JDELUNA
10 mW
Now this is something pretty interesting !!! Enjoy and God Bless 
http://news.en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/article.aspx?cp-documentid=5044057
http://news.en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/article.aspx?cp-documentid=5044057
Forget electric......how about an AIR powered car !!!! >&
- Thread starter JDELUNA
- Start date
Matt Gruber
1 MW
no air bikes allowed in FL.
That is pretty cool. The idea has been around a long time. I think improvements in tank design are making it more practical. I'd hate to think of what might happen in a collision if a tank ruptured. 52 gallons is a really big tank.
The air tank is like a battery that never wears out and can be recharged quickly. I suspect multiple smaller tanks are used, rather than one big one.
The air tank is like a battery that never wears out and can be recharged quickly. I suspect multiple smaller tanks are used, rather than one big one.
TylerDurden
100 GW
I'm skeptical about how fast you could recharge.
Consumer CNG pumps are pretty slow to fill a Honda Civic. >6hrs
On par with battery charge times, but lots more mech stuff to maintain.
Compressed gasses seem not too effecient end-to-end, since the heat of compression is a significant loss. At least air is cheap, NG has risen in price along with gas.
:?
Consumer CNG pumps are pretty slow to fill a Honda Civic. >6hrs
On par with battery charge times, but lots more mech stuff to maintain.
Compressed gasses seem not too effecient end-to-end, since the heat of compression is a significant loss. At least air is cheap, NG has risen in price along with gas.
:?
dirty_d
10 kW
52gal*4000psi + crash = big boom
Lock
100 MW
Lots of air-powered vehicles here, at the Museum of RetroTechnology:
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/comprair/comprair.htm
tks
Lock
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/comprair/comprair.htm
tks
Lock
JDELUNA
10 mW
I was jut thinking, now theoretically, if the air powered car had an air compressor that the engine powered, could it not keep filling its tanks with the air it needs for fuel ?? I am guessing it would probably be not as effiencient and that it could not fill the tank fast enough. Just a thought. ALso instead of brining a gas can, one could have a bicycle pump and if ever ran out of air, probably pump for about 15 minutes to get enough air to get to a gas................oooops, I mean air station. God Bless
TylerDurden
100 GW
Ever tried filling a single car-tire with a hand pump? Takes about an hour. That much air couldn't even budge the lightest of cars.
If the car's engine were running on air, running a compressor too, would be like Wiley Coyote blowing into the sail of a wind powered car.
If the engine were running on gas, why bother with air?
:?
If the car's engine were running on air, running a compressor too, would be like Wiley Coyote blowing into the sail of a wind powered car.
If the engine were running on gas, why bother with air?
:?
newbie electric rider
100 W
Well, if you had regenerative breaking, and a battery bank hooked up to an air pump, but with all the added wieght to carry around, um dont think it would work out, you would use more energy to move the stuff around
To try and create some sort of air charging circuit our of a air motor, well it just comes under effiency, a no go
Nuclear batteries would work good in that config though
To try and create some sort of air charging circuit our of a air motor, well it just comes under effiency, a no go
Nuclear batteries would work good in that config though
xyster
10 MW
TylerDurden said:
Yah, what TD said. Many people have a strange predilection to believe in perpetual motion.
Jozzer
100 kW
http://www.theaircar.com/
Yep, these guys look good. I remember I read there was a bike sized hub rotory air motor being designed along these lines from some guy in new Zealand (if memory serves).
I also remember that someone did run one of these with a petrol powered compressor and achieved close to 100 MPG at decent speeds too. Its amazing just how inneficient a car engine is! Check out the clever con rod designs and gearbox too...
Yep, these guys look good. I remember I read there was a bike sized hub rotory air motor being designed along these lines from some guy in new Zealand (if memory serves).
I also remember that someone did run one of these with a petrol powered compressor and achieved close to 100 MPG at decent speeds too. Its amazing just how inneficient a car engine is! Check out the clever con rod designs and gearbox too...
