Hyperion EOS 1420i NET3 14s Balance Charger...

[fechter]

I don't see any reason you can't leave the CellLog on while charging. I don't think the current it draws will be enough to mess with the charger. You could also possibly tie in the alarm on the CellLog to kill the charger if a cell goes over.

Don't try connecting more than one USB balance charger at a time in a series connected pack. I don't think the USB plug is isolated. (big spark, fried computer) I've seen USB isolated cables at work that could solve that problem. They have some kind of isolation built into one of the connectors.

 

[El_Steak]

I've charged using the 1420i with a cell log plugged into a parallel balance lead. No problem.

 

[hillzofvalp]

You can charge the whole pack in series without disconnecting anything, not even the controller (use separate leads for the chargers). However you need a separate isolated powersupply for each charger (meanwells work fine) and you can't use the "network balancing feature" (you have to press start charge on both charger). As long as both chargers are configured identically, you should get all your cells balanced to within 0.01V. I've been doing it for a year and it works perfectly on a 24s3p pack.

It would simplify my setup greatly if I was able to tap into three places of my pack instead of disconnecting it. I have isolated supplies. In this setup, one lead would be shared between chargers: the middle break between 20S. Is there a short circuit doing this? I do not see how there could be. The balance connectors also share the same thing.

 

[El_Steak]

It would simplify my setup greatly if I was able to tap into three places of my pack instead of disconnecting it. I have isolated supplies. In this setup, one lead would be shared between chargers: the middle break between 20S. Is there a short circuit doing this? I do not see how there could be. The balance connectors also share the same thing.

If I read this correctly, its the same way as mine so no short.

Your pack stays in 20s at all time and can remain connected to the controller at all time.
You have 2 x 1420i chargers, each connected to its own separate power supply

You have 5 connection points coming out of your pack:

1- Main discharger lead that covers all 20 cells (74V) - connected to the controller
2- Charge Lead for the first half of the pack (cells 1 to 10 - reads 37V nominal ) - connected to (+) (-) of charger 1
3- Balance leads for the first half of the pack (cells 1 to 10) - connected to balance port of charger 1
4- Charge Lead for the second half of the pack (cells 11 to 20 - reads 37V nominal ) - connected to (+) (-) of charger 2
5- Balance leads for the second half of the pack (cells 11 to 20) - connected to balance port of charger 2

As I and others did, you can also reduce the number of connections by combining the charge leads and balance leads for each half of the pack in a bigger connector (DB25 or the ones from Gary). Then you end up with only one connector for each charger and the main discharge connector for the controller.

 

[hillzofvalp]

Sorry for not getting to the real question. What you have described is what I have done already.. I have no problem doing this. My question is can I leave the mid-pack connected... In other words only 3 main charge leads are going to chargersinstead of 4 ---AND (key point) still use the network cable?

I figure yes, cause its probably just data transfer... But there are two swapped red and black pins.. Not sure what's going on there.


Note to those who want to use a pre-wired db25 serial cable: don't be an idiotsnd wire the bare ground wie thats secretly grounded to the metal profile of the connector,,,, or u will end up with a nice white streak on your hand and a heightened heart rate

 

[El_Steak]

Sorry for not getting to the real question. What you have described is what I have done already.. I have no problem doing this. My question is can I leave the mid-pack connected... In other words only 3 main charge leads are going to chargersinstead of 4

Yes, the "mid-pack" serial link stays connected and you can tap it. It will become your negative charger lead for charger 1 and your positive for charger 2, thus only 3 wires leave the pack to go to the chargers (you still have to split it with a "Y" at the chargers though (both chargers need a (+) and (-)).

---AND (key point) still use the network cable?
I figure yes, cause its probably just data transfer... But there are two swapped red and black pins.. Not sure what's going on there.

I asked that question earlier in this thread:

El_Steak wrote:
- Should you connect the "sync" networking cable between the 2 chargers this would create a short ?

Yes, magic smoke will be forthcoming.

So no, don't connect the network sync cable.

 

[Allex]

Is it normal that I can only charge with ~8Amps on my 1420i?
Lipo is a Turnigy 10S 5Ah
PSU is 18V@540W

If i split the pack to 5S then the charger ramps up to 19Amps charge current.
So, Im guessing that my problem is that I only have 18V in my PSU?

 

[hillzofvalp]

Thanks for repeating previous posts for me. Glad I didn't screw that one up?

Yeah it's probably a psu limitation... But I think that hyperions setting for max current is over shot.. I think they normally leave a little window so that people aren't running their psu at 100% all the time. Raising this say .5-1A and comparing charge current will tell u if your charger is voltage or current limited ATM. But u will need 24V to get around 16A

 

[fractal]

Hey guys! I'm in the process of building a 24s 3p pack. After reading a ton of info on charging solutions, I decided to do exactly what my buddy El_Steak does : Charge in series with 2 1420i's and 2 power supplies. To make sure I fully understand the concept of charging in series, I made a diagram to simplify things a bit. I incorporated my Method's LVC boards, a pre charge resistor, and everything I need for my setup. The beauty of it is you don't have to reconfigure the pack to charge. That means no dumb mistakes! This diagram has helped me a lot and I hope it can help the next guy.

