Finally! Finished building my 60MPH Ebike!

[wturber]

When riding at higher than pro cyclist speeds ... keep out of bike lanes/ paths, etc. Ride it on the street like every other motor vehicle and learn the proper hand signals for the cars and all other motor vehicles to show them which way you are turning , and when coming to a stop ( These hand signals are / should be in every states motorcycle handbook the one you study for getting your motorcycle license )

Fine advice, but in AZ riding at 30mph+ outside of bike lanes is likely to draw attention from law enforcement. Maybe not if you are pedaling your butt off. But also much more likely if you are wearing motorcycle protection gear. In AZ, motor assist must stop after you hit 28mph or you are no longer a "bicycle" and license/registration/insurance is required.

 

[ScooterMan101]

Wtuber,

I know, I am always looking to the Future, and even without a crystal ball or being a psychic I know those laws will change.
The young generation is wanting a green deal, and the best and cheapest and at first the only way to lower transportation pollution , is with high speed bicycles and trikes and NEV's . With Legal Speeds the same as on the surface streets on which we will be riding .

In the Near Future there will be legal high speed bicycles all over the world.

 

[Ford Prefect]

We already have them in Germany. They are called motorcycle and no one cares if they are electric or combustion powered.
They are even allowed on the Autobahn.

 

[neptronix]

Fine advice, but in AZ riding at 30mph+ outside of bike lanes is likely to draw attention from law enforcement. Maybe not if you are pedaling your butt off. But also much more likely if you are wearing motorcycle protection gear. In AZ, motor assist must stop after you hit 28mph or you are no longer a "bicycle" and license/registration/insurance is required.

My style is..

Slow in the bike lane.
Even slower on the sidewalk.
Fast in the car lane - no faster than the speed limit.
If the bicycle is capable of the speeds a car can go, always pick the car lane, unless you're trying to conserve battery for a long ride. It is the safest place to travel ( in my area anyway, where 99.9999999% of traffic is cars )

..and...

Always pedal... why not?
Never wear motorcycle gear, as it will trigger the impression that someone dressed that way should be on a motorcycle, and create problems for you.

 

[ScooterMan101]

Trophix,

Since others here have stated how you look more like a motorcycle when using obvious motorcycle gear , I need to explain myself more than I did above.

The items I listed can look like bicycle gear in the following ways.

First There are Long Finger Gloves that Down Hill Riders use, they look like what they are bicycle gloves.

Then The Jeans I spoke of that have kevlar lining in certain areas , they look like regular jeans so you are good there as well.

Then for the chest and back protector , wear that under a large Mountain Bike Jersey

You can get Down Hill Helmets , they do look somewhat like a off road motorcycle helmet, however just take off the visor and it will look more like a bicycle helmet unless you are very close to it.

So I do somewhat agree with not wearing MC gear , just the obvious gear , get the items that are or look like bicycle gear. Down Hill Bicycle Gear is better protection with speeds that they ride.

 

[donn]

We already have them in Germany. They are called motorcycle and no one cares if they are electric or combustion powered.

Sure, electric motorcycles are nothing new. The question is what you can get away with, without a license and other legalities relating to motor vehicles. Those other legalities are the real issue, more than the license itself. I can't just whack together my own motorcycle and call it good, from what I've read I'd be in for an epic struggle to get something through my state's department of motor vehicles.

In the US, bicycles are in a legal situation that's about the next thing to anarchy. Laws vary from state to state, but they're loose (no inspections or licensing), hard to enforce and no one cares very much. Well, some people care, but too few to raise a big stink in most areas. The main contribution of projects like Mr. "My 60MPH Ebike!" is to add to that number. Hopefully too rare to make much difference, but if it ever does get to where the authorities start cracking down, that's the end of electric projects, we'll be legally limited to factory ebikes.

 

[wturber]

In the Near Future there will be legal high speed bicycles all over the world.

We already have them. They are called electric motorcycles and require license, registration and insurance.

