Brushless dual 6kw ALIEN Power system - electric longboard

An interesting project pediglide ... but just a few comments as a long time (30 years) skater ... The controller option is an open debate and we have nothing optimal yet but using your feet for speed control is not an optimal design. You need to move your feet around for board control as well as wanting to change up stance regularly on long commutes just to stop you're legs from aching.Finally, many tricks require moving around the board a lot and having to avoid a control or having a foot tied to one is annoying. All the foot controlled boards have been a big flop.

Also, you should play with a bushless direct drive. You get all the benefits you proclaim without the need for a freewheel. Drag from coasting on a brushless is minimal and having braking as an option is a godsend ... it's not only safer but allows you to not have to resort to a slide making it better on wheel and shoe wear. (Yeah I know we usually do slides for fun :) ) I coast all the time with little noticeable drag as well as having just pushed the last 3kms home when my ESC went nuts ... and drag was barely noticeable.

If you want to understand the "essence of skating" in an electric board world have a look at the Evolve skateboards. The designer behind this board is a true skateboarder and every design choice has been about capturing the essence of skating. The only issue is the Evolve takes away the choice skaters love to have in changing the feel and handling of board to suit their weight, stance and style.
 
there is nothing special with the evolve board,
another generic pintail
I dont like that they straight ripped off the Gullwings sidewinder truck..
seems like all low end Chinese parts with a $1200 price tag
and they forum spam also...
nothing really impress me about that company.

I agree with you that most foot pedal brakes design looks awkward,
I have always recommend all eboarders to take the time to learn to footbrake and coleman slide, and not to depend solely on their ebrakes.

regarding freewheel,
I want to try it...
some people wants a drag free glide..

pediglide, that brake is on the front truck right?
haven't seen anyone stick the pedal on the front....
maybe a video of it in action....
 
Thanks for the input simonjook. I have dabbled in the those things you speak of :) If you check my other website, zurfboards.com, I have a friction-drive, wireless, brushless motor eboard. It may not be a true e-skateboard because it only has three wheels, but all of benefits and frustrations of using the rc components for eboards, I have experienced. I'd love to put this build on kickstarter, but really the issue is the reliability of the brushless (outrunner) motor. I know evolve uses a brushless motor too, but its an inrunner type. I guess I can use the shaft of the inrunner for the friction, but that will only look worse on my eboard. The reliability of these rc motors on a commercial eboard are not yet known. Boosted is just starting commercial production, Golfboard still has their kickstarter ongoing. Yuneec, just started selling (or not). They may be ok for the hobbyist, but for now, their dependability is still a big question.

The big issue with the wireless controller is...the patent. I believe altered is aggressively trying to protect it. A commercial eboard maker may use the wii remote, like metro-board is using, then maybe altered may not have a case against them. Or, you can have a wirelessly remote-controlled three-wheeler like mine :lol: Also, AFAIK, zboard is a success and commercially available. But dont get me wrong, I love what boosted is doing, as well as beetbocks' and all of you guys build. I'm just trying to incorporate the freewheel aspect and see where it goes.

sk8norcal, yes video coming up. It just too damn hot in socal right now. :x Yes, the pedal is in front. It's also higher than the rest of the board so you can remove your foot from the FSR sensor while you freewheel. I might also use less risers in the back so that the board is angled up towards the front. This makes sliding the front foot backward to initiate braking a bit better while making the the rear truck more stable. FYI, I have two motors in the back.
 
Well there you go, I am sure they have their reasons for going with brushed versus the brushless motor. Although, I'm excited about how Boosted is really trying to overcome the shortcomings of these outrunners. Way to go on those extra bearings for the shaft and shorter belt. That will keep everything tight and sturdy.
 
sk8norcal said:
there is nothing special with the evolve board,
another generic pintail
I dont like that they straight ripped off the Gullwings sidewinder truck..
seems like all low end Chinese parts with a $1200 price tag
and they forum spam also...
Click to expand...

I rode a couple of Evolve boards on multiple occasions and for extended periods. I have examined them pretty thoroughly and examined the design carefully. I really like how the board rides and how the motor does not intrude on a genuine skating experience. It's the best board I've tried by far. I didn't like the price and there were some other preferences I had (mostly hill climbing power and weight) which is why I built my own. That said I am not quite in the Boosted camp which has more power and too little range for my needs.

I know you're an Evolve hater but as someone who has also tracked their talk and yours through a number of forums, I didn't see much spam. I saw a bit of them getting the word out their and most of their pro brand talk was to counter your downright negativity. I don't know why you hate them so ... but I have find the guys (in real life) really nice, not at all pushy and really just interested in developing a new area of skateboarding in a way that skateboarders would appreciate. I don't know how you came to dislike them so but the man behind it is really nice, pretty genuine and really helpful even though he's put his house on the line to take a punt on making a product.

