size hubmotors, WE , Golden. Power up with the ping of your favorite voltage, 48v for more speed, 36v for a slightly lighter weight. 20 ah size will give you a reserve for both lessening the strain on the cells, and for that nasty day when to get home you ride uphill for 15 miles into a 35 mph headwind. Like my ride yesterday, it took 95% of my capacity, when the day before used 60%.

 

[Drunkskunk]

Thanks for that. I sent an inquiry to ebikes.ca yesterday and got these recommendations back:
Possible setups:
48v 408
36v eZee hub
36v Nine Continent hub
48v 5304 (this is fast and powerful but probably overkill and too heavy)

Any feedback? Also, I see that you list in your signature a 408 which I had under consideration - would you discount that for the ride I described (sounds like "yes" for weight reasons)? I definitely would like to avoid a casual ride home only to run out of juice and then have to pedal a 100 pound monster the last few miles uphill!

The 408 is a great motor. I love mine, and recomend it often, But.. Its still a 15 pound motor better suited to the flats. It will climb hills pretty well at 48 volts, but not efficently, needing a big battery for the distaces you're going. Its better suited to Texas than Vermont.

Of the ones they listed, the best for the Hills and mountian roads of Vermont is the Ezee. its a lightweight mountian goat of a motor. not fast, but good at climbing, and only about (i think) 6 pounds. The battery they sell with it might not have enough range, but should be close. This is probably the best Kit for the job, you can add more batteries later if it won't cover the range.

The Nine cont is similar to the 408. Lighter, but at 36 volts, probably gutless on Vermont mountian roads.

The 5304 is sold by other retailers as the Pheonex Brute. No problem with the hills, but Heavy and will need a Big battery.

 

[Brainersan]

Thank you guys, very much. Extremely helpful. I probably would have bought the wrong gear without this feedback so of course, I am grateful. So sounds like an Ezee 48v setup might be optimal and addresses the desire to freewheel in and have some assistance on the way home - great. The only thing I am unsure of at this point is the whole 20ah reference I keep seeing. I am assuming that this refers to the rate at which power is delivered or used and therefore the controller limits this. I've read on the forums here about wires getting hot, hubs getting cooked and of course I want to avoid that. Do I have the idea right, basically? I am assuming that if I stay under a certain threshold that I can also increase the range by whatever pedaling I decide to do uphill (and reduce the strain on the system, I imagine). If my assumptions are correct, it wuld seem that then, it's down to weather, wind, etc. It's exciting to consider eliminating gas during the week, entirely!

 

[tostino]

Ah (amp hours) are the capacity of a battery. A 20 ah battery can deliver 20 amps for one hour before it's depleted. Amps are actual energy delivered (amps x volts = watts. EG: 35 amps at 48 volts = 1680 watts.

So if you are drawing 40 amps out of a 20ah battery, you will deplete it in 30min.

Do you sorta understand what i'm talking about? If you don't, I (or someone better at it) will try and explain it so you can understand.

 

[Brainersan]

Yup, that is very clear. Thank you!