If you think that high speed bicycles will be generally legal world wide without license, registration and insurance, I'd be willing to discuss that bet $$. :^)

 

[amberwolf]

When riding at higher than pro cyclist speeds ... keep out of bike lanes/ paths, etc. Ride it on the street like every other motor vehicle and learn the proper hand signals for the cars and all other motor vehicles to show them which way you are turning , and when coming to a stop ( These hand signals are / should be in every states motorcycle handbook the one you study for getting your motorcycle license )

Not many people (drivers, pedestrians, cyclists, or law enforcement) recognize hand signals these days, at least not around here. Back when I still tried to use them, when I rode regular bikes (pre-electric), I actually had LEOs *wave* at me when I was making a right-turn signal, thinking I was waving at them instead of signalling...sometimes realizing their mistake and appearing embarassed, usually not.

This is why I use DOT lighting for turn signals, brake lights, etc. (though SB Cruiser presently uses lots of LED strips on the rear instead, and they've worked fine so far, but that is a huge flat surface that a bike doesn't have....) I recommend the largest ones you can get, the largest surface area of light possible (not the *brightest* ones, but the *biggest* ones, as even a larger dimmer one is more likely to be noticed than a small bright one, from my experience with experiments on this over the years--same with headlights).

Everybody recognizes lighted signals, even if they don't pay attention to them.

 

[Ford Prefect]

We already have them in Germany. They are called motorcycle and no one cares if they are electric or combustion powered.

Sure, electric motorcycles are nothing new. The question is what you can get away with, without a license and other legalities relating to motor vehicles. Those other legalities are the real issue, more than the license itself. I can't just whack together my own motorcycle and call it good, from what I've read I'd be in for an epic struggle to get something through my state's department of motor vehicles.

Neither in Europe. But the European Law is very unambiguous on this: The power level and maximum speed define a motor cycle. Not the looks.
Stealth only helps you a part of the way. You can definitely get away with 500W and 40kph instead of 250W and 25kph legally allowed. But going 60 mph, which is something like 96kph, stealthy looks are not really helpful since only very few normal bikers usually reach these speeds while riding to work.
This vehicle in the video is no bicycle and no EBike. It is a motorcycle and as such needs registration and insurance.

 

[John in CR]

Besides a good helmet,

1) Good Gloves

2) Kevlar lined Jeans ( buy at any motorcycle shop or online )

3) Icon (or any other brand ) of Chest and Spine protector ( Also Down Hill Bicycle Versions that are sold at bike shops that have down hill bikes and /or are located in Mountain areas )

4) Good footwear that will protect your ankles .

Good Luck, I am in Favor for high speed bicycles ... since I ( and everyone else ) can breath easier when behind one compared to any Gas/Petrol vehicle .
Electric Motorcycles are out of the Budget for many / most people , so keep up the work on higher speed bicycles .

When riding at higher than pro cyclist speeds ... keep out of bike lanes/ paths, etc. Ride it on the street like every other motor vehicle and learn the proper hand signals for the cars and all other motor vehicles to show them which way you are turning , and when coming to a stop ( These hand signals are / should be in every states motorcycle handbook the one you study for getting your motorcycle license )

Hey Everyone,

Have a look at the speed of this BEAST! Very scary DO NOT try without wearing motorcycle gear! Video
Recorded with a 360 camera.

Check it out here... https://youtu.be/dook0MCH8vg

You do not need to drill holes or add any fluid to the motor.

Those who worry more about protective-wear have a poor understanding of overall safety. The most important factor in safety is riding in a manner that minimizes the chance of an accident, yet that gets virtually zero discussion.

 

[wturber]

Those who worry more about protective-wear have a poor understanding of overall safety. The most important factor in safety is riding in a manner that minimizes the chance of an accident, yet that gets virtually zero discussion.

But that's the thing - riding at 60 mph on standard geometry mountain bike with mountain bike brakes already takes you outside the envelope where you might be "riding in a manner that minimizes the chance of an accident" in Tempe, AZ traffic. So this fellow should either slow down, redesign/reconfigure his bike so it can do , or start preparing for a crash.

