I'm reading about too many controller failures

[eP]

I didn't mind the BionX system I tried. For a pedal assist, low power bolt on kit it does the job. Not my cup of tea, but at least BionX has products on the market instead of a lot of talk.

They are on the market 'cos on the market there are guys which dont want talk, read and even think.
They want spend their money as fast as possible and get the logo.

The same story was 20 years ago on the PC market ( Advanced designed computers for professionals ).

 

[Lowell]

I didn't mind the BionX system I tried. For a pedal assist, low power bolt on kit it does the job. Not my cup of tea, but at least BionX has products on the market instead of a lot of talk.

They are on the market 'cos on the market there are guys which dont want talk, read and even think.
They want spend their money as fast as possible and get the logo.

The same story was 20 years ago on the PC market ( Advanced designed computers for professionals ).

Sounds like BionX has done things right then. Companies with the best product don't always win out. I remember waay back my cousin would always talk about how great Betamax was compared to VHS... :lol:

 

[eP]

Sounds like BionX has done things right then. Companies with the best product don't always win out. I remember waay back my cousin would always talk about how great Betamax was compared to VHS... :lol:

A lof of companies have done good products. But it is no reason to waste your money if you can get the same thing for 1/10 price - if you are smart enough.

 

[Lowell]

Sounds like BionX has done things right then. Companies with the best product don't always win out. I remember waay back my cousin would always talk about how great Betamax was compared to VHS... :lol:

A lof of companies have done good products. But it is no reason to waste your money if you can get the same thing for 1/10 price - if you are smart enough.

Build a BionX like kit for 1/10 the price and I will buy them off you.

 

[eP]

Build a BionX like kit for 1/10 the price and I will buy them off you.

You will not i'm sure.
As my kit will not be the off the shelf kit as you want.
If you like experimental kits why you are not going to do experimental 10 kW motor ?
Almost all you need to do it you can get off the shelf: strong magnets, bearings, copper wire - even theory: which way it should work well is ready and waiting for you.

I don't have my hobby budget as much as you have. So i'm looking for people which want to try what i cannot afford it.

 

[knoxie]

This double deck circuit board has 4 times the components as a Chineese ebike controller for a good reason.It weighs only 8 ounes and is a 3" square package. It has a 27 amp limiter and will run from 18 to 80 volts. I put over 20.000 miles on one like this without a single failure.Including going up a 10,005 ft high Volcano several times powering a ebike with 300 lbs of gross weight.All the components are Mill Spec. The orriginal design is used in F-18 Fighters where any failure is NOT exceptable. They would cost less than half of the price than I can buy a Crystalyte controller for IF a few hundred were made. If indeed there is a market for quality, smooth, long lasting, efficient, BLDC controllers that have no problem handeling 1600 watts of power why do people insist on Chineese junk ? Is there no dealer that can figure this out? :lol:

I totally agree with you on this point Randy, some of the Chinese controllers and hub motors are piss poor in quality, but they are cheap however the controller issue is one that does need addressing, whats the spec on your controller it sounds interesting, can you post pictures and maybe details of where we could get one from? price and availability, I vaguely remember seeing a picture of it on v is for virus.

Cheers

Knoxie

Unfortunatly great controllers need costom design work and need to be made in volume to get a great price.FYI the Programable Sevcon controllers with regen are rated at 5 kw and will provide a great response for testing many BLDC motors at $500. a pop. But doubt that they will ever POP! and they ARE available 1 at a time.IMO these would be the ones to use if you do want QUALITY and LONGEVITY . It takes much more than high quality fets.It takes ADVANCED DESIGN WORK!!!
Bionix whimpy controllers cost $1000. Go FIGURE ! ???

So what are you using then Randy? I still dont know can you post some pictures? its all very well letting us know how shit the Chinese stuff is so if you could that would be great, I can pay 500 bucks for a controller its not a problem at all, so if you can post some pictures of yours and specs, ill go get the same one? Im getting the feeling Randy that you like telling everyone how shit their stuff is but you really actually dont want us all riding around on rigs like yours as you wont feel unique anymore :lol: cmon Randy show us what you got and where you got it from, ill go get one then we can be in a club!!

