Giant NRS/Mac hub/48v Headway now A123 build

[1000w]

I have had a blonde moment and not thought about using a 1 or 2 cross pattern.
I will be relacing soon with a 1 cross pattern.
Thanks for the feedback.
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[1000w]

Speaking of which does anyone have a cheap source for bare rims in Australia ?

Not sure of a cheap source in Australia.
I used Chain Reaction. I did an order with a mate that was over $412 so no shipping cost. So the rim below was only $38.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=26265
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[cell_man]

Matt, the red motor is looking good.

 

[AussieJester]

Matt spokes was the reason i called today give me a ring back after you finished puting out the fires haha i may have some here already that you can have, let me know the length you need and ill check anywayz...

KiM

 

[Hyena]

Paul I think black is a good colour, thats what colour I'll do mine if I paint it. Maybe even a "shadow chrome" type of colour if I feel like being fancy

Keep us posted about the spokes and rims. I guess if you can supply a matching spoke + rim kit that'd be a good option for many.
I guess if you order spokes to suit the macs for your 24 and 26" rims that'd be a good start. I don't know how the masses feel but I like black rims

 

[cell_man]

Really keen to hear how you get on with the Mac at 48V and especially running 24 instead of the more typical 26" rim. I'm running mine at that voltage and up to about 45A since I soldered the shunts a bit more and they have held so far. Will have to see how they look when I open them up. I noticed a big difference in the heating when I jumped from 30 or so amps up to 40A plus but it's still no more than fairly warm (all standard but ~30% higher RPM wind). I'll have to get my thermocouple on there to get some exact figures. For sure the Mac will not pull above about 30A at 48V once you get up to a reasonable RPM, it's only gonna be at fairly low RPM where it will pull high current and that's also where it is less efficient so will result in more heating. At 48V it will pull somewhere around 800-1000W at max speed. Be interested to hear how running at say 30A current limit or 40A or so at 48V effects the performance.

 

[1000w]

Hub and rear rim are now laced with a one cross spoke pattern.

Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[AussieJester]

I see the frock motor got a lick of pruuurty pink
erm red paint too Matt Looks slick
mate, some Barbie stickers would really set
it off don't you think? :lol: Did you use
high temp paint Matt? i here those frocks get bit toasty
certainly will when you brings it up here for a ride
i'll get to mapping out a route with the biggest mofo
hills i can find in the area to kill the froc....erm i meant
test it out :lol:

KiM

 

[dingoEsride]

Nice work Matt, shaping up to be one great big little giant

mark

 

[1000w]

Thanks Mark.
I had some clearance issuses between the Juicy 7 disc caliper and the Mac hub.
I had to space the disc away from the hub with washers and then match the spacing with a washer on the axle so the caliper fitted to the mount.

I have also now fabricated and installed a torque arm using 5mm steel plate and a nutsert in the frame.

Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[Mark_A_W]

I have similar spacers on my disc Matt.


Torque arm looks good.


Mark

 

[1000w]

It's time to rename this build to "Giant NRS/Mac hub/48v Cell Man cells build"
I am going to use 16 x 15Ah Cell Man cells. The pack is going to be built in two 8 cell groups mounted on either side of the frame triangle.

Here are the cells, individually wrapped really nicely, thanks Paul "Cell Man", then placed in pairs into the manufacturers packaging.

I tested all the cell voltages and marked the pos and neg terminals.

Great little 4 amp charger and BMS, both from Cell Man.

I am making side panels out of perspex, which the cells will mount to on the outside and the BMS and infinion controller will mount to on the inside.

I will be placing a cover over the outside of the cells when I have the packs built and mounted.

Thanks again to Paul "Cell Man" for the great service and products with a trouble free transaction.
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[cell_man]

Thanks Matt

Let me know how you get on with the terminations and give me a shout if you have any questions. Great work as ever!

BTW it's a 5A charger

Those BMS seem pretty robust. The trip current is something like 150A (80A constant) and they are fitted with 8pcs of what seem to be genuine IRFB4310 fets for the discharge and 2 pieces of unknown fet for the charger circuit. You can still trip them with capacitor in rush though, so I'd recommend a pre-charge resistor. With the current those cells can deliver the inrush to the controller is pretty serious. I've seen other BMSs which use what appears to be the same PCB but have some differences in the build. Not had any real complaints about the BMSs other than the 30A versions are a bit prone to tripping with capacitor in rush, but they are fine for normal usage at current levels twice the constant rating.

I'm still running the dual Mac motors in my bike but I've gone back to standard motors, rather than the high speed 1s I was running. I've lost some top speed but that's probably for the best. Almost 70kph with no protection in Shanghai is not such a good idea, now it tops out at 58kph (about 50V plus under load) with no wind and pulls about 1500W doing it. Also reduced my Whrs/km by about 30%. If the single Mac isn't enough for your power needs I'll do you a very good deal on a front Mac motor :wink: Haven't heard anything on the new stronger gears yet but I'm very interested to see how you fair with the nylon gears for now.