Also, if I'm understanding his configuration correctly, he's running about 2kw to a front hub motor that is attached to a suspension fork. Pretty much everything I've read here suggest that this, by itself, isn't very safe. The OP hasn't posted picture of his bike, so its hard to say for sure how securely he has that motor/wheel mounted.

 

[John in CR]

Wearing safety equipment does little more than make people feel safer, and which inherently leads to more dangerous behavior. That's one of the reasons that wearing helmets on bicycles offers no statistical advantage. It may hold true that our faster ebikes may result in an overall benefit, but I still wish I wasn't forced to always wear one, because in my typical riding the chances are so low that I'll get in an accident where a helmet makes a difference that it's simply not worth the negatives. I would still wear one when riding anytime between dusk and dawn, as well as when the roads are wet though. OTOH you'll never catch me in pads, gloves, or riding boots unless I'm riding in some kind of race. All that stuff is like wearing a parachute while mountain climbing.

 

[wturber]

Wearing safety equipment does little more than make people feel safer, and which inherently leads to more dangerous behavior.

There is some truth to that, but I'm pretty sure that you are not only over-generalizing, but are also exaggerating the countering effect of people feeling safer. So yes, insuring against injury tends to generate more risk taking behavior. So the best thing is to advocate helmets but also educate on the limited benefits.

That's one of the reasons that wearing helmets on bicycles offers no statistical advantage.

From what I've been able to glean from the various studies is that we get ambiguous results because we have pretty crappy recording standards for bicycles and we have changes in driver behavior (cell phones, safer cars) that are confounding factors. The AZ reports I've seen are horribly inconsistent in reporting helmet use or not as well as a TON of other stuff. The vast majority of bicycle fatalities come from accidents with cars. And in those cases, the forces are so high that a bicycle helmet probably offers only marginal improvements in safety. Job 1 for a cyclist is to never get hit by a car to begin with. Wearing safety gear is a distant second.

I would still wear one when riding anytime between dusk and dawn, as well as when the roads are wet though. OTOH you'll never catch me in pads, gloves, or riding boots unless I'm riding in some kind of race. All that stuff is like wearing a parachute while mountain climbing.

I wear a helmet and cycling gloves. I wear those for comfort and to help in the case of a bicycle accident, not a car/bicycle accident. If I were riding a 60 mph bicycle, I'd wear even more robust stuff ... because if figure my odds of having an accident going that speed on a bicycle go up dramatically.

BTW, even though I think helmet wearing is a good idea once you get into bike speeds in the 10 mph and over range, I agree that there should be no law that forces adults you to wear helmets. It probably makes more sense statistically to mandate helmets for occupants of automobiles than it does for bicycles.

 

[donn]

The AZ reports I've seen are horribly inconsistent in reporting helmet use or not as well as a TON of other stuff. The vast majority of bicycle fatalities come from accidents with cars.

Uh oh ... helmets ... well, hopefully not stepping right in it ... my reason for wearing a helmet [*] is not strictly the risk of fatality. From what I've read about head injury cases, the fatalities may be the lucky ones. And I suppose this says more about me than anything else, but I've fallen off bicycles and motorcycles and smacked my head (helmet) pretty hard, going approximately 0 mph. I never had a high speed motorcycle get-off, but that was why I wore the boots etc., head to toe armor, because large areas of scraped off skin, ground off ankles, etc. make me kind of nauseous, not my thing at all. I don't do that so much on the bicycle, unless the weather happens to suit my motorcycle jacket. Different articles of protective clothing address different scenarios, some of which apply to bicycling while others don't.

[* besides that it's required by law here and I really don't want to get into that conversation with the police that's going to lead to questions about my motor parameters and so forth.]

 

[wturber]

The AZ reports I've seen are horribly inconsistent in reporting helmet use or not as well as a TON of other stuff. The vast majority of bicycle fatalities come from accidents with cars.

Uh oh ... helmets ... well, hopefully not stepping right in it ... my reason for wearing a helmet [*] is not strictly the risk of fatality. ...

