i have given up on gear drive motor

[mvly]

Going through 2 clutches, 1 motor and a BMC controller fault. I am officially done with geared motor.

Total miles: 3145
Total cost: $250 + $800= 1050. This only count the broken parts.

So 3 miles per dollar? Haha. I'm out!

Leta hope the direct drive is not as bad.
Total miles: 1246
Total cost: $700

Almost 2 miles per dollar and a lot more fun!

Also one final question. Have anyone have problems with lyen controller on BMC/MAC motor and if they have jerky response?

 

[neptronix]

I understand the frustration. Dealing with a BMC ( $$$ ) and BMC parts ( $$$ ) does not help.
That is why i went with the MAC. Both motors fail the same.. one is just a lot more expensive than the other

Lyen controllers are not optimized for BMC and MAC motors, and most definitely contribute to a clutch's early demise by slamming spikes of torque into it every time power is applied, acting more like an on/off switch, and jittering at partial throttle, etc.. I have dealt with the jerky controller problem. It was an early cell_man unit that is close to, if not identical to Lyen controllers.

The newer cell_man controllers ( eb3, with modifications ) released in the middle of 2011 cure this problem 100%.

Going through 2 clutches, 1 motor and a BMC controller fault. I am officially done with geared motor.

Total miles: 3145
Total cost: $250 + $800= 1050. This only count the broken parts.

So 3 miles per dollar? Haha. I'm out!

Leta hope the direct drive is not as bad.
Total miles: 1246
Total cost: $700

Almost 2 miles per dollar and a lot more fun!

Also one final question. Have anyone have problems with lyen controller on BMC/MAC motor and if they have jerky response?

 

[veloman]

I have 3000 miles on Mac motor and cellman eb312 controller. The gears look brand new and the clutch seems perfect. I have my system limited to 1200watts and I am very happy with it.

Gear motors are awesome IMO, unless you want to throw multi kw into them, which you don't need for most commuting.

 

[dogman dan]

Well, running an inappropriate winding of dd motor for your battery and controller can be equally expensive or just merely unsatisfying.

Nice thing about the gearmotors is you can run a taller winding at moderate wattage with less penalty.

 

[biohazardman]

Ha, another e-bike rider that could drive a car for less. ;^) I have spent my share on the E-bikes in the last three or so years 6K+ but not nearly as expensive per mile as you. I killed my BMC controller riding the V2s up a half mile long steep hill towing a trailer and not pedaling just to see if it could do it. Have to say that was my fault. Installed a Lyen V1 controller, found out later it was not the right one, and just had to help by pedaling up to speed or it would loose synch. Rode it that way for 3K+ with no problems. Talked with Lyen about it a year and a half after I bought the controller and he offered to replace it for twenty dollars and the original controller. Some kind of service. I just bought a new one instead and kept the old thinking to use it elsewhere. Since I really have no need to go 40+ MPH I replaced the V2s with the nice new V2T on that I had sitting around just in case I needed it. With the new controller and motor I have a problem with the bike surging while accelerating but it does not loose synch. I will not blame the controller as yet cuz I need to check my wiring and throttle first.

 

[chilledoutuk]

The simplicity of direct drive hubs does limit the damage throttle jammers can do.

Its good to hear that cellmans controllers have a softer start to protect the gears which is important tbh.

Honestly though with Direct drive motors as long as you keep the amps reasonable and keep an eye on temperatures the only thing to maintain would be the bearings.

Obviously water is a major problem for all hub motors if you don't have a vent for it to get it out somehow.

Maybe a high turn 9c on like 72v would be a good compromise giving good hill climbing ability.

 

[kriskros]

i have had two gear drives.... a bfang and a puma...over 3000 miles combined..only problemwas cused by loose rear wheel nut[my fault] ripped out the wires... have had two Lyen controllers..NO problems with either

 

[cwah]

I understand the frustration. Dealing with a BMC ( $$$ ) and BMC parts ( $$$ ) does not help.
That is why i went with the MAC. Both motors fail the same.. one is just a lot more expensive than the other

Lyen controllers are not optimized for BMC and MAC motors, and most definitely contribute to a clutch's early demise by slamming spikes of torque into it every time power is applied, acting more like an on/off switch, and jittering at partial throttle, etc.. I have dealt with the jerky controller problem. It was an early cell_man unit that is close to, if not identical to Lyen controllers.

The newer cell_man controllers ( eb3, with modifications ) released in the middle of 2011 cure this problem 100%.

Going through 2 clutches, 1 motor and a BMC controller fault. I am officially done with geared motor.

Total miles: 3145
Total cost: $250 + $800= 1050. This only count the broken parts.

So 3 miles per dollar? Haha. I'm out!