I'll pass on the comments about the packaging to my GF. She's getting so good at it these days, I let her do all the packing

 

[mwkeefer]

Matt P.,
Do I sense a former Car Audio guy? I love the plexi!
-Mike

 

[1000w]

Matt P.,
Do I sense a former Car Audio guy? I love the plexi!
-Mike

I can see why you say that. However the answer is no.
I actually recently found two nice sheets of the stuff at verge pickup and I love working with it.
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[AussieJester]

*bump* pics Matt?

....the plexi housing your working on...?!?

KiM

 

[1000w]

Ok Kim, I did say on the phone that I would post last night however I ran out of time.
I have made some progress on the battery box.
Bought some red carbon fibre vinyl for the battery box cover.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/3D-RED-CARBON-FIBER-VINYL-STICKERS-DECALS-FILM-20-X40-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem4aa09e5471QQitemZ320522310769QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

These photos should explain where it's heading.

This is the main cover that the red vinyl above will go on.

Some support for the two groups of 8 15ah Cell Man cells.

The cover on.

8 cells on the right side.

I scored this great seat off a mate, no cost, just a little help with his car. It is slightly used but has the original packaging with a $299 price tag. Completely over the top for this bike but he wanted me to have it as the colour matched the red NRS.

More to come later when I get the cells made up with the terminations all done.
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[AussieJester]

DAMN! That looks very slick Matt top job. The red carbon fiber vinyl will look
the shit too better match the frame than the black CF vinyl would.

Tried to get through on your mobile today actually Matt, wanted to get you to bring your
Magura throttle up with you when you come by if you could, i want to try it on the Infineon
setup (still assembled on the bench from last week haha) To discount the throttle being a problem.
As you know i altered mine and the Infineon may not be seeing it as "off" when it is in the off position
I wondered if this might affect the controller turning on also?

Looking forward to seeing the GT Frocked bike anywayz Matt, will surely be another premo
example of your Skillz...OH hehe and REALLY looking forward to seeing your new Audio S4 :wink:

KiM

 

[Hyena]

Nice boxes Matt, but that look like alot of bulk between your legs (hehe)
Are you still planning to pedal ? My battery box overhangs my top tube by about 10mm on each side and which it's not uncomfortable and doesn't rub I wouldn't want it much wider.

 

[1000w]

Nice boxes Matt, but that look like alot of bulk between your legs (hehe)
Are you still planning to pedal ? My battery box overhangs my top tube by about 10mm on each side and which it's not uncomfortable and doesn't rub I wouldn't want it much wider.

You're right there is a fair bit of bulk, but the pedals and cranks are not obstructed. I have pedalled on the spot without the chain on and it feels ok.
Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[AussieJester]

Before or after the dick tuck and tape before slipping into the frilly frock for test ride Matt? (soz couldn't resist)

We should be seeing a completed A123 pack today sometime shouldn't we Matt?

KiM

 

[1000w]

I have now assembled the two "Cell Man cells" batt packs and I would like to congratulate Paul "Cell Man" on his termination method and his written assembly instructions.
Paul supplied all the parts for the termination blocks together with excellent written instructions. Initially I was not looking forward to assemblling these packs, however the quality of the terminal blocks and the instructions made it a breeze.
I wired in BMS sense wires and an extra plug for cell monitors. Paul you will see, in the later photos, why I ran the BMS wires straight up. Plenty of room and they can't come out sideways in my set up.
The white material on all the cells is contact to limit any voltage leakage and abrasion.
A special thanks to Kim, Aussie Jester, for the blue abrasion sleave material.

This photo is to show that the pedals do clear the battery enclosure.

Here is one pack with the duct tape treatment.

Cheers,
Matt.P.

 

[beast775]

this build is wicked,im sure your pedals will become footrests anyways.it looks great nice battery setup. 8)

 

[AussieJester]

this build is wicked,im sure your pedals will become footrests anyways.it looks great nice battery setup. 8)

hehee not when he comes for a ride up in da hills with me they wont, ol Matt.P will be peeeedllin his lil ass off to keep up

These plexi boxes are alot smaller than they appear on the pics to, i was quite surprised i thought the cells were bigger than they are. Excellent job Matt the sleeving looks good to mate

KiM

p.s had any luck with the programing of the Infineon? My phonline was just put back on.....again this morning was going to call yesterday and see how you were getting on. Damn Tesltra tech couldnt find a thing wrong with it yet 4 times in the last 5 weeks the line has lost dial tone :-S If you cant get hold of me in future you know why haha

 

[Hyena]

Matt will have plenty of juice from the batteries but unfortunately the mac motor is what's going to let him down. An air cooled DD hub that can take 100 amps for short bursts will offer a completely different world of performance. The good news is it's only $200 odd extra + some new spokes to swap it over when the performance of the mac doesn't live up to the rest of the build.

(or you could get a RC drive like that nong Kim is about to suggest lol)