 

[EbikeMaui]

This double deck circuit board has 4 times the components as a Chineese ebike controller for a good reason.It weighs only 8 ounes and is a 3" square package. It has a 27 amp limiter and will run from 18 to 80 volts. I put over 20.000 miles on one like this without a single failure.Including going up a 10,005 ft high Volcano several times powering a ebike with 300 lbs of gross weight.All the components are Mill Spec. The orriginal design is used in F-18 Fighters where any failure is NOT exceptable. They would cost less than half of the price than I can buy a Crystalyte controller for IF a few hundred were made. If indeed there is a market for quality, smooth, long lasting, efficient, BLDC controllers that have no problem handeling 1600 watts of power why do people insist on Chineese junk ? Is there no dealer that can figure this out? :lol:

My recources are my recources. Go find your own.

I totally agree with you on this point Randy, some of the Chinese controllers and hub motors are piss poor in quality, but they are cheap however the controller issue is one that does need addressing, whats the spec on your controller it sounds interesting, can you post pictures and maybe details of where we could get one from? price and availability, I vaguely remember seeing a picture of it on v is for virus.

Cheers

Knoxie

Unfortunatly great controllers need costom design work and need to be made in volume to get a great price.FYI the Programable Sevcon controllers with regen are rated at 5 kw and will provide a great response for testing many BLDC motors at $500. a pop. But doubt that they will ever POP! and they ARE available 1 at a time.IMO these would be the ones to use if you do want QUALITY and LONGEVITY . It takes much more than high quality fets.It takes ADVANCED DESIGN WORK!!!
Bionix whimpy controllers cost $1000. Go FIGURE ! ???

So what are you using then Randy? I still dont know can you post some pictures? its all very well letting us know how shit the Chinese stuff is so if you could that would be great, I can pay 500 bucks for a controller its not a problem at all, so if you can post some pictures of yours and specs, ill go get the same one? Im getting the feeling Randy that you like telling everyone how shit their stuff is but you really actually dont want us all riding around on rigs like yours as you wont feel unique anymore :lol: cmon Randy show us what you got and where you got it from, ill go get one then we can be in a club!!

 

[EbikeMaui]

This double deck circuit board has 4 times the components as a Chineese ebike controller for a good reason.It weighs only 8 ounes and is a 3" square package. It has a 27 amp limiter and will run from 18 to 80 volts. I put over 20.000 miles on one like this without a single failure.Including going up a 10,005 ft high Volcano several times powering a ebike with 300 lbs of gross weight.All the components are Mill Spec. The orriginal design is used in F-18 Fighters where any failure is NOT exceptable. They would cost less than half of the price than I can buy a Crystalyte controller for IF a few hundred were made. If indeed there is a market for quality, smooth, long lasting, efficient, BLDC controllers that have no problem handeling 1600 watts of power why do people insist on Chineese junk ? Is there no dealer that can figure this out? :lol:

I totally agree with you on this point Randy, some of the Chinese controllers and hub motors are piss poor in quality, but they are cheap however the controller issue is one that does need addressing, whats the spec on your controller it sounds interesting, can you post pictures and maybe details of where we could get one from? price and availability, I vaguely remember seeing a picture of it on v is for virus.

Cheers

Knoxie

Unfortunatly great controllers need costom design work and need to be made in volume to get a great price.FYI the Programable Sevcon controllers with regen are rated at 5 kw and will provide a great response for testing many BLDC motors at $500. a pop. But doubt that they will ever POP! and they ARE available 1 at a time.IMO these would be the ones to use if you do want QUALITY and LONGEVITY . It takes much more than high quality fets.It takes ADVANCED DESIGN WORK!!!
Bionix whimpy controllers cost $1000. Go FIGURE ! ???

So what are you using then Randy? I still dont know can you post some pictures? its all very well letting us know how shit the Chinese stuff is so if you could that would be great, I can pay 500 bucks for a controller its not a problem at all, so if you can post some pictures of yours and specs, ill go get the same one? Im getting the feeling Randy that you like telling everyone how shit their stuff is but you really actually dont want us all riding around on rigs like yours as you wont feel unique anymore :lol: cmon Randy show us what you got and where you got it from, ill go get one then we can be in a club!!

