California electric 2 wheeler rules question

[barts]

Hi folks-

I'm thinking about an electric 2 wheel vehicle for my short 4 mile commute. I currently ride my motorcycle; shifting to a "greener" form of year-round transport seems quite practical. I've tried bicycling but rain, heat and headwinds make that less than pleasant.

It seems as if there are 3 types of lightweight electric vehicles under California rules:

1) motorized bicycle or moped = 2 hp, 30 mph max (DMV 406(a))
2) electric bicycle = 1000 W, 20 mph max (DMV 406(b)) http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d01/vc406.htm
3) motorized scooter = ? hp, ? mph max (DMV 407.5) http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d01/vc407_5.htm

I'm inclined to go after building something along the apparently less limiting rules offered by #3; the best route to work involves a bicycle trail. Does anyone know of any other legal limits for "motorized scooters"? It would seem to me that a hub motor, 26" wheels and batteries under the floorboards of a full-size scooter would make a pretty nice commuter.

- Bart

 

[safe]

The Missouri Laws are about the same.

My theory is that it's the manufacturer that is responsible (for legal reasons) to be certain that the gear ratios of an electric motor are such that the maximum speed is to be 30 mph. As a "non-manufacturer" you could then change the gearing and as long as you don't get caught speeding you should be fine. By keeping under 2hp (1500Watts) you can do a lot on a bicycle. If you have an aerodynamic form you can get up to 50 mph.

"Scooters" are those things where you stand on a platform and they are not really very safe or all that fun to ride. (in my opinion) But some people love em, so it's up to personal choice. I'd resist trying to go fast on something that is inherently unsafe at high speed...

 

[barts]

Well, slogging through the pdf files on the DMV website yields the following simpler
criteria:http://www.dmv.ca.gov/forms/reg/reg230.pdf

Answer the following questions “yesâ€￾ or “noâ€￾ to determine if your vehicle is a motorized bicycle:
1. Two-wheel or three-wheel device?
2. Fully operative pedals for human power or powered solely by electrical energy?
3. Automatic transmission and a motor with less than 2 gross brake horsepower?
4. Maximum speed of 30 miles per hour on ground level?
If you answered “Yesâ€￾ to all four questions, complete the application below, in the appropriate sections.
If you answered “Noâ€￾ to any of the questions, your vehicle is not a motorized bicycle as defined by the California Vehicle Code §406.

That makes things simpler.... pedals get in the way of battery placement. 1500W and we're
not subject to registration.

 

[xyster]

Automatic transmission and a motor with less than 2 gross brake horsepower?

The logical conjunction "and" means both an automatic transmission and a motor less than 2 horsepower are required to meet this element.

No bicycle in common usage I'm aware of has an automatic transmission.

Hence few if any ebikes likely qualify as motorized bicycles under this poorly written code.

 

[TylerDurden]

Your scooter may be barred from use on the bike paths and bike lanes...

those pedals can come in handy.

 

[Lessss]

Xyster, turn the question around. Does your vehicle have a manual transmission? No then it must be automatic.

 

[xyster]

My bike has a manual transmission. I have to shift the gears with my hands -- no device within or attached shifts for me.

I was thinking some bikes have auto-cvt's that sense the torque needed...but even most bike cvt's I've seen advertised require manual "shifting" through a continuous range via a dial on the handlebars.

I don't see how a single-geared hubmotor could be considered in whole or part an automatic transmission either.

 

[barts]

Regarding the meaning of "automatic transmission", as far as I know this means that no rider action is required to engage different gears; ie there's no clutch and gear selection isn't required. A direct drive electric bike is indistinguishable from one w/ a hidden automatic .

As to rules regarding the use of bicycle lanes, California seems to require motorized scooters to use them. Whether or not electric bicycles are supposed to remains to be seen; it likely depends on the power level...

Well, it seems the rules for this stuff are a real pastiche - which means I'll get to try and explain them to the kind officer .

Thanks for the comments! Now that I grok the legal parameters a little better, I can start playing w/ design ideas.

- Bart

 

[safe]

The Missouri Law specifically uses the word "clutch" in the things you can't have. "Automatic" means you don't use a clutch, the reason for this was people think a child on a bike might have trouble using a "clutch" and might be injured because of it.

2. Fully operative pedals for human power or powered solely by electrical energy?

After thinking about this it makes sense. They don't want the COMBINATION of two types of power to allow a rider to have more accelleration (and top speed) than is allowed. So this is actually a strong argument FOR removing the pedals... it GUARANTEES that the peak power is within specifications. (2hp)

 

[salsa]

Automatic transmission and a motor with less than 2 gross brake horsepower?

The logical conjunction "and" means both an automatic transmission and a motor less than 2 horsepower are required to meet this element.

No bicycle in common usage I'm aware of has an automatic transmission.

Hence few if any ebikes likely qualify as motorized bicycles under this poorly written code.

Your "Hence" is not a correct conclusion.

You already correctly connected the automatic transmission to the motor. It never said of implied that the "automatic Transmission" referred to the pedals!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don
2 electric bikes
1 Moped

 

[safe]

Missouri Moped Law

"Any two-wheeled or three-wheeled device having an automatic transmission and a motor with a cylinder capacity of not more than fifty (50) cubic centimeters, which produces less than three (3) gross brake horsepower, and is capable of propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than thirty (30) miles per hour on level ground."

That's funny... the last time I looked at the website I thought it said "two horsepower". Did they just raise the limit? That means you could run all the way up to 2238 Watts if you live in Missouri.

Awesome!

"Automatic Transmission" means no "clutches" allowed...

(all you British folks should be dying of envy right now!)

Using the speed calculator:

http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm

...and plugging in "Lowracer with streamlining", 185 lb rider, 100 lb bike and 2238 Watts you get a top speed of 65 mph! (the law says stay under 30 mph though)