Caleb Moore dies after injuries in X Games crash
- Thread starter GCinDC
- Start date
mrzed
100 W
Why do so many get their knickers in a twist when Chalo berates the moto culture? Sounds like some are using their watts as manhood and feel the need to defend it.
I can't get with the whole backfilpping a snowmobile as sport thing either - mostly because a guy on a BMX can do way cooler things without any motor. The mass and power of the machine increases amplitude, but otherwise, the tricks are pretty unimpressive. BMX landing on you is a non event too.
I can't get with the whole backfilpping a snowmobile as sport thing either - mostly because a guy on a BMX can do way cooler things without any motor. The mass and power of the machine increases amplitude, but otherwise, the tricks are pretty unimpressive. BMX landing on you is a non event too.
liveforphysics
100 TW
I was watching and thinking to myself, hmm.. I thought i remembered snowmobiles would accelerate much harder than that. It seems like they aren't accelerating very quickly, modern sleds feel like they are gonna jerk your arms off when you pin it on compact snow like that. Them I thought, hmm... I wonder if they do multiple levels of throttle governing systems to control the approach speed as precisely as needed, since it appears the jumps are more or less exactingly constructed, so it would just take a mechanism like a cable bicycle trigger shifter to mechanically set throttle stops to make a range of dialed in approach speeds. I think the work of the jump with these seems to be in the take-off alone, which sets the sled on a predetermined path (likely angle fine tuneable with blips of throttle or brake applied), but still, most of the technique seems to be in the take-off alone, with fairly minor effects to the sleds path once airborn. I think with the edition of small-ish electric (maybe low pole SR motor where the rotor IS the gyro flywheel to remove the powertrain to hubmotor simplicity) have very high speed gyro assemblies (to keep them light for the amount of space it takes up), they could gain the 2 axis tail-whip rotational capabilities, which would enable leveraging a humans arm strength to twist the bars while its on the very low friction/support medium of flying through the air, to rotate the sled and do massive snowmobile tail-whips to add new features to the types of jumps performed, and enivitably make the sport more exciting and dangerous. 
I think the fine young men doing it would enjoy it more as well for the same two reasons.
Life is a time to gather experiences, before the 100% human mortality rate kicks in. Some people are happy to have a large collection of only a few types. Some people dont mind ending the experience gathering with a smaller collection, but do really want to have a few very intense and special amazing few. I think later option has a much better chance of piecing together the collection of experiences that equals forfillment in their time of life.
Some believe otherwise, and they might be right, I can only know the path that lead me to becoming forfilled and being at peace with the world and better prepared spiritually to die.
Remember, that awesome kid following his dreams was going to die. This was known from the moment he was concieved. Could he have managed to fit a lifetime of amazing experiences in a 4-5 year period of living as a professional Xgamer? Yes. Absolutely. I would actually believe some of those guys live in a day of emotional experiences and intensities of knowing the different limits of experiences exceeds what many folks would hope to experience in a lifetime, and thats the whole experience gambit, from rush to fear to thrill to accomplishment endorphin rush, to pleasure, to sadness, to guilt. Single days where the entire range of human emotional response causing range is exercised more than many would be lucky to match the intensities of from any events over there whole long dull lives.
That said, I tremendously respect Chalo's opinion, because on many things it presents an argument so out of my normal perspective on lifes point of view, that I catch it as a good philosophical check to think about, and it general always consists of good points, but I end up often disagreeing at the end of the internal perspective review.
Where I dont disagree with Chalo at all is technical advice related to bicycles. This guy is a amazing fountain of no BS empirically hard learned lessons of what methods work and dont work with bikes, and its a damn pleasure to have him donate his time to share methods of doing various non-intuitive bike mechanical theory and practice with us. My deathbike would still be having wheel problems if it wasn't for him telling me I was heading in the wrong direction with bigger spokes and needed tighter stretched than I even thought made sense to do. I likely owe him so big patches of skin that didn't get rubbed off in wheel failure related crashes that nearly stopped happening after taking his advise.
He also often helps me via PM with bicycle related advice for my perpetual bizarre projects I can't seem to quit building. Lol
I think the fine young men doing it would enjoy it more as well for the same two reasons. Life is a time to gather experiences, before the 100% human mortality rate kicks in. Some people are happy to have a large collection of only a few types. Some people dont mind ending the experience gathering with a smaller collection, but do really want to have a few very intense and special amazing few. I think later option has a much better chance of piecing together the collection of experiences that equals forfillment in their time of life.