On it being a rip off, like all skateboards the Evolve has borrowed bits and ideas from all over but it DOES so for the purpose of capturing the experience of skateboard carving style of ride really well. In talking with them they were totally up front about where they took their design ideas from, what they changed and why they changed it.

Overall the Evolve is a great board that is really behind developing (nearly said evolving) the sport in a positive fashion that produces a product that captures the Zen of skating. I think the Boosted board is a more techy less "spirit of skating" approach to the sport but is bringing us forward leaps and bounds (due to that enormous budget) and we can just hope to get thrown some scraps of the technology they come up with.

Pedglide, yeah the Evolve using some massive inrunner - looks like a big stepper motor. I did look around the other board but to me a skate truck front with a big wheel on the rear is closer to a scooter experience than a skateboard. It certainly it does not carve or slide like a skateboard (I've ridden a similar design before in 1999 .. yes, seriously 1999). Over the last 15 years there have been a hundreds of vehicles in this sector. What I like now is we are finally getting something that has the carve and glide of a skate/snow/surfboard with a weight that can be carried around all day like a traditional board.
 
oh lord, either you are the evolve guy or you're just a shill for them.
You are like the only guy on here singing their praise...
or as you describe their board, the "essence of skating" :roll: :lol:

let's see what Evolve done so far,
Jumping on other brand's thread to hype their own crap on SF, bad form.
Claiming his battery is lipo, bad form or being ignorant.
Copying another man's patented truck design, bad form. (and it's not ok to copy just because he put his house on the line)
Copying ABEC11's cog, bad form.
Spamming Surfingdirt under username "kitchase", evolve web links in the sigs, bad form.

yeah, this is all ok cuz you know the guy got kids to feed....
gotta copy and spam to sell China crap these days..

not hatin' just pointing out BS when I see them...

*screen shot, can't see my cursor but it's over one of the link in the signature.
you can see a spam link in what was written also, usually some kind of non sense jibberish.
"KitChase" has nine spam posts so far.
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First thing for Aussies ... 168KV Turnigy SK3s are on sale from Hobbyking for $50AUD - I think thats about $15off - it does say but I forgot to check. Probably good if you're more a hill climber than a go faster rider and looking for a cheap local motor.

In reply sk8norcal
- I think claiming the battery is lipo was ignorance or a design change ... he's new to this field and it's a common misunderstanding since lifepo4 batteries have the "li" and "po" in the name. I also know Lipo scares underwriters these days and LiFePO4 makes them happy again - so maybe he was forced to change. I never asked because to the end user the difference is marginal except it's a little less likely to burst inflames beneath your feet. I think the bigger lie would be to have claimed the other way - claiming LiFe when their Lipo
- Patents suck and being in a design field I also know his changes mean it's not a breach of the patent. If they are so anal about protecting their intellectual design and freezing a whole section of potential skateboard design for themselves they should have broadened their patent. I also heard they were approached to produce a modified version of the truck with a mount for the board and poo pooed the whole thing. So more fool them for not taking a stake in the e-board business.
- Hmm, did they copy the ABEC11 hub or did they copy the score of wheels who have already copied the ABEC11 hub... or are you talking about the drive gear ... just like the one Beetbocks is copying here? We are all copying here. In fact I posted about motor mounts I was making months ago for Calibre trucks and Alien is now doing the same. Maybe I was a little upset for a day but I realised I was the one being childish and that it's perfectly fair. Or should I have patented the idea and continued to complain he copied my idea (I am not suggesting you did Beetbocks ... coincidence or copy ...who cares, life is too short and all I really want is for all of us to have great, affordable boards :) )
- Does surfingdirt ban biz links in sigs? I would actually say it's preferred ... your interests are declared and people can take your comments with a grain of salt if they feel your opinions are biasing your own product. Now if someone is extolling the virtues of some design or product and not declaring their interest in that product in the sig ... I would call that spam. If it's spam just having links in your sig then you have two!

Almost all the posts they made were on generally skateboarding and not drumming up business. The ones they made about the product were as a separate topic declaring their intent to announce a product clearly. I think it's unfair to call that spam - it was related to the subject matter of the forum, it was announced appropriately and declared openly. I read every post they made because at the time I was searching their posts looking for info on their board (I thought it was the board for me) - in fact their was a lack of content on their product and mostly discussion on boarding in general in their posts ... at the time I was disappointed because I though it was the product for me.

I read a lot of the back of forth between you guys and I got the idea from what I read (having no interest in either of you guys) that he was a touch naive and you were a touch harsh ... that's all. I think your vitriol was a little bit unfair. It didn't get out of control but it did seem a little harsh.

I don't think he's entitled to do whatever cos he's bet his house on this plan. But after reading all your posts first and then having met the Evolve guy I realise he's a chippy (or some such tradie or something), not internet savvy, just trying to do what he can and probably needed some gentle guidance rather than the internet police.

Either way the board was good and it showed me a lot about what I want form a board is possible unlike all the brushed and some brushless junk that came before it. The thing it really tells me between it and Boosted is I think I will end up having to go sensored. BTW, I wish I had some involvement with Evolve so I could have one instead of all the cash, time and skin I've gone through on my board. I think I could have paid for one almost ... though I don't think it wold go up my hill.
 
In my experience the Evolve dude was a dick. I tried to get him to sell me the ABEC 11 gear cog. He was a total *** about it. He said I didn't know how much work went into it and he would only sell it to people that had already bought a board. I ended up having to make my own gear cog in spite. I am a pretty easy going person, but the email exchange with him made me want to punch him. I don't know how you are going to make a profit and be successful if you don't want to sell anything. I never got attitude from Altered or Eskate when I asked about their products. They will sell all their parts if you want them.
Sorry for the bashing. I am still a bit pissed about that.
 
hey simonjook, tell us more great things about the evolveboard !!!
keep these infomercial, cough.. i meant.. informative post coming
yes agreeed, spambots are A-OK !!!

go ahead and try post stuff like that here, and we will see how long you will last...

*gee, i wonder where that tumbler link goes to...
surprise! more evolve spam!!
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simonjook said:
Pedglide, yeah the Evolve using some massive inrunner - looks like a big stepper motor. I did look around the other board but to me a skate truck front with a big wheel on the rear is closer to a scooter experience than a skateboard. It certainly it does not carve or slide like a skateboard (I've ridden a similar design before in 1999 .. yes, seriously 1999). Over the last 15 years there have been a hundreds of vehicles in this sector. What I like now is we are finally getting something that has the carve and glide of a skate/snow/surfboard with a weight that can be carried around all day like a traditional board.
Click to expand...

Yes, you're right, it does not carve or slide like a skateboard. My goal was to make a lightweight eboard, lighter than Boosted, it is just over 10 lbs; something that kids can carry and put in their lockers. Also, I wanted to be clear from the "wireless-remote patent" and not be harassed :) I still plan to launch it, but I'm still having a problem finding a small, light and long-lasting outrunner.

With regards to carving, I do not like those sidewinder trucks for carving. IMO, their tippy not carvy; better for slaloms than long cutbacks. I like my S10 better for deep carving. Also, there is a reason why I have two motors in this new build. I plan to introduce tank-style electric carving :mrgreen:
 
I agree with what Dirkdiggler said. I've tried asking evolve guy for something too and he was a jerk about it as well. He said you DIY'ers go figure it out.

Everyone will eventually copy everyone else. That's what we're doing here on these forums. Copying others eboard, ebike, etc designs and making our own.

The evolve board does look good but I wouldn't pay for it. I'm happy with my DIY Eboard.
 
Yes, you're right, it does not carve or slide like a skateboard. My goal was to make a lightweight eboard, lighter than Boosted, it is just over 10 lbs; something that kids can carry and put in their lockers. Also, I wanted to be clear from the "wireless-remote patent" and not be harassed :) I still plan to launch it, but I'm still having a problem finding a small, light and long-lasting outrunner.
Click to expand...

Wow, that weight is incredibly impressive - I am surprised you can get that light and would have expected a conventional truck wold have been lighter. In what way is it that the outrunners fail?

I agree with what Dirkdiggler said. I've tried asking evolve guy for something too and he was a jerk about it as well. He said you DIY'ers go figure it out.
Click to expand...

Well he is trying to make a business and he did spend a lot of money (so he claimed IRL) to get away from the same crap suppliers that make all those other boards and produce a million knock offs in China. There have been other hubs before the Evolve that I tried to buy (direct email) and I was also told to sod off presumably because they see it cannibalising board sales. The only ones you could and still can buy (and apart from Alien) are the crappy ones with proprietary Chinese wheels. I don't support the guy being a jerk but I do empathise with producing a product he needs to sell for $1000 to get my money back and getting upset by 1000 request for just a $50 part off it so they don't have to buy my product. Especially when they think they are entitled to it for some reason. I get that and it's why I lived with escooters and ebikes (well I wanted an ebike) until Alien came around. So if the guy was a jerk just cos he was, thats a shame ... if you all think he was a jerk cos he wouldn't undermine his own business just to sell you a single part off your board then you guys are the jerks. His biz, his choice ... and if it sinks him well you can go around and tell your friends "I told him so"

