E-bike Haters - Why do so many people miss the point?

[danielrlee]

Yesterday, I visited my LBS to pick up a new brake cable and got talking to the owner about my build. I got the same response I get from the majority of people (cyclists or otherwise) of complete ignorance. He gave me the usual arguments of "it's cheating" and "they're only for the lazy and elderly". Even having used my most cunning reasoning, he was never going to see sense. I even offered him a go on mine, but told me "he wouldn't be seen dead on one". Rude p***k.

Now, I don't really care if he as an individual, sees the light or not. I've been commuting solely by e-bike since my car was written off about 3 months ago (a sporty little Honda S2000 that I had for eight years and absolutely loved) and can't see myself going back to the combustion engine for this task (and I am a total car nut). What I do care about however, is the publics opinion as a whole, if e-bikes are to go mainstream around the world, just like they are in China, The Netherlands and Germany.

Following some reading on the subject this morning, I came across this bloging gem:

http://cyclingunbound.wordpress.com/2013/03/22/e-bike-are-not-bicycles/

It manages to cram in almost every anti ebike sentiment I have ever heard to the point of being just plain funny. Can anyone else smell the stench of inadequacy from the poster?

So what gives? I've been waxing lyrical about the benefits of the ebike to anybody that will listen, since I completed my first build just a year ago, but I've not managed to tempt anyone into actually going 'e', no matter how much cooing and ahhh-ing I can coax from them.

 

[friendly1uk]

He has too much interest in cycling as a sport. He does not see cycling as just transport. The moment he stops thinking about the rewards he gets from his sporting achievements, he jumps in the car. I doubt he would ever have a motorcycle. He does not see a multi tier transport system, despite talking it. He perhaps see's a multi tiered social system though, where the lowest form of transport is a car, and cycling is something you do in lycra

 

[Ykick]

Ignorance & Jealousy....

I write off any LBS that even mildy gives me "stink eye". Money rules in business and they won't get any from me.

Mail order is generally "eBike neutral", btw.

 

[MattyCiii]

I've had nothing but positivity in my encounters. But curiously, I get different types/degree of response depending of which of my two bikes I ride (more on that below).

I've prepared myself for the cyclist who is bigoted against electrons. My one shot will be "well, in my view cyclists, e-bikers and even motorcyclists have more in common than our differences - we need to work together for better infrastructure and protection against the almighty automobile". We'll see if that type of statement ever gets any traction.

Back to the two bikes. The folding bike "looks funny" whether or not it has the rear rack and electrics on it. I think people picture it with the rear rack full of recycling cans, and I'm some bum who lives in a refrigerator box. People respond with curiosity, but simply don't know what to make of the thing. The A-Line on the other hand - it just plain looks cool. I had a guy ask me if I entered it into shows. We chatted a few minutes and when parting I mentioned the electrics. "Oh, it's electric!" he gushed. I thought he knew that all along - that made the "enter it into shows" question into a much greater compliment. The point here is that this bike - simply by looking cool - opens up conversations and opens people's minds. That was never my intention but it's the way things have turned out.

 

[danielrlee]

To be honest, I already knew what the LBS owners opinion was going to be when we started talking. I cannot understand however, why he would be negative to the point of turning down potential trade once I mentioned wanting a new frame to base a new build around. Business must be good in the bike world.

 

[danielrlee]

I think the 'looking cool' part, has a huge influence on public opinion. The problem is that (in the UK at least), even the most uber-cool bike will never be as cool as even the most humble of cars in the majority of peoples eyes.

 

[ian.mich]

Personally, my LBS loves building my wheels and i'll never attempt building my own with his prices and sevice. The guy in that blog doesn;t understand it as a form of alternative transport, which replaces CARS not lycras . He would change his mind immediately after just seeing my "bicycle." I have only faced criticism from lycras that probably changed their minds after i was 2 blocks ahead of them . Everyone i see walking or in cars immediately loves it.

 

[MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER]

I was pulled two times by motorcycle cops.

Both was impressed by the bike hahah
And one said your bike is nice for a policeman strong and fast

Yes a lot of people asked woow where did you bought it
As answer : I have bought in ....... and mentioned the price ( I am lying about my homemade bike )

But when they hear the price OOOO that is expensive and no more interest......

 

[The fingers]

Most comments from lycras during the commute appear to be in jest, they usually thank you for letting them draft behind you in a headwind. Like us or not, we're here to stay; even being the black sheep in the family.