Some believe otherwise, and they might be right, I can only know the path that lead me to becoming forfilled and being at peace with the world and better prepared spiritually to die.
Remember, that awesome kid following his dreams was going to die. This was known from the moment he was concieved. Could he have managed to fit a lifetime of amazing experiences in a 4-5 year period of living as a professional Xgamer? Yes. Absolutely. I would actually believe some of those guys live in a day of emotional experiences and intensities of knowing the different limits of experiences exceeds what many folks would hope to experience in a lifetime, and thats the whole experience gambit, from rush to fear to thrill to accomplishment endorphin rush, to pleasure, to sadness, to guilt. Single days where the entire range of human emotional response causing range is exercised more than many would be lucky to match the intensities of from any events over there whole long dull lives.
That said, I tremendously respect Chalo's opinion, because on many things it presents an argument so out of my normal perspective on lifes point of view, that I catch it as a good philosophical check to think about, and it general always consists of good points, but I end up often disagreeing at the end of the internal perspective review.
Where I dont disagree with Chalo at all is technical advice related to bicycles. This guy is a amazing fountain of no BS empirically hard learned lessons of what methods work and dont work with bikes, and its a damn pleasure to have him donate his time to share methods of doing various non-intuitive bike mechanical theory and practice with us. My deathbike would still be having wheel problems if it wasn't for him telling me I was heading in the wrong direction with bigger spokes and needed tighter stretched than I even thought made sense to do. I likely owe him so big patches of skin that didn't get rubbed off in wheel failure related crashes that nearly stopped happening after taking his advise.
He also often helps me via PM with bicycle related advice for my perpetual bizarre projects I can't seem to quit building. Lol
Although the dangers are well known, always present and just waiting for that moment where ones attention is not focused totally we still try to push our limits. This is what has taken us further and to new grounds. Nobody, that enjoys life, calculates death as an option. When I ride my bikes beyond the 80 km/h point without any body protection at all it's because of the pure thrill this type of speed gives when the elements hit you directly. Of course this is only done on closed circuits with some prior preparation hoping to sort out most of the risks involved. I really hope that disaster will spare me. If it does occur then it will be in accordance with my personal view towards life. Not it's length is what counts but how intense we live the time it lasts. The longer the better, but if you don't fill it with joy, what's it worth then? May he rest in peace and who knows, maybe they gave him a much better toy to test in an other dimension.
Lenk42602
10 kW
mrzed said:
they do this because this forum is based on motorizing bicycles. it is what this forum was created for. imagine if on one of the many pedal bicycle only forums an ebike guy showed up only to interject his/her own personal opinion on why pedal-only bikes are a novelty.
Luke, assuming he is more than a forum troll, Chalo knows his stuff. He spent many hours on other forums with the likes with Jobst Brandt and has learned much over time - talking and doing. I would imagine, as I did long ago, he noticed that there was a lack of a solid, fundamental understanding of bicycle mechanics by a large percentage of ebikers. I am sure he saw an opportunity to present value to our forum by providing his experience and knowledge, which is great. There are a few on this forum that can rival or exceed Chalo's knowledge regarding bicycle mechanics but choose not to identify themselves because they come here to observe the creatvitiy that flourishes on this board.
FWIW, I actually have come to the same point in my life as Chalo. After two + decades of being a cyclist first, racing,riding on 1500 mile atalantic tours, riding across the us,then turning to motorcycles for about 10 years to get my fix, and actually running a bicycle shop currently, I am back on bicycles now more than ever. There comes a point in a man's life when he starts to see that what he desires is desire itself, and that is what has been keeping him from staying in the present moment.
its been 19 degrees with a -15 degree windchill here in Pittsburgh for the last two weeks and i have been riding my bicycles into work rather than take my car or ebike. everyday.
Since late summer, my car and ebikes have been sitting while my bicycle gets me back on forth on my 20 + mile commute, and out in the woods or on the road for recreation.
bicycles are simply among the most efficient vehicles ever created.
But I aint runnin' chatting up the forum much about this. That I prefer bicycles has NO VIABLE PLACE IN THIS FORUM.
I gotta go put on my cold weather spandex and pedal into work now.
