Hydraulic Disc Brakes and Hub Motor Question

[mateusleo]

Hello guys, i made a post about a battery sometime ago and have been a little bit away from the forum since then. I i just bought an used hydraulic disc brakes from ebay and i'm waiting very excited for its arrival. I already had mechanical disc bakes but they didn't have a good regulation. Those are the brakes i bought:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-deo...AoGqV2Dz8rFRSnbNr%2BU%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

The good apoint about them for me is that they have shifter, so it saves space on my handlebar. This topic isn't really useful, but the intetion is to start a little discussion about brakes =)



About the hub motor:
So, my bike has this 1000w hub motor:

http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/oo14/mateus0000/DSC04320.jpg
http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/oo14/mateus0000/DSC04319.jpg

And sometime ago i saw a hub motor in this forum, like this :

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/i...F-40-r4qyHkQaWrwVcxpDg4nncjl2xBdxD_mlzlIIiDdk

But with the gears badly damaged, unafortunatelly i couldn't find the original pictures.... And then, after seeing the damaged gears, the concern about gears started to worry me. The thing is, i don't know if my motor has gears or no, so someone please answer me that =D Thanks


And i have a last question: Is it possible to make a regeneration system with my motor? How? If not what do i need to set up a regen system ?

Thanks ppl!!!!

Btw, moonday i'm starting university, i'll study eletrical engineering =)

 

[Drunkskunk]

Your motor has no gears. it's a direct drive, and looks like a GM 901 or a variation of it.
Its possible to have regeneration, but you will need a controller capable of it.

 

[dogman dan]

Yup, that's a direct drive motor, no gears inside that type.

Your controller might be capable of enabling regen, but stuff like that's over my head. Definitely though, dd motors can do regen with the right controller. You might need to add a reed switch to your brake handles to get regen braking, or have some alternative like a push button on the bars that engages the regen.

 

[mateusleo]

So, basically, i have to open my controller to check if it is capable of regen ?

 

[hjns]

Hello guys, i made a post about a battery sometime ago and have been a little bit away from the forum since then. I i just bought an used hydraulic disc brakes from ebay and i'm waiting very excited for its arrival. I already had mechanical disc bakes but they didn't have a good regulation. Those are the brakes i bought:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-deo...AoGqV2Dz8rFRSnbNr%2BU%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

The good apoint about them for me is that they have shifter, so it saves space on my handlebar. This topic isn't really useful, but the intetion is to start a little discussion about brakes =)

Hmm, these shift by moving the lever up and down. It is impossible to shift and brake at the same time, so be careful. Tell me if you like them, and how you tested them, because I did a test run with these and immediately bought separate gear shifters and brakes.

 

[hjns]

So, basically, i have to open my controller to check if it is capable of regen ?

I would not be able to judge whether a controller is able to do regen from looking at it opened or closed. Better ask the guy you bought the controller from. Else, get a new one which is confirmed to do regen.

 

[mateusleo]

Hello guys, i made a post about a battery sometime ago and have been a little bit away from the forum since then. I i just bought an used hydraulic disc brakes from ebay and i'm waiting very excited for its arrival. I already had mechanical disc bakes but they didn't have a good regulation. Those are the brakes i bought:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-deo...AoGqV2Dz8rFRSnbNr%2BU%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

The good apoint about them for me is that they have shifter, so it saves space on my handlebar. This topic isn't really useful, but the intetion is to start a little discussion about brakes =)

Hmm, these shift by moving the lever up and down. It is impossible to shift and brake at the same time, so be careful. Tell me if you like them, and how you tested them, because I did a test run with these and immediately bought separate gear shifters and brakes.

Act, i want this type just to save space. My mechanical ones already have lever and shifters to save space in the handlebars....I've always used this type, but never a hydraulic brake..

 

[DAND214]

I love those brakes. 8" rotors frt and rear, what a great combo.
The ad said no brake fluid, so make sure you don't use any DOT stuff in them. It's mineral oil only. Shimano sells there own special stuff which is expensive. But that's a lot cheaper than using the regular DOT auto brake fluid in them and ruining them.

You will find they are a bit tricky to bleed them. I have gone to plain mineral oil from Walgreens, so far no concerns. It seems a heavier than the Shimano stuff and feels more sluggish but a heck of a lot vheaper. It is also getting thinner since it's finnaly warming up.

I put a mini micro switch on the brake housing and the brake lever pushes it on to kill the motor. I don't have regen since I'm running a MAC geared motor.

Dan

 

[Chalo]

The ad said no brake fluid, so make sure you don't use any DOT stuff in them. It's mineral oil only. Shimano sells there own special stuff which is expensive. But that's a lot cheaper than using the regular DOT auto brake fluid in them and ruining them.