Leta hope the direct drive is not as bad.
Total miles: 1246
Total cost: $700

Almost 2 miles per dollar and a lot more fun!

Also one final question. Have anyone have problems with lyen controller on BMC/MAC motor and if they have jerky response?

I already blew 1 lyen controller on a Conhismotor direct drive motor. Are the one from cell_man better now?

 

[neptronix]

Oh sure, but how did you blow yours? heat? phae short, or what?

The new cell_man controllers are super smooth. Do they handle more power or last longer? i don't know. But i have 3 of them and they are all working fine for me.

the pre mid 2011 cell_man controller exhibited the same issues as reported with Lyen controllers on my MAC. It has been collecting dust for a while now. Works fine on a DD but forget it for a big geared motor.

 

[cwah]

I don't know how it blew. I just used the controller for 60s and 1 fet blew.

Maybe too much amps, but the controller should restrict that.

 

[neptronix]

How many amps?
How many volts?

Blowing controllers in 60 seconds is a bit odd.

There have been a few lyen controllers going lately. I wonder if there is a problem in the supply chain somewhere.

 

[cwah]

Yeah, I've also read several thread with blowed controller from Lyen..

I was at 80V and very low amps, around 7 amps something like that..

 

[knoxie]

Crikey If I gave up on this hobby having only damaged so few parts I wouldnt have been here so long :lol: its all part of it I am afraid, when most folks are using this kit well past is specified limits it has to be expected, Oh and dont be kidded by the higher power rating some youtubers and ebay sellers state, these motors are great though If you get the right controller and treat them right. I have always used the V1 xlyte analogue controller, it has a superb soft start on it so combine with some gentle throttle use you can have years of life at 1.6 to 2KW.

 

[neptronix]

That's just it. The people with crystalyte analog controllers never had any problems with blowing clutches from what i read. It is due to the slow and smooth engagement of power. Not the torque slam and on/off switch throttle effect that occurs on all EB2 infineon controllers with these motors.

My MAC clutch has somehow lived through 4kW, and 2.6kW regular usage now. The only reason i have to explain it is the upgrade to the cellman EB3.

Of course he is apparently out of stock of them now :|

 

[Philistine]

I don't understand why everyone says they have problems with Lyen controllers on BMCs. I have been running my BMC V3 on a 12 Fet Lyen controller (EB2) on 12S @ 40amps for over a year and it is sweet as (just opened up the motor the other day and the gears are virginal). Runs exactly the same as it did on my BMC controller (which failed). It is true that my BMC had a "soft start" jumper lead, which meant that you could have a delayed takeoff if you wanted, but I hardly notice the difference.

I have never had a single Lyen controller fail for any reason other than my own negligence and stupidity, and I have owned or supplied to friends over 5 x 12 Fet controllers, 2 x 24 Fet Controllers, 1 x 18 Fet controller, and 2 x Sensorless 12 Fet controllers. Nothing but the most awesome performance and perfect after sales care and assistance from Lyen.

 

[mvly]

I don't understand why everyone says they have problems with Lyen controllers on BMCs. I have been running my BMC V3 on a 12 Fet Lyen controller (EB2) on 12S @ 40amps for over a year and it is sweet as (just opened up the motor the other day and the gears are virginal). Runs exactly the same as it did on my BMC controller (which failed). It is true that my BMC had a "soft start" jumper lead, which meant that you could have a delayed takeoff if you wanted, but I hardly notice the difference.

I have never had a single Lyen controller fail for any reason other than my own negligence and stupidity, and I have owned or supplied to friends over 5 x 12 Fet controllers, 2 x 24 Fet Controllers, 1 x 18 Fet controller, and 2 x Sensorless 12 Fet controllers. Nothing but the most awesome performance and perfect after sales care and assistance from Lyen.

Yeah you must have gotten lucky or something. Gears are not the problem. It is the clutch itself. I think I have 2 clutch that does not rotate freely anymore. I. E. It is locked. Rotating it backward or forward induce resistance. Any suggestions on how to free them? Just FyI, the gears are still perfect.

 

[kevo]

Neptronix wrote: My MAC clutch has somehow lived through 4kW, and 2.6kW regular usage now. The only reason i have to explain it is the upgrade to the cellman EB3.

Good information, will be on the waiting list for cellman's EB3. Have gone through easily half a dozen controllers (some broken, some incompatible, some just wanted more power). Despite the many ESers who want wheelie starts, I think the soft starts especially on hills is the key to low failure rates. The smarter programmables and V3 Cycle Analyst allow loaning the bike w/o fear of abuse from others. The gear drive (like any other choice) has its boundaries. Stay w/i them or not too long outside them and you will not be disappointed.

 

[tofuuu]

500km on my 350w mac now and its still running well. Time will tell though but it hasnt failed me yet.