Len
full-throttle
1 MW
Not just moto culture. He's got the tendency of beating on a dead horse (no pun intended). Yes, he failed and paid the price. It' is important to recognise that he didn't do it recklessly. Comments such as "squashed like a bug" are viewed as disrespectful. C'mon chalo go and say it directly to his friend and family, I'd really like to see what would happen. You don't have the balls for it.mrzed said:
Well saidDlogic said:
regmeister
100 W
- Joined
- May 9, 2009
- Messages
- 264
I've no real point to make. Just thought someone would find this poignant in some way.
The fellow in this video died yesterday, or perhaps the day before, doing what he loved. The video is not of his accident. Something more uplifting...
[youtube]ZLTDPeB55ek[/youtube]
The fellow in this video died yesterday, or perhaps the day before, doing what he loved. The video is not of his accident. Something more uplifting...
[youtube]ZLTDPeB55ek[/youtube]
Chalo
100 TW
Lenk42602 said:
A motorized bicycle is still a bicycle, if it keeps its essential bicycle virtues. If it doesn't, it's just a weak, shoddy improvised motorcycle. The latter seems to interest a lot of the folks here, as if they don't understand they can just use a motorcycle. I recognize that many participants here, like myself, are only interested in an e-bike that is still a bicycle. And a scant few, like Luke, are building things that begin to compare to full-fledged motorcycles on their own terms, with special equipment and riding techniques to match.
I'm almost finished swapping over the power unit from my last e-bike to one of my wife's bikes. I only have to mount the batteries securely and it's good to go. And while I was working on that, the previous bike I was motorizing (which was stolen in late 2011 while still being worked on) was found and recovered by a friend of mine. I now can decide whether that one will get an e-motor or a 25cc propane engine to drive its cranks. So it's not like I have a fundamental problem with motor power.
But there is a conflict between the motor vehicle ethos of "never enough" and the bicycle's essential nature of "just enough, no more or less". Failing to respect this design quality of a bicycle when adding power assist (or even before adding power assist, in the case of gravity-assisted bikes) first strips away everything charming about it, and then causes it to break. The next step is the breaking of the rider.
Caleb Moore illustrated the motor cult principle of "never enough", as well as the natural end result of following that principle faithfully. Thus he can serve as a useful example to folks here.
Thud
1 MW
I agree 100% with everything Chalo says in the above post untill we get to this line:
quote"Caleb Moore illustrated the motor cult principle of "never enough", as well as the natural end result of following that principle faithfully. Thus he can serve as a useful example to folks here."
I just don't/can't make the transition of an X-gamer althlete competeing in a thrill sport as a usful example of anything other than knowing the full risk of backflipping snowmobiles for a living......
The X-games are incidental & an attempt to make a buck off from a few Kooks who were doing these stunts for their own enjoyment out in the back country.
I get your point Chalo, I was just confused on your tying it to anything that happens out on public streets.....& the slightly disrespectfull tone of it...(which i wrote off to written internet comunication) I am over it.
As far as never enough.....its the model of the entire world/human race AFAICT.....the economy is based on its continuous growth....everything must get bigger or its stagnate/dying...companies/economies/spending levels. Its a trap of existance.
Corperations by law are supposed to be making profit for shareholders.......What is enough?
I suspect its human nature in play.
quote"Caleb Moore illustrated the motor cult principle of "never enough", as well as the natural end result of following that principle faithfully. Thus he can serve as a useful example to folks here."
I just don't/can't make the transition of an X-gamer althlete competeing in a thrill sport as a usful example of anything other than knowing the full risk of backflipping snowmobiles for a living......
The X-games are incidental & an attempt to make a buck off from a few Kooks who were doing these stunts for their own enjoyment out in the back country.
I get your point Chalo, I was just confused on your tying it to anything that happens out on public streets.....& the slightly disrespectfull tone of it...(which i wrote off to written internet comunication) I am over it.
As far as never enough.....its the model of the entire world/human race AFAICT.....the economy is based on its continuous growth....everything must get bigger or its stagnate/dying...companies/economies/spending levels. Its a trap of existance.
Corperations by law are supposed to be making profit for shareholders.......What is enough?
I suspect its human nature in play.