 

[Eskimo]

Here cars are not cool anymore, that helps a bit. Cars are seen just as a something some people need to get to work, or if they live on the countryside. Young guys don"t buy cars anymore, more and more young people don"t drive their licence, because licence here is very expensive. People are basicly pro-bicycle generally. Part of it comes from our half-wrecked wellfarestate thinking. Free public healthcare. It"s good that people will keep themselves in shape, because everybody pays the treatments through taxes. Small country is very different on other respects too, it creates a different kind of mindset. There"s no people to choose from much, you can not start thinking: "that guy is a wacko, that guy is a freak", and move on. Small country is like a tribe, you have to accept everybody, everybody on some level. You have to be very tolerant socially. Then this climate even increases this behaviour more. Leaving homeless people outside is a murder here, you die out there. Can not leave anybody out. People are pro-bicycle mostly, but i reckon perhaps i will meet somebody who gets critical. Personally i see my E-bike as a equipment for disabled. If you have a bad knee, E-bike is way better option than armchair. Spesifically option to ride without pedaling, if required. I try not to ride provocatively. Today i had to overtake one genuine lycra. He was just riding sooo slow, i mean like 10 mph, that i throttled past. Here critical guys will not use "cheating"-card, it will not fly here. I suspect they will use law-card, if anything.

 

[MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER]

What is a lycra?

 

[Wurly]

Wannabe racing cyclist dressed up in Lycra
Or Mamil 's
middle aged men in lycra

 

[MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER]

Aaha thanks!

Hahah here when the sunb is shinning, you will see them a lot!
And looking weird when you passed them slow pedaling and your back straight up

 

[Wurly]

Tbh the name is a little unfair, if you hit the roads on a bike here in the UK you really are taking a huge risk. The roads are really dangerous. Being dressed up in bright colours has the advantage of being seen... (at least, i think thats the reason :0)

I get stupid remarks about my ebike and i get used to it, you're hated by car/bus/truck drivers, pedstrians AND cyclists....you can't win, i ignore it most of the time.

 

[danielrlee]

@Eskimo

Wow, social attitudes in Finland seem totally different to that of the UK. Even having embraced the ebike myself, such huge cultural changes invoke a bitter-sweet sort of feeling within me. As a big fan of the motor car since as far back as I can remember, I look back fondly at the 14 years of *mostly* pleasurable motoring I have enjoyed so far and almost feel tears welling up as I anticipate this future shift to alternative transportation. By hook or crook, we will ALL be forced out of our cars. It just seems that some are more ready than others to make the change.

 

[arkmundi]

WPI, you should be ashamed!, a saga of ebike hating at the institutional level.

 

[dogman dan]

Sadly, so many people have closed minds. The average person just thinks I'm crazy for taking the risk of sharing the road with cars. Any that get interested and progress far enough to find out what a good size battery costs immediately lose interest. Real bike riders call me cheater. But it's fun to pass them going up hills later.

We're just a very weird, and very minority group here. I ride for a lot of reasons, but mostly it's just fun. I'll ride anything with two wheels and grin.

 

[Sunder]

I think Eskimo's post struck a chord with what I was about to say. I spent 6 weeks in Europe last year, and in almost every place, bikes including eBikes were absolutely everywhere.

In Italy, there are two types of riders - Commuters, and sports cyclists. Commuters dressed in suits and dresses, rode cruisers, and rode on the footpath (as I understood it, legally). sports cyclists dressed in lycra, rode on the road, and were the only ones to wear helmets. I reckon that's how cycling should be in a good society.

In the UK and in Australia, there are also two types of riders - Sport cyclists and Hipsters. Hipsters are very much like commuters, only they tend to be arrogant about their "good for the environment" "back to basics" type bikes, and they flaunt road rules, run reds, bang on car doors as cars overtake them, etc.

So cyclists here are seen as selfish - they're not trying to get somewhere, they're either holding up traffic for a hobby, or they're... well, hipsters.

Until cycling is seen as a legitimate commuting option in the US/UK/AU, ebikes, at best are going to be a novelty, and at worst, a dangerous toy for bogans to flout laws and put pedestrians and themselves in danger.

 

[lbz5mc12]

Yeah same thing here with my LBS. Except in my instance the bike mechanic hates ebikes but his dad, the owner, thinks they're cool. The mechanic actually started bragging about his mustang.

 

[veloman]

It's a mixed bag for sure. I get more positive than negative remarks. That could be because people don't want to say something negative and just keep quiet.

Everyone that has ridden my bikes says they are amazing. They pretty much get it. The few that jest me, (some of my old cycling friends) have not ridden the ebike and are afraid of what they do not understand.

