Help with wiring

[Duke Silver]

Hey everyone,
I just got my throttle controller and battery about 2 days ago, fortunately I did not realize the battery did not come with a charger so I had to wait for that which was delivered yesterday.

I got everything wired up and scooters rolling perfectly fine but when I went to charge it I noticed that I had it plugged in for quite some time and the charger never turned from red to green to indicate that the charging cycle was done.

This is where I'm hoping someone could help me pinpoint if I did something incorrect. As you can see from the pictures how I have everything wired up, The thicker black and red wires going to the wire nuts along with the one skinny red wire were all in one white plastic clip that I took out of there to directly connected to the battery wires. That skinny red wire goes into a clip that says charging port and the black wire attached to the other and goes directly into the controller. I'm not using the stock charging port. I 3D print it a housing for the charging port that was already attached to the battery. I still have the clip with the black and red wires that were attached to the original charging port and fit into the controller charging port.

This is where I'm believing I might have to attach that clip and splice it in somewhere, I could/may be wrong, but I feel like it's not letting the controller know when the battery is at full charge I feel like I definitely missed something here.

Also one thing I noticed when you have the three battery setup is that there is a 30 amp fuse connected to that setup, do I still need that with this setup I currently have?

https://imgur.com/a/oRRybsW

 

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is the battery/controller isolated when charging? if not is it drawing enough current to fool the charger?

A simple hi current isolation switch i have employed is an anti-spark XT90 connector fitted inline on a battery power lead with a simple loop, Pull to isolate the battery, and thanks to the anti-spark, no pops or bangs when reconnecting the control system with the initial capacitor draw.

 

[Duke Silver]

is the battery/controller isolated when charging? if not is it drawing enough current to fool the charger?

A simple hi current isolation switch i have employed is an anti-spark XT90 connector fitted inline on a battery power lead with a simple loop, Pull to isolate the battery, and thanks to the anti-spark, no pops or bangs when reconnecting the control system with the initial capacitor draw.

My apologies, I am not great with understanding wiring concepts. When you say is it isolated, do you mean are the disconnected from one another when charging? If so, no.

I looked into the XT90 connector you mentioned and I am not sure how that would work with my setup. It seems like it's meant to be a connector that you can easily disconnect. If that is what you are saying I would need to use this for when charging then I would have to unbolt the deck of the scooter to get access to the connector every time I need to charge it. I am getting that pop you mentioned whenever I plug in the charger, so if I am getting the purpose of the connector wrong could you please explain in more detail? Thanks.

 

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My apologies, I am not great with understanding wiring concepts. When you say is it isolated, do you mean are the disconnected from one another when charging? If so, no.

I looked into the XT90 connector you mentioned and I am not sure how that would work with my setup. It seems like it's meant to be a connector that you can easily disconnect. If that is what you are saying I would need to use this for when charging then I would have to unbolt the deck of the scooter to get access to the connector every time I need to charge it. I am getting that pop you mentioned whenever I plug in the charger, so if I am getting the purpose of the connector wrong could you please explain in more detail? Thanks.

- Sounds like you follow ok, yes a simple break in a power wire, If inaccessible the hack simply needs more wire to route the easy break/make connector to an accessible spot. (Use an appropriate load carrying gauge wire btw)

While a Power isolation switch/solution is a pretty basic safety feature for any EV its probably not a final solution to your issue but perhaps more a way to eliminate the controller and subsequent wiring which according to you rides/rolls well .. Other scenarios involve an imbalance between cell groups as a result of a long shipping shelving period?? or a dodgy cell or more used in battery pack fabrication. - shipping without a charger suggests it was sold where regulations either dont exist or get adhered to so ???

re-reading post #1 unless otherwise guided I would wire the thin red and thin black wires from the battery pack to the charging port. the battery BMS config will take care of any common ground requirements. ( assuming the battery pack has 2 x thick load carrying wires and 2x thinner charging wires?, otherwise please detail.) - also specify make/model of the controller as that should lead you to a wiring schematic to follow.

 

[Duke Silver]

- Sounds like you follow ok, yes a simple break in a power wire, If inaccessible the hack simply needs more wire to route the easy break/make connector to an accessible spot. (Use an appropriate load carrying gauge wire btw)

While a Power isolation switch/solution is a pretty basic safety feature for any EV its probably not a final solution to your issue but perhaps more a way to eliminate the controller and subsequent wiring which according to you rides/rolls well .. Other scenarios involve an imbalance between cell groups as a result of a long shipping shelving period?? or a dodgy cell or more used in battery pack fabrication. - shipping without a charger suggests it was sold where regulations either dont exist or get adhered to so ???

re-reading post #1 unless otherwise guided I would wire the thin red and thin black wires from the battery pack to the charging port. the battery BMS config will take care of any common ground requirements. ( assuming the battery pack has 2 x thick load carrying wires and 2x thinner charging wires?, otherwise please detail.) - also specify make/model of the controller as that should lead you to a wiring schematic to follow.