SamTexas
1 MW
This is one of the rare but logical observation from Chalo. It almost restored my faith in him as a normal human being. Atlas it did not last long.Chalo said:
Still the biggest jerk ever, and naive and ignorant. The USA would never become the most powerful country if we were satisfied with "enough". If you hate our culture so much why are you hanging around? Go live a prehistoric life somewhere in a third world country, you won't be missed around here.Chalo said:
Caleb's fatal accident has nothing to do with more power. It was a simple miscalculation, a less than perfect execution. He died doing what he loved, his fans will miss him. I admire him even though I'm not an Extreme Sports fan. How many people will miss Chalo when he dies? Count me out.
Thud
1 MW
Sam says
As for me,
The forum is better for having Chalo than without.
I will personaly thank him for keeping me grounded & my own thoughts clear & current on any subject we may be discusing......& again for his un-ending willingness to give GOOD information on anything bicycle related.
Where is the tollerance?
What the hell ever happend to listening civily & taking a moment to contemplate someone elses point of view.....then forming a sentance with a different & maybe illuminating point of perspective?
Oh & doing it without a cheap shot about an avaitar photo, or name calling for bonus points...
I am still laughing at the "Shut up!" retort....in another thread.
Maybe have Philly create a "points system" for these -debate- threads......(i will lose on spelling but will still play)
In a debate around here I'll put my money on Chalo for his ability to illistraight an abstract concept & argue it over 90% of the posting population here.
to the op: I can only assume that the seemingly sencless death of a young human is repugnent to Chalo, thus he added his political slant to his replies to show his distane. I asked a simple qualifying question to better formulate my responce to the statments.....whether I was going to post again on the subject or not....Not sure why GC posted this bad news for us....but in general discusion, it allways devolves to pollitics on some level.
thanks GCinDC you mixer you!
Have a lovely day. thanks for the rant.
speaking for yourself I assume....
As for me,
The forum is better for having Chalo than without.
I will personaly thank him for keeping me grounded & my own thoughts clear & current on any subject we may be discusing......& again for his un-ending willingness to give GOOD information on anything bicycle related.
Where is the tollerance?
What the hell ever happend to listening civily & taking a moment to contemplate someone elses point of view.....then forming a sentance with a different & maybe illuminating point of perspective?
Oh & doing it without a cheap shot about an avaitar photo, or name calling for bonus points...
I am still laughing at the "Shut up!" retort....in another thread.
Maybe have Philly create a "points system" for these -debate- threads......(i will lose on spelling but will still play)
In a debate around here I'll put my money on Chalo for his ability to illistraight an abstract concept & argue it over 90% of the posting population here.
to the op: I can only assume that the seemingly sencless death of a young human is repugnent to Chalo, thus he added his political slant to his replies to show his distane. I asked a simple qualifying question to better formulate my responce to the statments.....whether I was going to post again on the subject or not....Not sure why GC posted this bad news for us....but in general discusion, it allways devolves to pollitics on some level.
thanks GCinDC you mixer you!
Have a lovely day. thanks for the rant.
fizzit
10 kW
Chalo's posts can be inflammatory at times, but he isn't stopping anyone from building or riding their bikes. I cannot purchase or ride a motorcycle, so I will continue to read Chalo's posts alone with everyone else's while I work on and ride my "weak, shoddily improved motorcycle". There's no point in trying to get rid of someone who has a lot of useful knowledge, even if you have a problem with some of their viewpoints.
I have to ask Chalo, though, why do you make an exception for Luke in your hatred of our two-wheeled vehicles? He seems to embody your principle of "never enough" more than anyone else on this forum.
I have to ask Chalo, though, why do you make an exception for Luke in your hatred of our two-wheeled vehicles? He seems to embody your principle of "never enough" more than anyone else on this forum.
Ypedal
100 TW
i think you all read way too much into it... winter cabin fever setting in anyone ?
Everyone needs to chill out and relax.
Everyone needs to chill out and relax.
mdd0127
100 kW
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2008
- Messages
- 1,084
Chalo comes off pretty badly sometimes to those that value freedom, adrenaline, and the evolution of human abilities and inventions, but I know his motives are based in good. The only reason that I feel like I have to point out the audacity of some of his posts is that I don't want too many people getting fooled into thinking like he does because it's a scary slippery slope that we're already sliding down and thought's like his steepen the grade towards total control of the masses by the greedy ignorant elite. As humans, we should be striving to get to the point where we don't need to be governed or controlled and Chalo seems to think that laws and authority will achieve this instead of education, experimentation, and natural selection.