With an air powered vehicle, since most air motors can work as air compressors, it should be possible to get regenerative braking using the existing hardware (just a little plumbing). For a car, regenerative braking is much more beneficial than it is on a bike.
Using a ICE to power an air compressor is not totally crazy. It's the eqivalent of a series hybid electric car. I'm just not sure how the overall efficiency would compare to an electric system or a straight ICE. It's pretty hard to beat the new TDI diesels. As I recall, the efficiency of compressing air, then using it to run a motor is less than an electric system.
Using a ICE to power an air compressor is not totally crazy. It's the eqivalent of a series hybid electric car. I'm just not sure how the overall efficiency would compare to an electric system or a straight ICE. It's pretty hard to beat the new TDI diesels. As I recall, the efficiency of compressing air, then using it to run a motor is less than an electric system.
Lock
100 MW
Sure it is. Try a simple experiment. Run the TDI for 15 minutes. Then fry an egg on it. With an electric motor properly sized to the task, your egg will remain runny. Heat (from an engine) is waste. Inefficient, unless you like your eggs well done.
tks
Lock
Jozzer
100 kW
I agree, overall efficiency is probably slightly lower, but the air powered version is probably cleaner to make due to no heavy chemicals for the batts..
I think the QED hubmotored mini with a gennie in the boot managed equivilent MPG from its gennie however, perhaps because the batteries weigh more than an air tank?
I think the QED hubmotored mini with a gennie in the boot managed equivilent MPG from its gennie however, perhaps because the batteries weigh more than an air tank?
Lock said:
I guess my comparison was a TDI diesel alone vs. any kind of ICE hybrid system.
I also seem to recall someone pointing out the hub motors get hot enough to bake Girl Scout cookies..
Parker
10 W
Interesting air car video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-A3XHFT5qc
Notable points:
Aluminum engine
Carbon fiber air tanks for nonexplosive failure
3 min recharge
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-A3XHFT5qc
Notable points:
Aluminum engine
Carbon fiber air tanks for nonexplosive failure
3 min recharge
JDELUNA
10 mW
Wow really nice, it says 3 minute recharge from a service station air compressor I am guessing. That's about the same time it takes for an average fill up of gas now. I wish that a major automaker would look into this technology, but they won't as in my opinion they will explore something else like battery power, hydrogen power, etc. something that will give the current oil companies some new item to switch too, when gas and oil is no longer profitable. Imagine instead of Exxon oil it would be Exxon batteries, or Exxon hydrogen. Where-as air is almost free and plentiful. Just my thoughts. God Bless
xyster
10 MW
Though the air is essentially free, it takes just as much, if not more, energy from such sources to compress that air. The major energy corporations have nothing to worry about so long as they can adapt to the changing energy landscape.
What it you compressed hydrogen or natural gas, then run that through the air motor. The low pressure "exhaust" could then go into a fuel cell or ICE to get even more power.
xyster
10 MW
fechter said:
Won't those gases tend to explode from the heat of compression to such high PSI? Cooling the gas would require a lot more energy, in addition to the energy required to compress it.
No, they won't explode unless there's some oxygen. There are thousands of NGV's (natural gas vehicles) on the road and they compress the gas to very high pressures. Same thing for hydrogen. Some are over 5,000 psi.
I guess my thought is more like if you already have a NGV, you could add an "air motor" to recover energy that is currenly wasted. Sort of a weird hybrid.
I guess my thought is more like if you already have a NGV, you could add an "air motor" to recover energy that is currenly wasted. Sort of a weird hybrid.
knightmb
100 kW
xyster said:
That's the key. You would still need a gas engine (or something) to compress the air. That's where if a more enviro friendly "station" should come into play. Like a bank of solar panels somewhere in the desert that produce electricity to run a plant (or service station) that is "compressing" gas all day until you get a small part of it to fill up your car. I see a lot of potential in the technology as long as greedy corps don't get their hands on it first through some BS regulation, tax, etc.