ATF works fine in Shimano, Magura, and any other bicycle hydraulic brakes that use oil instead of glycol. I would not be surprised to learn that the teeny $15 bottle of Shimano Extra-Special Brake Nectar is in fact ATF.

But you might as well spring for the expensive fluid, because hydraulics on bicycles are just vanity and wankery anyway. It should cost a lot, just so somebody benefits from it.

 

[full-throttle]

hydraulics on bicycles are just vanity and wankery anyway

Another worthless opinion of Chalo :lol:
You are outnumbered 1,000,000:1 just like your North Korean cousin KimJ.

 

[mateusleo]

I love those brakes. 8" rotors frt and rear, what a great combo.
The ad said no brake fluid, so make sure you don't use any DOT stuff in them. It's mineral oil only. Shimano sells there own special stuff which is expensive. But that's a lot cheaper than using the regular DOT auto brake fluid in them and ruining them.

Dan

I asked the seller about that, he said they are not empty,they are ready to use, he just isn't shipping new oil.

 

[TheBeastie]

With the topic of hydraulic brakes is it standard method to use "micro switches" so you keep your original leavers etc so you can cut motor off for braking, or do most people just remember to take throttle off before braking?
What are these micro switches anyway? What do they look like.

I am thinking with my next build I will get hyrualic brakes with a geared MAC build with thumb throttle and not even worry about ebike levers/sensors and just remember to remove throttle when braking, is that a dumb idea?

 

[Chalo]

I am thinking with my next build I will get hyrualic brakes with a geared MAC build with thumb throttle and not even worry about ebike levers/sensors and just remember to remove throttle when braking, is that a dumb idea?

It removes a valuable safety interlock, in case of a fail-on condition. A brake lever is closer at hand and easier to grab in a hurry than any other kind of kill switch. If you take away the e-brake levers, think about what you'll use instead as an emergency power cutoff. Perhaps a "panic button" mounted on the handlebars and connected to the same circuit?

Hydraulic brakes have a range of disadvantages compared to cable brakes, so familiarize yourself with these things too, and not just the hype about their feel, or the false perception that they are stronger than cable brakes.

 

[full-throttle]

Hydraulic brakes have a range of disadvantages compared to cable brakes, so familiarize yourself with these things too, and not just the hype about their feel, or the false perception that they are stronger than cable brakes.

Blah, blah, blah..
Cable actuated brakes have problems too
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=48946
Pick the brakes that fit your needs

 

[mateusleo]

So, the brakes i bought did not fit between my disc and motor. Lucky i can re-sell it for the same price i paid. Then, looking now for cheap stuff, i found those "semi-hydraulic" disc brakes, and after a little research in google, some people said they do their job for $13. They seem interesting, it is a cable that pulls a hydraulic piston inside the brake, so, basically, its both mechanical and hydraulic. Maybe it brings good stuff from both sides. llars,course its not as good as a full hydraulic brake, but it is way cheaper and probably way better than mechanical disc brakes (and cheper than them too). What you guys think about it? By the way, the shipping from this link i'm posting below for my country is $36 dollars, i can't pay that much to ship a 13 bucks item. If some of you have seen this in another site/seller that i can check the shipping price please post it here, i'm interested in buying one of those to test.


Brake link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/PROMAX-REAR...141000703691?pt=US_Brakes&hash=item20d44bfecb

 

[Chalo]

So, the brakes i bought did not fit between my disc and motor. Lucky i can re-sell it for the same price i paid. Then, looking now for cheap stuff, i found those "semi-hydraulic" disc brakes, and after a little research in google, some people said they do their job for $13.

Brake link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/PROMAX-REAR...190857305119?pt=US_Brakes&hash=item2c6ffb5c1f

I have two observations:

First, I have never encountered a Promax brand disc brake that worked much better than dragging a brick on a string. I have not tried the ones in the link, but all the mechanical ones I have serviced or tested were about as weak as brakes could possibly be.

Second, one significant shortcoming of "semi-hydraulic" brakes is that they locate all the fluid close to where heat is generated. So they are quicker to hydro-lock. That assumes that they offer significant stopping power and thus can generate significant heat, which is not a given in this case.

 

[mateusleo]

I have two observations:

First, I have never encountered a Promax brand disc brake that worked much better than dragging a brick on a string. I have not tried the ones in the link, but all the mechanical ones I have serviced or tested were about as weak as brakes could possibly be.

Second, one significant shortcoming of "semi-hydraulic" brakes is that they locate all the fluid close to where heat is generated. So they are quicker to hydro-lock. That assumes that they offer significant stopping power and thus can generate significant heat, which is not a given in this case.

The heat thing is true, but i still think it's worth a shot for 13 bucks, since i can find cheap shipping. The hydro-lock isn't a real problem, since the calipers have that bolt you can use to adjust the fluid pressure, so when you notice that the fluid is expanding, simply take a 20 seconds break to reduce the fluid pressure.