E-max 110s lifepo4 upgrade

[flexy]

That controller is supposed to handle 10KW, you are using 6KW max, what air temperature are you using it in?

 

[yokneamcity]

That controller is supposed to handle 10KW, you are using 6KW max, what air temperature are you using it in?

+30-35 C

 

[flexy]

+30-35 C

Nice!

I got my 36 fet today, it's quite big compared to Lyen 18fet :lol:

 

[yokneamcity]

+30-35 C

Nice!

I got my 36 fet today, it's quite big compared to Lyen 18fet :lol:

This monster controller!
Where you will plase it?

 

[flexy]

This monster controller!
Where you will plase it?

I have yet to work this out

 

[flexy]

This is my battery pack design ,based around the A123 20Ah cells, it consists of four modules each containing 30 cells.

The tabs on each will be bolted to the copper plate to make 5p groups.

The chequer plate cases are the only thing I could get made at short notice. They do present a risk of shorting so I will have to insulate them on the inside at least. I would prefer to use G10 epoxy sheet as it is a good insulator and very rigid + heat resistant.

Each 30cell module will have steel straps to compress the cells and stop any movement.

Download the Sketchup file here https://dl.dropbox.com/u/8208701/Electric scooters/Emax battery.skp

 

[yokneamcity]

I finished work on remaking the battery. Battery had three assemblies of 16 cells in series. That were are connected in parallel.(16S/3P) Prismatic packages A123 20 A/H
I decided to pick up the battery voltage to 78 volts. For this, I middle the assembly parted into two parts, each with 8 cells. And added to the two assemblies are 8 cells. The result was a configuration 24S/2P.
Maximum speed increased to 72 km/h.
And also i ordered BMS 24S/100A rated current from BMS_Battery http://www.bmsbattery.com/bmspcm/378-17s26s-24a-max-discharge-current-bms.html
In this BMS installed low quality mosfets with high-resistance channel. This has caused a strong heating BMS at maximum current (100A)
But I solved the problem.I connected the controller power cable to the battery directly, through a fuse, bypassing BMS. Logic Plus of controller is connected through a relay that is connected to the battery through the BMS.

 

[flexy]

72 km/h! I was hoping to get more at that voltage, it's still a good improvement. What sort of range are you getting?

That's a good idea to use BMS to switch a relay. I was thinking of doing the same with my Evassemble BMS, then I can send regen current straight to the battery too.

I'm still waiting for a new controller so no progress yet

 

[yokneamcity]

72 km/h! I was hoping to get more at that voltage, it's still a good improvement. What sort of range are you getting?

That's a good idea to use BMS to switch a relay. I was thinking of doing the same with my Evassemble BMS, then I can send regen current straight to the battery too.

I'm still waiting for a new controller so no progress yet

72 km/h according to gps, and proximity 80 km/h according to car speedometer.
I gated 50 km range with 72 km/h speed and 100 km range with 50 km/h speed.

 

[flexy]

Here's my wiring diagram.
The main pre charge resistor reduces the in rush currents going into controller and the DC/DC converters. I hope this will avoid any arcing in the key switch and contactor.

This will all be a slow drain on the pack so the main battery switch will need to be off when the bike is stored.

 

[jonescg]

I finished work on remaking the battery. Battery had three assemblies of 16 cells in series. That were are connected in parallel.(16S/3P) Prismatic packages A123 20 A/H
I decided to pick up the battery voltage to 78 volts. For this, I middle the assembly parted into two parts, each with 8 cells. And added to the two assemblies are 8 cells. The result was a configuration 24S/2P.
Maximum speed increased to 72 km/h.
And also i ordered BMS 24S/100A rated current from BMS_Battery http://www.bmsbattery.com/bmspcm/378-17s26s-24a-max-discharge-current-bms.html
In this BMS installed low quality mosfets with high-resistance channel. This has caused a strong heating BMS at maximum current (100A)
But I solved the problem.I connected the controller power cable to the battery directly, through a fuse, bypassing BMS. Logic Plus of controller is connected through a relay that is connected to the battery through the BMS.

I forget, but if you have a Sevcon 4 controller they can be programmed to allow more phase amps. I have a 16s 3p A123 pack in my 110s scooter but without the controller reprogramming it wouldn't get over 65 km/h. I can maintain about 75 km/h on the flat now.

