MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

[sacko]

19" is slightly smaller than a 24" bicycle setup.

I'll measure up my 19" and 26" this eve.

 

[teslanv]

How to determine a moped tire size actual diameter:
The "size" (17", 18", 19", etc) is the diameter of the seat of the rim and the inside diameter of the tire itself. The height of the tire is its thickness. So add twice the tire thickness to the stated diameter of the tire and you get your outside diameter.
Example: my tires are 17 x2.25 so 17" + (2 x 2.25) = 21.5" outside diameter. If you change to a 17x2.75 tire size the outside diameter is 22.5"
Biclce tires are sized approximately to the OD of the tire, so a 26" tire has an OD of approximately 26"
The bottom bracket height will change by the difference in the radius of the tire, so going from a 26" bicycle tire to a 21.5" moped tire will drop your BB by 2 .25", unless you change the geometry of your bike frame, which is what the second wishbone connection point on my Farfle swing arm does.

 

[Rix]

I know this has been covered so I admit to being lazy on this one. With a 17" rim, and various tires mentioned here, what is the overall height difference between them and a regular 26" wheel with a typically oversized tire? Also, do many encounter experience clearance issues going with a 17" moto setup or is clearance similar to the 26"?

For at least the rear wheel, this question is one that needs to get answered in the first set during the initial build up of the "Assault". When ordering the MXUS, I know need to know how the check the box on laced and mounted rim choice.

Thanks

Depends on the tire, if you are running a big 17MC tire such as the 3.00-17 SR241 or 244, you are looking at 23-23.4 inches vs a 26MTB tire running a 2.35x 26 mtb tire which comes out to around 26.5 inches or so. As far as width go, if you run a big tire on a 17mc rim such as the sr241, figure needing about 3.5 inches of clearance. You can run smaller 17mc tires, I have seen 2.25x17 MC tires that OD out at 22", but they would look a little corny with a 26mtb on the front, even a 24mtb.

 

[markz]

How to determine a moped tire size actual diameter:
The "size" (17", 18", 19", etc) is the diameter of the seat of the rim and the inside diameter of the tire itself. The height of the tire is its thickness. So add twice the tire thickness to the stated diameter of the tire and you get your outside diameter.
Example: my tires are 17 x2.25 so 17" + (2 x 2.25) = 21.5" outside diameter. If you change to a 17x2.75 tire size the outside diameter is 22.5"
Biclce tires are sized approximately to the OD of the tire, so a 26" tire has an OD of approximately 26"
The bottom bracket height will change by the difference in the radius of the tire, so going from a 26" bicycle tire to a 21.5" moped tire will drop your BB by 2 .25", unless you change the geometry of your bike frame, which is what the second wishbone connection point on my Farfle swing arm does.

I was very tempted to first go with a moto rim, and tire combo. With so much good points on the matter, besides the extra weight, I am willing to try it next especially on this motor. And on the various points the John in CR mentioned in other posts as well, when you go smaller wheel, extra torque etc. its probably best for hillier terrain to keep everything cool. I think its really a matter of personal expirience and what you really want. Since I have ZERO personal expirience in this matter I go by what other expirienced people have to say.

So for the $60 I spent on a Downhill Rim, or $100 for a moto rim, on a what seems like a $2000 build, probably more like a cool g-note. The extra 40 bills is nothing really. I think the key is having a steel frame with good torque arms, but full suspension is nice too, I have never seen a quality steel bike let alone quality steel bike thats FS. But what people say here theres a lot of give in those moto rims so it acts like its own suspension. That peeks my interest right there alone to go moto.

 

[madin88]

But what people say here theres a lot of give in those moto rims so it acts like its own suspension. That peeks my interest right there alone to go moto.

i don't would say the rubber itself does act much like its own suspension. maybe if you compare different rubber compunds for hot and cold climate than yes the softer winter tire has more suspension, but in general there is not much difference to bicycle tires.
much more important is air pressure which is IMO the only thing that really helps to keep a heavy bicycle wheel on the ground (in bumpy corners as example where its essential).
on my bike its VERY noticeable going from 2bar to 1.5b, but efficiency probably will decrease.
also big wheel mass is not good for efficiency. I remember an ES member went from 26" bicycle to 19" moped and noticed much higher consumption.

generally you always have to make compromises. i personally look at the weight of the hub motor and than choose the rim and tires. below 8kg i use bicycle stuff which leads to a lightweight and high efficient bike. above 8kg its better to use moped stuff which gives me the durability i want to have there.

 

[windtrader]

generally you always have to make compromises. i personally look at the weight of the hub motor and than choose the rim and tires. below 8kg i use bicycle stuff which leads to a lightweight and high efficient bike. above 8kg its better to use moped stuff which gives me the durability i want to have there.

It seems a heavy hub motor would influence doing a MC seup but I was more thinking that speed, safety, ad reliability were key factors too. If you're not going over 30mpg regularly, bike stuff seems a good call. It is not clear where that next break in speed is when you feel no worries something is going to blow making for one nasty high speed fall. On the other hand the additional weight is not trivial and carries performance hits. Finding the right balance point seems a bit elusive unless I'm overthinking it.

 

[GiantEV]

Been away from forum for over a month now, so I am trying to catch up on several threads without reading it all. Pls bear with me if these Q's been asked before.

Has anyone tested the mxus 3000 motor by now? Pls share some real life numbers of top speed, how well motor works regarding heat etc.
What kind of power can be expected from a 20s setup? Anyone gone crazy 32s with the mxus 3000?

What sine wave controllers would be a great match to the mxus 3000?

See my build thread. I'm running 20s on a 16" rim and am getting 45mph average speeds full throttle. I'm also running a 3T motor.