Yeah. That's sorta my reason as well. I went over the handlebars once doing about 18 mph and landed right on my forehead. Crushed the helmet foam down from about 1 inch to about 1/4". The skin in the contact area simply died over the next few days. I didn't realize it then, but now I'm sure I had at least a mild concussion. Messed up my shoulder a bit. Without the helmet, that head strike would have surely landed me in the hospital. As it was, I (sorta) walked away (more like dragged myself to the sidewalk and called for a ride home). And, of course, there is no statistical reporting of this incident where a helmet helped.

 

[John in CR]

The AZ reports I've seen are horribly inconsistent in reporting helmet use or not as well as a TON of other stuff. The vast majority of bicycle fatalities come from accidents with cars.

Uh oh ... helmets ... well, hopefully not stepping right in it ... my reason for wearing a helmet [*] is not strictly the risk of fatality. From what I've read about head injury cases, the fatalities may be the lucky ones. And I suppose this says more about me than anything else, but I've fallen off bicycles and motorcycles and smacked my head (helmet) pretty hard, going approximately 0 mph. I never had a high speed motorcycle get-off, but that was why I wore the boots etc., head to toe armor, because large areas of scraped off skin, ground off ankles, etc. make me kind of nauseous, not my thing at all. I don't do that so much on the bicycle, unless the weather happens to suit my motorcycle jacket. Different articles of protective clothing address different scenarios, some of which apply to bicycling while others don't.

[* besides that it's required by law here and I really don't want to get into that conversation with the police that's going to lead to questions about my motor parameters and so forth.]

The bottom line is that statistics prove that wearing a helmet makes you more likely to get into an accident. Obviously in the case of an accident where your head hits something you're better off with a helmet (except in the extremely small % of the cases where the extra weight of the helmet causes the head impact). That means it is correct to infer that since there is no improvement in overall safety that helmeted riders end up in more accidents with serious injury. There's no doubt that it's lots of little things that add up to that result such as the safer feeling of the rider changing riding behavior, motorists treating helmeted vs bare headed riders differently (the UK study showed cars getting full meter closer to those with helmets), restricted vision and hearing, etc.

When the law changed here I can personally attest to the fact that my brain felt safer with the protection of a helmet, and my average speeds went up until I made a conscious effort to avoid it, but even now knowing the effect in the rare event that I end up lidless I feel more exposed and make extra effort in terms of being careful. I stick with shorts, tshirts, and flipflops to keep some of that exposed feeling, because other than the very low speed stuff that seems inevitable on 2 wheels and costs only scrapes and bruises, I fully intend to ride absolutely crash-free by avoiding obstacles as well as the frequent mistakes of motorists. We've tried a couple of times with very limited success to have discussions about how best to achieve that, but I'm always game for that kind of thread, and I think I have some specifics for consideration. Hopefully others can offer pointers I haven't considered.

 

[donn]

The bottom line is that statistics prove that

I remember once reading that brown rice was proven to make you healthier. They asked people what kind of rice they ate, and the brown rice eaters turned out to be healthier than the white rice eaters. Which is to say, the kind of super health conscious people who would eat brown rice, were healthier than the don't give a fig white rice eaters. But they had carefully factored that all out so it was accounted for in the absolutely credible statistical findings. Believe what you want, but treat "statistics prove" with extreme skepticism.

 

[wturber]

There's no doubt that it's lots of little things that add up to that result such as the safer feeling of the rider changing riding behavior, motorists treating helmeted vs bare headed riders differently (the UK study showed cars getting full meter closer to those with helmets), restricted vision and hearing, etc.

No, that's not what that study showed. First of all, the study didn't have riders, it had one rider and tests were taken on two different routes in the UK. Second, the study did NOT show that cars got a full meter closer. What is showed was that when cars were a meter or more from the cyclist, they were about 3-4 inches closer when the cyclist wore a helmet. It's a curious thing to find, but it has zero impact on safety since a gap of a meter is quite safe. When cars passed closer than a meter, the 3-4 inch closer tendency disappeared.