Your cell terminations look rather wimpy. I would be careful of drawing high currents through them. Ideally you would have some decent bits of copper clamping the tabs together.

They're a great scooter once you ditch the heavy metal

 

[dutchlincoln]

Can someone post the dimensions of the battery compartment?

Is it possible to relocate the controller, and use that space for batteries as well?

I'm thinking about purchasing a 110S and put Winston's in them, but trying to figure out how much Ah's would fit in...

Thnx.

 

[flexy]

I finished work on remaking the battery. Battery had three assemblies of 16 cells in series. That were are connected in parallel.(16S/3P) Prismatic packages A123 20 A/H
I decided to pick up the battery voltage to 78 volts. For this, I middle the assembly parted into two parts, each with 8 cells. And added to the two assemblies are 8 cells. The result was a configuration 24S/2P.
Maximum speed increased to 72 km/h.
And also i ordered BMS 24S/100A rated current from BMS_Battery http://www.bmsbattery.com/bmspcm/378-17s26s-24a-max-discharge-current-bms.html
In this BMS installed low quality mosfets with high-resistance channel. This has caused a strong heating BMS at maximum current (100A)
But I solved the problem.I connected the controller power cable to the battery directly, through a fuse, bypassing BMS. Logic Plus of controller is connected through a relay that is connected to the battery through the BMS.

I forget, but if you have a Sevcon 4 controller they can be programmed to allow more phase amps. I have a 16s 3p A123 pack in my 110s scooter but without the controller reprogramming it wouldn't get over 65 km/h. I can maintain about 75 km/h on the flat now.

Your cell terminations look rather wimpy. I would be careful of drawing high currents through them. Ideally you would have some decent bits of copper clamping the tabs together.

They're a great scooter once you ditch the heavy metal

The original controller in mine wasn't a Sevcon. Did you reprogram yours yourself? if so did you need a special programmer or could you use free software?

 

[flexy]

Can someone post the dimensions of the battery compartment?

Is it possible to relocate the controller, and use that space for batteries as well?

I'm thinking about purchasing a 110S and put Winston's in them, but trying to figure out how much Ah's would fit in...

Thnx.

There isn't much room under the seat due to the MSU and controller being there, I have also had to put my two DC convertors and contacter in there.

There is extra room at the front under the steering column you could fit maybe another 15% in there, but it would need a extra battery box making and fixing to the frame

I have filled mine with A123 ,I think if I did this over again I would put in a smaller pack and gain some storage space, after all not many folks would want to ride a scooter for 100+ miles non stop.

If you are overvolting and going for high speed ,that's a different story :lol:

 

[mizuh]

The original controller in mine wasn't a Sevcon. Did you reprogram yours yourself? if so did you need a special programmer or could you use free software?

Original controller old version is Proud eagle (as speedometer, DC/DC converter). Programmer is available only for authorized dealers or you could try to buy it directly from china. Top speed with this old controller is 52 km/h If you increase voltage you need to rebuild or replace DC/DC converter and controller probably die in short time because of its parameters - Nominal Voltage: 48V Maximum Voltage: 60V Nominal Current: 45A Enhanced Output Current: 80A (1 minute)
Maximum Impact Current Allowed: 120A.

I change controller now and if it will works I also increase voltage and change DC/DC converter.

 

[flexy]

It looks like 45mph/72km is the limit at 72V with Greentime/Lyen controllers, I don't know if Kelly controllers could be programmed for higher rpm than this at 72V.

I would like to try Sevcon too but I hear they are difficult to set up

Another possibility are Sigmadrive but I haven't read anyones experience of these. http://www.electricmotorsport.com/store/ems_ev_parts_controllers_pgdrives_7235.php

 

[jonescg]

I got mine reprogrammed by the authorised V-moto / E-Max dealer (who might not have known all there is to know, but he knew how to tweak it). Yes, he had the ridiculously expensive dongle thingy too. I have no idea on the reprogramming thing but I should post some pictures up of my ride. I will be racing it in the pocket bike series next month

I don't see a lot of point in adding more than 5 kWh worth of batteries in one of these. The seats are painfully uncomfortable so it would be a bit of a waste.