 

[teslanv]

On 17" MMP rims and 21.5" Diameter tires, 3T Winding I am getting 45MPH on 20S and 50 MPH on 22S with the MXUS Sine Wave 12FET 4110 controller. Stock phase wires on all.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=66978

 

[macribs]

On 17" MMP rims and 21.5" Diameter tires, 3T Winding I am getting 45MPH on 20S and 50 MPH on 22S with the MXUS Sine Wave 12FET 4110 controller. Stock phase wires on all.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=66978

All things the same, do yo think the outcome would change if you switched controller to Adaptto?
I mean would an adaptto controller change the outcome or "drive-ability" in any way?

 

[teslanv]

On 17" MMP rims and 21.5" Diameter tires, 3T Winding I am getting 45MPH on 20S and 50 MPH on 22S with the MXUS Sine Wave 12FET 4110 controller. Stock phase wires on all.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=66978

All things the same, do yo think the outcome would change if you switched controller to Adaptto?
I mean would an adaptto controller change the outcome or "drive-ability" in any way?

My best guess is that the performance would improve with an Adaptto, although I admit I have no basis for comparison. I have never used an adaptto. - However I believe that is what e4bike uses.

[youtube]tlCOdz6Wb-4[/youtube]

 

[macribs]

My best guess is that the performance would improve with an Adaptto, although I admit I have no basis for comparison. I have never used an adaptto. - However I believe that is what e4bike uses.

Hmm. Seen this video before, and if memory is correct they used a motor called GT 4000.
I don't know other then it was said it had more then 7kw output. Is that on par with mxus 3000 or higher output in the GT 4000?
With different motor it is hard to get any consistency as both motor and controller is changed.

Maybe someone with a hawk eye can spot what kind of motor is on the bike in the video?

 

[markz]

OK, gents. Here's the low-down.

Justin says that he can get by with just one motor of each winding for testing.

I will cover the cost of 16X4T Winding.

I set up a gofundme page for three additional windings, which would be the 21X3T, 12X5T and the 10X6T windings. I am hoping to raise $750 total ($250 per motor)

If you want to see the MXUS XF40-45H motors added to the Simulator, please make a small donation. I only need 30 people to donate $25 and we are good.

I will add these motors to our first order from MXUS, and Justin says that he should have time to test them by Spring.

Here is the Gofundme page:

http://www.gofundme.com/lcaew0

Thanks for your help.

Barent Hoffman (teslanv)

So why does he ideally need 2 motors of each?
What parameters are needed after toasting the first one.
Or what parameters will be missing with just one motor?

 

[teslanv]

Justin only needs one motor of each winding. He says he no longer needs to destroy a motor to find its thermal limits. He does want to keep them for subsequent testing, though.

 

[neptronix]

GT4000 Looks like a cromotor, looks like it performs like a cromotor.. 50mm stator 9C/9C clone with thin lams.. yup.

Performance of the MXUS 45mm 3000w motor is gonna be fairly close. Within 90% of a cromotor would be an educated guess.

 

[Allex]

If you change the resolution of the video you can clearly see that they have mxus3k motor. They Also mention this in the video, that they use minicro.
Test controller is Adaptto Max.

 

[macribs]

If you change the resolution of the video you can clearly see that they have mxus3k motor. They Also mention this in the video, that they use minicro.
Test controller is Adaptto Max.

Wow. 109.5 km/h. Mxus 3000 + Adaptto.
Is that a 17" rear wheel? And are they using the 3T version?

For the look of it I think 18" rear wheel would look stunning. What do you think, will motor over heat much easier on 18" rather then 17"?
What about acceleration? Will 18" be noticeable slower in acceleration then 17" rear wheel?

 

[Allex]

Yes very clean!
RIbs, it was V1 in the video.
It will be noticeable but the dif. is not that big.
It all depends on how you want to ride it. Fast acceleration and if you are heavy rider I would go with as small as possible.
I'm only 60kg and the bike can overheat in no time, all depends on how you ride. I hate those hub motors, damn ineffective in offroad...

 

[John in CR]

I can verify that the 3T in a 17" Moped Rim with 17X2.25" (21.5" DIAM) tires is a smoking hot thrill ride.

Good to hear you finally got to test the speedier wind, and the results were exactly as I promised. 8)

 

[999zip999]

A hot motor.

 

[madin88]

guys with 3T motor, check your windings. the 3T V2 i got only had 20 strands and not 21. that results in 4,8% more heat at given current.

awesome and clean work teslanv. thats the ultimative lightweight street racer.
for offroad bike: that genesis frame with farfle swingarm begs for a big block middrive!! how's gonna do it first?

 

[Allex]

So does 4x16 still provide best copper fill, thus less heat than 3x21(20)?

 

[teslanv]

So does 4x16 still provide best copper fill, thus less heat than 3x21(20)?

Yes, in theory, you would have 64 strands of copper on the 16X4T vs. the 63 strands with the 21X3T. Madin says his 3T only came with 20X3T, which means only 60 Strands of fill. So the real question is, was that motor just a bad winding job, or is MXUS not able to make them with 63 (or 64) strands of fill??? - If the 3T only has 20 strands in parallel, I have to wonder how they can get 16 strands on the 4T.

 

[e4bike.ru]

The 2 of 4T we've opened all had 16 strands. We haven't got any of the 3T so can't count the strands now.

 

[teslanv]

The 2 of 4T we've opened all had 16 strands. We haven't got any of the 3T so can't count the strands now.

That is reassuring.
Let's hope Madin88's motor was a fluke...

 

[Samd]

Got another shipment of ten v2 into australia yesterday as well as one of the new 18fet sine controllers. Looking forward to testing that controller!