Of course, you can choose to look at the data differently and there are criticisms of this "one meter or more" analysis. But regardless, the average pass of the helmeted rider was 8.5 cm, or less than four inches closer, not one meter closer. You'd have to be better versed in statistics than I am to tease out the significance of this, but given that the vast majority of the passes were over a meter away, it seems clear that this closer passing tendency is almost always of no real significance. In other words, in this study on these two roads in the UK with this rider and his variations in dress, wearing a helmet did result is slightly closer passes. Whether that affects the rider's safety is wide open to interpretation and debate. But given that the overwhelming majority of passes gave the rider a full meter of distance, I don't think it means much. The good news is that so many riders gave such a wide berth.

It is a shame that this excellent study (done in 2007 - and before the smart phone epidemic) is so routinely misrepresented. It is also a shame that this same kind of test hasn't been made elsewhere or done more recently given the changes in driver behavior that seem apparent. But however you interpret the study results, it makes no sense to generalize from it in the absence of seeing the same pattern repeated in other studies in other countries and locations.

https://psyarxiv.com/nxw2k
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0075424

Even if the study results were as you said, it would still be questionable to rely on one study from a foreign country.

When the law changed here I can personally attest to the fact that my brain felt safer with the protection of a helmet, and my average speeds went up until I made a conscious effort to avoid it, but even now knowing the effect in the rare event that I end up lidless I feel more exposed and make extra effort in terms of being careful.

I agree that feeling safer can affect behavior. But I've been wearing a helmet since the '80s. I use the strapping on of my helmet as a reminder of how little physical protection I have.

We've tried a couple of times with very limited success to have discussions about how best to achieve that, but I'm always game for that kind of thread, and I think I have some specifics for consideration. Hopefully others can offer pointers I haven't considered.

I try to do everything practical to increase my visibility to motorist while also assuming that they can't see me. Dayglo shirts and now socks. Very bright headlight day and night. Additional blinking headlight during the day. highly visible rear red LED array (dozens) day and night. Blinking marker lights for night riding and a dayglo shirt with reflective stripes. (OSHA style construction worker shirt). I try to consistently act as though motorists do not see me until and unless they do something positive that assures me I've been seen. I could probably get more rigorous and discriminating in what I accept as being a positive indication that I've been seen. I constantly remind myself that it makes no sense to be in a rush if you are commuting by bicycle. It's a given that this isn't the fastest way (at least that's the case where I ride). I also remind myself that I have a motor to help get me back up to speed. So precautionary slowing or stopping aren't really a big deal. I can afford to take my time. I plan routes to use low speed roads (35 mph or less is the target) that have bicycle lanes as much as possible. I'll choose slow sidewalk riding (if available) if traffic conditions seem too hazardous or risky. Gotta ride slow on sidewalks given the problem of cars crossing sidewalks without looking.

 

[Tommm]

Can you stop going off topic here? You can wear a watermelon on your head and jump off a balcony for all we care, let everyone else wear what they want in peace.

 

[John in CR]

Can you stop going off topic here? You can wear a watermelon on your head and jump off a balcony for all we care, let everyone else wear what they want in peace.

I have no problem at all with people choosing to wear helmets and protective wear. I do have a problem, a big one, with people insisting that everyone else does, especially since it's been shown to provide no benefit to overall public safety. There are a lot of factors that combine to make the real world overall benefit quite different from seatbelts and air bags.

 

[brumbrum]

I've got Lightning Bolts coming out of my ar*e. I overclocked, overvolted, peek C'd n discharged my 130C lico bang bangs with Ninja cobra mad man controllers that have anti gravity and anti flip over launch control. I can drain the pack in 10 seconds n each cell glows white hot until i initiate my custom built plasma cooling system.

 

[markz]

Pictures and/or video of the actually bike please.

 

[donn]

I've got Lightning Bolts coming out of my ar*e.

So far just thunder from mine.

 

[markz]

That is the bad mexican chain restaraunt food you were eating!

 

[brumbrum]

Pictures and/or video of the actually bike please.

Here's the fabrication process of the plasma cooling system.

Here's the bike before the first test run.. I know it doesn't look like much but there's a lot packed into that dummy proping up the bike.

And here is myself and my chief engineer with our anti plasma visors and flame proof head gear. As you can see i have a spare amp exhaust in hand just in case the one on the bike cant blow out the current quick enough.