I haven't overvolted mine - still running "48 V" or 52 V with A123 LiFePO4.

 

[dutchlincoln]

Hi,
Thanks for measuring the compartiment.
I'm trying to fit in 16 pcs of 100Ah Winston's, but that's not going to be an easy task!!

Thinking by going to 60Ah sinopoly, the thin ones, and then 2 parallel, so 32 pcs...
It's going to be a puzzle!

Thanks!!

Can someone post the dimensions of the battery compartment?

Is it possible to relocate the controller, and use that space for batteries as well?

I'm thinking about purchasing a 110S and put Winston's in them, but trying to figure out how much Ah's would fit in...

Thnx.

There isn't much room under the seat due to the MSU and controller being there, I have also had to put my two DC convertors and contacter in there.

There is extra room at the front under the steering column you could fit maybe another 15% in there, but it would need a extra battery box making and fixing to the frame

I have filled mine with A123 ,I think if I did this over again I would put in a smaller pack and gain some storage space, after all not many folks would want to ride a scooter for 100+ miles non stop.

If you are overvolting and going for high speed ,that's a different story :lol:

 

[flexy]

I have finally completed my A123 pack, and fitted it in the scooter

The controller is mounted above the back wheel and fits through a cutout into the under seat space.

It is bolted on at the back where two bolts go under the brakelight , I bent the mounting plate on the controller so that it was vertical and fitted longer bolts through to hold it.

I had to cut the bottom off the small compartment at the rear to accomodate the controller.

I took it for a shakedown trip, there is quite a slow speed ramp with this controller (Greentime 36fet IRFB4110) and it took a while to get up to speed, It wouldn't draw more than 80A even though I requested a higher limit. I will try modifying the shunt to get more current flowing.

Max speed 45mph on the flat, I had to adjust the rear shock to it's loosest, otherwise it kept topping out which gave a constant knocking sound, I might need to replace it.

 

[jonescg]

Dude you're going to get like 150 km range with that!

 

[flexy]

Dude you're going to get like 150 km range with that!

That was the original plan

It feels like a ship compared to my other scoot, partly the extra weight and the frustratingly slow acceleration ramp in the Greentime controller.

Cruises along nicely on a good road but the suspension is way too stiff for potholes etc, need to sort this out, going to trying putting lighter oil in forks and try and find an aftermarket shock absorber for the back.
I can't see this being due to the bike being lighter, the new lifepo4 pack is only 16kg lighter than the original SLAs

 

[dutchlincoln]

Hello,
I have the Vectrix now, with the Sevcon-4 controller and new IFM board (v 5.0).
Can anyone tell me how i can re-program it to the higher speed?

Thanks.

 

[dutchlincoln]

I need to do some explaining...

I bougt a Vectrix VX-2, and stated that it had to ride 70km/h. So, the dealer accepted that, Put in a new controller, and erased the controller for me.
Then it didn't work at all...
So, he ordered a new IFM board, as Vectrix told him that he needed this as an upgrade. There is one 4 pole plug more on it, and the board itself is smaller.
It doesn't work anyhow, and he put a lot of time in it.
he offered me the scooter at a discount, and gave the new and old controller, and the new and old IFM board with it.
He stated that the old ones should work together, and at least ride 45km/h.
I just switched everything to original, but Nada! No turning wheel...
The controller gives a steady green flash, and 2 short flashes, and remains dark then.
The display gives its values, welcome screen, end milage etcetera.

Can anyone tell me what to do to get this running?
Any sources to scematics or fault codes?
Programming?
Etcetera.

Any help highly appreciated.
I want to ride this beautiful machine!

Thanks!

 

[flexy]

The dealer should have put the old controller back and got it running again, did you buy it from him new?

I guess Vectrix have the right parameters to program the new controller, but you can't do it yourself without an expensive Sevcon programmer.

I don't know how similar the Vectrix and E-max are under the skin, I know the vectrix has the variable regen throttle, might explain the extra 4pin plug.

 

[dutchlincoln]

Hi,

Yes i bought it from him for a fair price, but not-working.
The extra connector has nothing to do with regen braking, as it had that option on the other board as well.
I can make some pictures of the boards tomorrow to show the difference.

How can i get my hands on such a programmer, or data how this should work?