 

[hillzofvalp]

I don't understand how you can leave a precharge resistor in parallel to the main lead... because upon connect the current will bypass the resistor. do you have a switch?

 

[fractal]

I don't understand how you can leave a precharge resistor in parallel to the main lead... because upon connect the current will bypass the resistor. do you have a switch?

There is another connector on the main wire. Plug the precharge first then the main.

 

[hillzofvalp]

oh I see. I didn't see that in your diagram.

 

[Allex]

If I only need to balance the cells out, can I do it on the 1420i without plugging in the main wires?
Guess I will need to set the C rating to low, or does it have a special menu for that?

 

[hillzofvalp]

sometimes at least one charger will bark at me if I do balance connectors only. It usually happens when you first power them up and plug them in..

you can't set the balance current I don't think. It goes up to like .5-1A.. can't remember.

 

[cwah]

I'm looking for the most silent charger. Any idea which one between the Hyperion and the iCharger the less noisy? And potentially which power supply is also the less noisy?

 

[neptronix]

run them at about 1/3rd - 1/4th their power level and they should be pretty quiet as the fan may never go on.. this applies to the iCharger.. i don't know about the hyperion if it has automatic fan control or not..

 

[Ziggurat]

The hyperion is similar in that the fan doesn't run unless needed. But if pushing a lot of power through it gets pretty loud. Louder than my old iCharger 1010b+ if I recall correctly.

 

[hillzofvalp]

U can use Xbox 203W power supplies for sealed, quieter charging

 

[Allex]

Yeah the 1420 is damn noisy, Speed of the fans depends on the load of course
My 540W PSU from hobbyking is even noisier than the charger
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/%5F%5F17755%5F%5FHobbyKing%5F540w%5F220%5F240v%5FPower%5FSupply%5F13%5F8v%5F18v%5F30amp%5F.html

I had to open the PSU and add potentiometers for the 2 fans in there, pretty quiet now, will probably mod the charger also.

 

[mr.electric]

There is another connector on the main wire. Plug the precharge first then the main.

Have you investigated a good quality multi pin plug to connect and disconnect all the balance leads and main leads in one fell swoop?
Like a molex or similar. I am going to make a single plug for my 12s packs to my 1401.

 

[fractal]

There is another connector on the main wire. Plug the precharge first then the main.

Have you investigated a good quality multi pin plug to connect and disconnect all the balance leads and main leads in one fell swoop?
Like a molex or similar. I am going to make a single plug for my 12s packs to my 1401.

Yes, i'm looking at that right now. I'll probably use a db25 connector like El_Steak's set-up.

 

[mr.electric]

Yes, i'm looking at that right now. I'll probably use a db25 connector like El_Steak's set-up.

Yes that is the most easily available connector. I really like the deutsch connectors but I don't want to spend $40- for a single plug set.

 

[kfong]

That's the route I'm going. Even made a board so I can wire it up easier. Made the board to match up with the Hyperion. Use one for the bike and one for the charger. Connect a DB25 cable in between. Then all you need to do is get extension cables from places like this. http://www.epbuddy.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=26_35&zenid=vsilup151igrumi8k4rqbhfre0. I've made extras for those who want them. You can even network two hyperions for a total of 21S.

I plan to balance charge during every charge since my batteries will be mounted permanently in the frame. I really needed to adress any safety issues with RC lipos and balance charging was the only way I felt safe charging Lipos. The Hyperion will keep me informed if there is a bad bank and if the balance connector gets unplugged or if there is a loose wire the charger will halt the charge process. The DB25 can handle lots of connect and disconnects. The current needed for balancing is small. If your packs are healthy and kept balanced then using a balance charge shouldn't take much more time than bulk charging. I won't bulk charge lipo's, too many mistakes and fires from early days of RC's when they were charged with chargers without balance taps. The industry had to address the problem with safer chargers. That is why you see only balance chargers used in the RC hobby and I think the hyperion is one of the best for our ebike use.

If you keep your cutoff so you never get close to full discharge then all you need is a low cutoff switch or Cycle Analyst for a complete system. No on board BMS would be required. If something does go wrong, then that will be indicated by the hyperion during the next balance charge cycle. Less wiring and complication to deal with.

 

[hillzofvalp]

free samples from molex.. modular 60A main power terminals.. see my latest thread post for how I will implement. U can see the DB-25 inside.. which I used to use. You can get old serial cables with 24 or 26AWG.. sufficient for hyperion balance current.. as long as you keep leads equal you should be good. Nice thing about it is that the wires are all individually colored.. so it's easier to match everything up and switch stuff around when you need to. A must if you shrink packs like I do..

 

[keysersoze310]

Can I charge two batteries in series on the same balance board with this charger?

For example, lets say I have two 4S batteries and two 3S batteries. First I connect the power cables in series to make 7s. Then I take the 5-pin and 4-pin balance cables and connect them to make an 8 pin balance cable - the last pin of the 5-pin connector in series with the first pin of the 4-pin connector. This should then be fine to connect to a single hyperion balance board and charge, right?