I know I come off harshly as well, in particular after having bad days where someone else pushes their ill informed views and ways of life on me, but if we had an e-bike meetup in Austin, I'd be honored to go on a ride with him and have a beer or wheat grass juice with him afterward. This in the internets. It's all in good fun. :wink:
I know I come off harshly as well, in particular after having bad days where someone else pushes their ill informed views and ways of life on me, but if we had an e-bike meetup in Austin, I'd be honored to go on a ride with him and have a beer or wheat grass juice with him afterward. This in the internets. It's all in good fun. :wink:
grindz145
1 MW
Joseph C. said:
HAHAHA
SamTexas
1 MW
It sounded funny to me too. But honestly I'm not familiar with that expression. Anyone cares to explain to me. PM me if you're not comfortable doing it here.grindz145 said:
liveforphysics
100 TW
I often disagree with Chalo on various lifestyle related things.
However, I thought about it, and he really is right in my #1 top tier of valued sources of technical input. That's the same tier I place Bigmoose and Justin and Miles and Jeremy and Lebowski etc in. The input of every one of those guys on my Tier1 advice supplier list is worth more than money could offer to me.
It would be an honor to share a meal with Chalo sometime somewhere in the world if Im so fortunate that our paths would cross, and if he would be willing to have an adrenalin junky like myself at his table.
Also, I'm hopelessly addicted to pushing things really hard, generally until they explode into flames or snap in half at speed and you find yourself sliding on asphalt or just wake up KO'd or whatever the journey of knowingly pushing past the limits takes you on. However, I'm convinced there are other paths to fulfillment than this, and likely even better ones from learning to more fully appreciate the smaller less intense parts of life. My wing-suiting addicted co-worker quoted starwars character Yoda to me a few days ago when I told him I wanted to go wing-suit with him, but wanted it to be exciting, like a low altitude chute-tangles on opening that need to be cut-away and emergency suit deployed. He told me, "A Jedi desires not excitement and adventure Luke."
And this is from a guy who is a wing-suiting addict.
However, I thought about it, and he really is right in my #1 top tier of valued sources of technical input. That's the same tier I place Bigmoose and Justin and Miles and Jeremy and Lebowski etc in. The input of every one of those guys on my Tier1 advice supplier list is worth more than money could offer to me.
It would be an honor to share a meal with Chalo sometime somewhere in the world if Im so fortunate that our paths would cross, and if he would be willing to have an adrenalin junky like myself at his table.
Also, I'm hopelessly addicted to pushing things really hard, generally until they explode into flames or snap in half at speed and you find yourself sliding on asphalt or just wake up KO'd or whatever the journey of knowingly pushing past the limits takes you on. However, I'm convinced there are other paths to fulfillment than this, and likely even better ones from learning to more fully appreciate the smaller less intense parts of life. My wing-suiting addicted co-worker quoted starwars character Yoda to me a few days ago when I told him I wanted to go wing-suit with him, but wanted it to be exciting, like a low altitude chute-tangles on opening that need to be cut-away and emergency suit deployed. He told me, "A Jedi desires not excitement and adventure Luke."
And this is from a guy who is a wing-suiting addict.
mrzed
100 W
I think there are two key reasons chalo is not ripping on Luke - his bikes are built with skill to take the power, and luke only calls it an ebike if it can really be pedaled.
I can sympathise with chalo's position because a lot of motor culture is ignorant selfish people burning through resource and laughing at anyone who disagrees, commuting in a 3500Kg truck is considered normal while regular cyclists let alone ebikers are the oddballs. Living in this insane world can make one testy. Or maybe chalo is just part troll, and you are all feeding that part, hence making it grow. Maybe 1/8 troll, which means his grandma may have slept with a troll, thus explaing why he rips on the guy who died doing what he loved.
The exciting thing about the electric revolution is that guys like luke are started to get more excited about electric racing, and whatever you say about it, it improves the breed like nothing else (excepting war). Eventually, e-racing will give up nothing to fuel racing other than range for cross country events. E-mobilers will be able to crush themselves without polluting the spectators.