Enough said on the matter... I like the board and I don't know they guy.. I've met him once, had a long talk about it and the design choices and that's it. In person he was not a jerk and also was not pushy on the sale. This war over Evolve has focused on the guy and my comments were simply that it's a great board ... great in that it gave me the hope that electric skateboards could be skateboards first and powered second i.e. no horrible compromise to the ride. I rode a lot of products and even owned a couple and this was the first that wasn't &#*%. In fact it's my DIY board with all the rough edges fixed (no cogging, no brake issues which I don't have but others do, no controller drop outs, no belt skip). If the guys a jerk so be it - a boatload of guys owning businesses are jerks.

Ok ... can we kill the thread highjack now?
 
go ahead and try post stuff like that here, and we will see how long you will last...
Click to expand...
Thanks for the threats ... ffs ... grow up. I tried to make a comment about the product and you went all hostile because you don't like the guy. I don't really care about the guy, I do care that the product inspired me to give e-skateboard another chance. But you are the one being a total jerk. Just like you trolled him you are now trolling me. I only have interest in talking about boards - you suckered me into a discussion about about the guy and I did that because I saw previously that you'd gone after him and I met him and he seemed ok and it seemed you were just being a bully... like you are now. I now see that's just what you do - sucker people into arguments. I won't be discussing it nor discussing anything with you further. If you want to go on about it forever take it to a PM and stop boring everybody (like I am in reply too). If you so love the sound of your own words and attacking others, perhaps take up seat in politics.

Back on topic ... I've had no end of issues with my board lately and have finally discovered that it's my HK GT2 transmitter ... I had a broken lead on the antenna (presumably from a big stack) and resoldering hasn't fixed it (maybe my bad soldering). I know some folk talked about buying the GT2B with the built in battery. Has anyone used one of these yet - how is it? Reliable? Battery life? Hows the weight cos it looks like it will be really light and a big improvement. I'd go off the Hobbyking weight specs but I've found these a bit unreliable in the past and seem to have more to do with what they want to charge for shipping :p
 
simonjook said:
Back on topic ... I've had no end of issues with my board lately and have finally discovered that it's my HK GT2 transmitter ... I had a broken lead on the antenna (presumably from a big stack) and resoldering hasn't fixed it (maybe my bad soldering). I know some folk talked about buying the GT2B with the built in battery. Has anyone used one of these yet - how is it? Reliable? Battery life? Hows the weight cos it looks like it will be really light and a big improvement. I'd go off the Hobbyking weight specs but I've found these a bit unreliable in the past and seem to have more to do with what they want to charge for shipping :p
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

yes I use the GT2 b Flysky transmitter and it perfect- very light,includes Lipos (that lasts for ages)-just remove the wheel off the side and off you go and its got the 3rd channel for my lights and it's really cheap..what more can i say. (and no i don't 'work for FLYSKY!!lol)
Apart from ,I may have some controllers available some time soon ,based on the same electronics but housed in a smaller package.. :D see prototype-
IMG_11261_zps2aec8bbb.jpg
 
Ah that's cool ... I can do my own case as I have a house full of 3D printers :) I thought GT2b was only 2channel transmitter though? So you have the regular GT2B electronics in there?
 
actually i got that wrong- the module inside there is just a 2 channel one but its works the same.. yes the Flysky is 3 channel.. ( 3rd channel a switch)
 
The Caliber mounts are nearly here!! hopefully some time next week i will have 32T and 36T caliber kits available and Caliber Trucks in some wild colours!!
Also great news for the future- I'm in talks with a custom deck supplier to make decks to my spec in small/med and large 35"/38"/40" and with cable routing cut outs and possibly carbon pockets for ESC and batteries etc...
I am also looking at the possibility of mounts for the Surfrodz trucks!!an awesome CNC truck
http://surfrodz.com/trucks/ -
I already have the design for the Rey CNC truck...I'm just waiting for some feedback from my tester!!
So loads of things in the pipeline!!!
 
I got the gt2b from hk aswell, even got a button for the 3rd channel and 3 channels on the included receiver, never used it yet tho. I used the tx for my first ride and it seems very light and survived my first crash complete with throwing it away on the street.

Looking forward to the new alien stuff, I wish I would have waited for it, but got my holeys months before it was announced. Well, you cant have it all. Hopefully you guys can keep the price of your new tx somewhere near the hk one ;)
 
Oh... stoked to hear theres a 3rd channel. I'll see if I can do a 3D printer model for a better casing once I get it and post it to thingiverse. Wonder if I could use the 3rd channel to switch from single to dual motor operation.
 
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