Here is my background: I loved my bike as a kid. When i was 13 I started riding more, and just for the fun of it, and to get around town. Then I got into road cycling, and some mtn biking. Eventually I just loved bikes, period. After 9 years of racing bikes I lost interest, but still ride fast for fun mostly, on my road and mtn bikes. I can't describe the feeling of satisfaction and accomplishment of reaching a performance goal. Human performance is amazing. But it's not everything. I put on lycra because it MAKES SENSE. (You guys need to stop teasing for the lycra, it makes you look immature). Lycra is way less hot and faster than gym clothes. It matters when you are time trialing at 25mph or sprinting at 40.

During college and work I drove a lot. Learned to hate being part of the oil problem, and traffic and did not want to be a hypocrite - I HATED breathing car exhaust while cycling. I drove a car for transportation. But I learned to be realistic and that a small electric motor would do wonders for my bike utility. Gas engines - no way. Too close to a motorcycle, pollutes, loud - no way.

So an ebike is simply the combination of motorized transport (which I totally believe in), and a bicycle - applied SMARTLY.

It's not all about ONE thing. Comfort, speed, protection, cargo, lightweight, traffic handling, cost, fuel, convenience, physical activity. It is about the COMBINATION of all those things. The ebike wins hands down in my environment which is similar to many across the globe.

The people who don't get it - they are not good critical thinkers. I'm not saying an ebike is everyone's solution. But it's a great solution for a very large chunk of the population.

 

[USAEBIKECO]

Let them think whatever they want.

The point is you have an electric bicycle, which is technology a vast majority of the public have never even heard of. Think of the advantage you have that they dont.

8)

 

[bowlofsalad]

What is a lycra?

I feel like what a 'lyrca' is wasn't very clearly defined.

Lycra is a stretchy material people wear who do things like swim, ride a bicycle and various athletes who depend on speed in their activity. The benefit lycra gives relates to aerodynamics. Think of a swimmer removing all their body hair. To give a wide contrast, imagine the difference between small parachute and a large parachute while falling from the sky. The large parachute will slow you down more than the small parachute. Clothing that sticks out from your body can be said to act as sort of a parachute to you and your speed. It creates drag. When you see someone wearing lycra, it is likely he cares about how fast he is going. The concept of calling someone a wanna be is juvenile.

To elaborate on the societal perspective surrounding lycra. For reasons that escape me, it has become cool to not try, to not know things, to even be stupid. This isn't true everywhere, of course. But some people scoff and mock those who want to do things with as much effectiveness and efficiency as possible. I don't know where the line is drawn for those who want to hate, maybe when or how someone goes from an 'enthusiast' to a 'professional' (earning money?), but on your way to getting good at things, some people want to bring you down.

Personally, I feel prejudice concerning various ideas is sad. It's fine if you can truly see into an idea in it's entirety and understand that it is worthless or even destructive, but most people lack that capacity for perspective.

 

[sal_park]

This thread is very interesting, and has hit the nail on the head in understand 99% of peoples responses to my ebike - none of them (well all apart from 1 guy) can see it as a form of transport for commuting and only as a sport/hobby/leisure activity.

 

[dogman dan]

Nothing wrong with wearing lycra when you need it. I discovered lycra when skiing. Riding the lift, ordinary nylon suits worked fine, but once I started skiing up mountains in the back country, earning my turns, the normal ski wear failed miserably. I took to wearing lycra and fleece in layers.

But back to the term lycra as applied to a cyclist.

We have lots of local riders who train for races, or perhaps just like to still ride fast. They all wear lycra. But they are definitely NOT" lycra's".

A "Lycra" is a guy riding his bike dressed in lycra who has a dumbshit attitude. He might be a "hipster on his fixie" or he might be 40 something and thinks he's still badass. Either way, he passes you as you are riding in economy mode, makes jokes about your crappy bike, crappy attire, and laughs at you. It's his antisocial attitude that makes him a "lycra". He could dress in commuter bike attire, and he's still a lycra.

Always fun to frock with them, since they are always heavily into their own performance. Ideally, don't pass him right away. Let him laugh at you, and expect to leave you behind. Then once he's just about out of sight, hit the throttle and quickly catch up with him. Being a "lycra", I guarantee he's still watching you since his entire world depends on being superior to you. Having his head so far up his ass, he hasn't noticed you have a motor. Now toy with him. Don't pass him, push him. Push that jerk that just laughed at you till his lungs burn like fire.

Then pass him, but whistle a cheery tune while you cruise by. 8)

 

[rojitor]

Revolution is not welcome in many cases. Some people can't understand a bike faster than a common bike yet slower than a motorcycle(mostly... )
I have been insulted by lycra guys and car drivers without a reason quite a few times. I used to explain my motivation to others but lately i don't bother to waste my words, eventually people will have their own conclusions about the ebike world