The red and black wires coming out of the battery both join into a connector and then it came with a connector that plugs into that and then you have access to red and black wires to be tapped into whatever you needed to go to which is what is in the wire nuts so I'm assuming if I wanted to go that route I could probably just cut the connectors off of both ends of that and then put those connectors you showed me on there and that would be the simplest way to go about that.

I did not know that could be the case regarding what you said with the battery shipping without a charger suggesting that regulations either don't exist or get adhered to. I hate finding out something like that after the fact that you've already gone through the process of buying it. I tried to do my best to research everything and honestly I thought it came with a charger, but that's entirely my fault because I didn't scroll down and read the entire description. I just based it off of the pictures that showed multiple pictures with the charger. I did look at the reviews for the charger that I got off of Amazon and one person in there said the charger is charging but they have the exact same problem that I have where the light just stays red and never turns green. I was thinking about trying another charger and seeing if that is the problem.

This battery is saying it has that BMS feature which I'm assuming is tied into not allowing it to overcharge so with the charging port being on the battery and the charger plugged directly into it when it's full it should tell the charger without having to go through the controller, hey I'm full turn that light green. Am I correct to think that way about it? Like I said the battery is charging it's just I never get that indication that it's fully charged so my kids have been running the scooter close to empty and then I put it on the charger for about five and a half hours, Just to be safe and make sure that it's getting a full charge.

I definitely want to do some modifications to this scooter down the line with changing out the motor from the stock to a 1000 watt motor and then I've seen people changing these sprockets out as well to gain some speed. Then maybe further down the line start converting everything over to 48 volts to try to increase the power a little bit more. I've driven this around the neighborhood after I got it running and I weigh 170 lb going up hills it's definitely not the fastest. I've had my phone GPS on while driving it and it seems like on a flat surface I'm hitting about 16 mph. I definitely thought it would go a little bit faster than that with the newer controller and that lithium-ion battery. But I would love to increase the speed of this scooter with some modifications.

Right now it's good for what it is My kids are driving it around the neighborhood They enjoy it I just want to make sure that it's not going to cause them any problem that's why I'm coming here asking these questions about the wiring Just to make sure my setup looks like I have everything correct.

 

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1) Is the charger providing sufficient volts to charge the battery? if so how many volts? ( Measure carefully don't just read off a label)
2) What voltage is the battery holding post charge? does this drop over time without any use?

Even a temporary isolation of the battery from the controller will reduce your pool of suspect devices to just the 2x,the charger and battery pack.

 

[Duke Silver]

1) Is the charger providing sufficient volts to charge the battery? if so how many volts? ( Measure carefully don't just read off a label)
2) What voltage is the battery holding post charge? does this drop over time without any use?

Even a temporary isolation of the battery from the controller will reduce your pool of suspect devices to just the 2x,the charger and battery pack.

I'm assuming I am going to need a multimeter to do that testing? Unfortunately my multimeter died on me a few months back and I haven't gotten around to replacing it so I can't do any testing right now.

But you're saying even if I just disconnect the battery from everything else and then try charging it to see if that indicator changes from red to green to either rule out or find out if the controller may be the issue?

 

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I'm assuming I am going to need a multimeter to do that testing? Unfortunately my multimeter died on me a few months back and I haven't gotten around to replacing it so I can't do any testing right now.

yes, but take extra care testing the charge voltage, shorting connections with the probes can brick chargers. a spare charge socket or temporary wiring with clips to reduce the risk of shorting the circuit is worthwhile considering in the meanwhile.

But you're saying even if I just disconnect the battery from everything else and then try charging it to see if that indicator changes from red to green to either rule out or find out if the controller may be the issue?

Yes, reduce the testing to the minimum required components, so 1x test rules out the control system and its wiring or points to it.
As is your:
1) charger or
2) the battery or
3) the wiring or
4) the controller
- could be at fault.


Since the scooter 'rolls' ok the controller signals/beeps no errors? and as long as the wiring follows the makers schematic? that side of things should be ok but confirming is worth the test imho as otherwise time could be wasted.

If your charger isnt pushing enough volts out it will never finish.. so confirm charge voltage.

If your battery fails to hold a full charge or dissipates volts sat on the side for 24/48hours your battery becomes suspect and if new ? returnable? is the battery an ali express bargain $99 special? if you paid less than a reasonable price.....