My recources are just that. You can do YOUR OWN homeWork.I only tell you what is possiable From my own testing.!

 

[eP]

[ I can pay 500 bucks for a controller its not a problem at all, so if you can post some pictures of yours and specs, ill go get the same one?

If you could spend 500 for a controller, so you could get all the project: soft and hardware from a Rent a Coder site i suppose.
So after that you could produce and sell own brand controllers.

 

[EbikeMaui]

[ I can pay 500 bucks for a controller its not a problem at all, so if you can post some pictures of yours and specs, ill go get the same one?

If you could spend 500 for a controller, so you could get all the project: soft and hardware from a Rent a Coder site i suppose.
So after that you could produce and sell own brand controllers.

$500.
It is the Sevcon PMAC Milipak. It is rated for 200 Amps continous with a bust of 250 Amps for accelleration. It is fully programmable and allows regerative braking.

 

[TylerDurden]

wow.... controller porn.....


:lol:

 

[knoxie]

Thanks Randy

Thats all I wanted to know that wasnt so bad was it, now all I need is a big old sprocket a geared hub a bit of chain and we are sorted, there can be 2 volcano beaters, I have a choice of 20 motors I can fit to the rig and shit loads of Lipo batteries, happy days!

Knoxie :wink:

 

[EbikeMaui]

Thanks Randy

Thats all I wanted to know that wasnt so bad was it, now all I need is a big old sprocket a geared hub a bit of chain and we are sorted, there can be 2 volcano beaters, I have a choice of 20 motors I can fit to the rig and shit loads of Lipo batteries, happy days!

Knoxie :wink:

Thats the Sprit. I want to see YOU guys to figure out how to find the most cost effictive parts to make a single system that fits ALL legal requirements and ebike riders needs at a price below $1000. including a decent 26" suspensoin MTB NOT including batteries.
P.S. only poorly designd or over powered motors or controllers whine or grumble.SMOOTH everything without any heat doing all tasks is a great sign of efficiency. I'm suprised that you never heard of Sevcon. Aren't they right under your nose in the UK ? I bet you could get a good deal of ten of them ?

 

[fechter]

Yes, Sevcon knows how to make a decent controller.

48V max, though,

and 300A might be overkill for a Xlyte motor (hmmm.... maybe not).

The trapezoidal or sinusoidal waveform will get rid of most of the noise you hear with a Crystalyte controller, which is just a square wave.

There's no reason the front end on something like a Xlyte controller couldn't be programmable with a trapezoidal output waveform (hell, sensorless for that matter). The front end stuff is not that expensive.

 

[EbikeMaui]

Yes, Sevcon knows how to make a decent controller.

48V max, though,

and 300A might be overkill for a Xlyte motor (hmmm.... maybe not).

The trapezoidal or sinusoidal waveform will get rid of most of the noise you hear with a Crystalyte controller, which is just a square wave.

There's no reason the front end on something like a Xlyte controller couldn't be programmable with a trapezoidal output waveform (hell, sensorless for that matter). The front end stuff is not that expensive.

If this controller also works on sensorless back emf sensing you can use ANY auto alternator amd have adjustable field controlles just by adding a small brushed scooter controller tho the rotor field instead of magnets or even add a few small magnets to the rotor and still incorperate field strenthening for high torque when needed or let the magnets run it at high rpm (Field weakening) If you need hall sensors how hard is it to add three 75 cent sensors ? or a encoder to the shaft? Auto alternators at junk yards are usually in a large pile that build up fast and can be baught for 5 bucks or even free.1000s of them are barried in the landfill each year just on this island.Now with a $500. controller ANYONE can make a ebike motor for the cost or a $30. scooter controller or 12 small magnets embed into the rotor with a drill and epoxy.Very simple for a DYIer if they have instructions.
Or put a brake drum and a tire on this 5 kw Disc Motors shaft. With 100 ft lb of torque and 89% efficient at 5 kw it would be hard to beat at a price of $350.This motor weighs the same as hub motors rated at 10 times less power that usually operate at 10 to 20% less in efficiency.Go figure anyone would pay hundreds of $ more for a multispeed or a hub motor with low power. LOL