I can sympathise with chalo's position because a lot of motor culture is ignorant selfish people burning through resource and laughing at anyone who disagrees, commuting in a 3500Kg truck is considered normal while regular cyclists let alone ebikers are the oddballs. Living in this insane world can make one testy. Or maybe chalo is just part troll, and you are all feeding that part, hence making it grow. Maybe 1/8 troll, which means his grandma may have slept with a troll, thus explaing why he rips on the guy who died doing what he loved.
The exciting thing about the electric revolution is that guys like luke are started to get more excited about electric racing, and whatever you say about it, it improves the breed like nothing else (excepting war). Eventually, e-racing will give up nothing to fuel racing other than range for cross country events. E-mobilers will be able to crush themselves without polluting the spectators.
mdd0127
100 kW
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2008
- Messages
- 1,084
lol MrZed! 1/8th troll :lol:
I thought for a while that we should conserve our fossil fuel resources but after more experience in the real world, I've come to the conclusion that the only thing that will get humanity to really explore alternate forms of energy will be running out of petroleum. So I think we should burn it all up and start over from scratch..... and do it right next time!
I thought for a while that we should conserve our fossil fuel resources but after more experience in the real world, I've come to the conclusion that the only thing that will get humanity to really explore alternate forms of energy will be running out of petroleum. So I think we should burn it all up and start over from scratch..... and do it right next time!
Chalo
100 TW
The car chumps are definitely going to pwn themselves and everybody else by driving until they are bankrupt, dead, or both. It would be nice to tax their stupidity to fund useful things and to hasten their bankruptcy. I'm not holding my breath. I reckon the best I can hope for is to live long enough to see cars become unaffordable to working schlubs.
I had fast motorcycles not so long ago. I got to see what 150mph felt like, and zero to sixty in one one thousand two one thousand three one thousand. It was stimulating.
But I miss the knees I had before I got to crashing motorcycles a lot more than I miss the stimulating qualities of motorcycles. And there's no getting them back. I have learned that there is no lasting gratification in pushing a machine to its limits like there is in pushing your body to its limits. You can dance with a bicycle, or even an electric bicycle (I'd really like to try a torque sensing pedelec). But you can only hang on to a strong motorcycle and try to make it do your bidding. That satisfaction is thin and fleeting by comparison. You can only maintain the high by increasing the dosage all the time. That way lies disaster.
I had fast motorcycles not so long ago. I got to see what 150mph felt like, and zero to sixty in one one thousand two one thousand three one thousand. It was stimulating.
But I miss the knees I had before I got to crashing motorcycles a lot more than I miss the stimulating qualities of motorcycles. And there's no getting them back. I have learned that there is no lasting gratification in pushing a machine to its limits like there is in pushing your body to its limits. You can dance with a bicycle, or even an electric bicycle (I'd really like to try a torque sensing pedelec). But you can only hang on to a strong motorcycle and try to make it do your bidding. That satisfaction is thin and fleeting by comparison. You can only maintain the high by increasing the dosage all the time. That way lies disaster.
John in CR
100 TW
LOL! While people are coming out to suggest a get together to hold hands and sing kumbaya, Mr PC shows his true colors with not only the usual PC hypocrisy, but the desire for anyone who doesn't agree with him to be taxed into oblivion. What's this guy doing in Texas when he should be in DC?
Chalo
100 TW
Most of us here, like me, came of age in the 20th century. We have certain characteristic experiences.
I know all about motor vehicles, because of where and when I came from. I also have extensive direct experience with television, divorce, saccharin, and trickle-down economics, and I strongly recommend against all of those things. Like motor vehicles, they are bad for you and for others.
I know all about motor vehicles, because of where and when I came from. I also have extensive direct experience with television, divorce, saccharin, and trickle-down economics, and I strongly recommend against all of those things. Like motor vehicles, they are bad for you and for others.
GCinDC
100 MW
back to caleb for a minute. damn shame about him. i haven't even put my thoughts together about it. mostly i feel for the family, etc.
but this just popped up and seems vaguely relevant, if anyone wanted to get back to the topic..
[youtube]23E1m8ZxFmU[/youtube]
but this just popped up and seems vaguely relevant, if anyone wanted to get back to the topic..
[youtube]23E1m8ZxFmU[/youtube]
full-throttle
1 MW
There were many safety measures introduced in F1 following Ayrton Senna's death in 94. Before that accident the race was made faster every season.GCinDC said:
