My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

[Nearchos]

After nearly 4 years I'm now really starting to notice the decline of my battery and need to start looking at replacing it. I'm just waiting for a quote from Frey for a replacement, but I thought I would ask if anyone else has replaced their battery, and if so did you get a Frey replacement or a 3rd party battery. If you went 3rd party, would love to know about your experience. How do you know which size/shape battery to choose, how much was it delivered, and how does it compare to Frey's own battery.
Ta v much
Dan

Danin has asked a very good question.

Has anyone tried to replace the battery pack of a FREY AM1000 with a ready made third party provider?

I would be even more interested to know about models produced after 2020, as they seem to have switched battery pack provider at some point...

 

[HypeMonsterX]

Is the firmware upgradable to this? (2017) Any benefits from upgrading?

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=117092

 

[FastBiker]

I have some battery related questions:

I have the Fat1000 with 21Ah 48V battery. Does anyone know is there empty battery slots inside the casing, so it could be possible to up the Ah from 21+ by adding more batteries? Or to convert it to 52V and get to keep it at 21Ah, so I wouldn't lose Ah in conversion?

I am also interested in changing the battery bms to bigger. Isn't the original rated 30A continuous and 40A max amperage? I am not going to do it by myself, but I am interested if it can it be changed in an easy way? If I remove the battery casing part that has the battery indicator, is it right there or somewhere deeper and more difficult to access?

----

Ok, I will answer myself as I figured things out. There aren't empty slots in 21Ah casing - at least not enough to be able to put more Ah in that battery. And original BMS is 30A. but not so sure about that max amperage, or how it is defined.

 

[Hardcore]

Hi FastBiker,

There is some space, a whopping 2 cells xD. The casing is a Reention Dorado Max, 505mm, that can hold 80 cells maximum.

I have two variants; a 52V = 14s/5p = 70 cells 17.5Ah (910Wh) and the original 48V = 13s/6p = 78 cells 21Ah (1008Wh).

I have seen 52v 20Ah (1040Wh) versions on Aliexpress supposedly those would fit but disputable/unverified quality.

Cheers,
H

 

[FastBiker]

Ok, thanks for the confirmation.

Yes, it is sometimes a gamble when ordering things from Aliexpress, especially electronics like batteries. But there is one Dorado 21700 battery maker that I have read some good comments, and for a moment I was thinking about ordering. Eventually contacted my local battery maker and ordered 48V 25Ah Dorado 21700 with 40A bms. More expensive than Chinese ones but at least I know the quality is superb. ..and after a round of queries, Chinese ones come with 30A bms and at least places I asked, it wasn't possible to upgrade to bigger.

Btw, on previous page there was a message about whether 21700 will fit into Frey bike. I have two Fat1000, one with XL and one with L frame, and I am sure 21700 will fit on XL frame. L will be tight but I am confident it will fit also. I think that Fat1000/AM1000 V5 with M frame it propably will not fit. But in a month or two I know for sure

Here is pics of Frey Fat1000 L and XL frames with 48V 21Ah battery. Smaller gap in L frame (lower) is about 7-8mm, and as Dorado Max is only 5mm higher, it should fit. (There has been Am1000 V5 / Fat1000 made with at least with two different frames. Mine is the one that has "triangle" shaped gap in front of saddle.)

 

[shaddix]

Hi folks! I ordered one of these from Hanover Bikes, apparently Frey's only US distributor? Never had an ebike before, never had a MTB before

I live in the boonies and in order to get to some good riding spots from my house require me to ride ~0.5-1.5mi on 35-40mph streets with no shoulder. AM1000 seemed to be the ticket for this so I can haul arse through those few sections of road.

I'm going to read the whole thread and then maybe come back with questions for the braintrust

 

[HypeMonsterX]

My chainstay weld cracked on a circa 2017 Frey AM.

Is there any warranty left for frame or help from Frey to be excpted? I heard they have a good policy of honoring broken frames.

Alternatively, how to fix the frame? It is the weld near on the chainstay close to the crankset.

 

[HypeMonsterX]

My chainstay weld cracked on a circa 2017 Frey AM.

Is there any warranty left for frame or help from Frey to be excpted? I heard they have a good policy of honoring broken frames.

Alternatively, how to fix the frame? It is the weld near on the chainstay close to the crankset.

Is 300 USD an OK price for a replacement V5 Frey AM frame including shipping to a nearby Asian country?

I would rather get it for free and pay for only shipping like others here who have had similar failures, shipping to Asia won't probably more than 100 USD, so the frame is costing over 200 USD.

New sticker price for a frame is 700 USD. So I guess 300 USD is better than nothing.

 

[Hardcore]

A 5yr old frame being replaced for you with 500 usd discount is rather generous as you are not within your warranty timeframe. I was within warranty and had to pay for my shipping. Note that given your timing it seems they even offered this solution to you quickly so that's a plus

And yes, it is possible to weld the frame as I did that and have used it extensively afterward. Keep in mind that welding Al ain't the easiest so get a profi fix.

 

[HypeMonsterX]

A 5yr old frame being replaced for you with 500 usd discount is rather generous as you are not within your warranty timeframe. I was within warranty and had to pay for my shipping. Note that given your timing it seems they even offered this solution to you quickly so that's a plus

And yes, it is possible to weld the frame as I did that and have used it extensively afterward. Keep in mind that welding Al ain't the easiest so get a profi fix.

Thanks.
Did you document here how the weld fix was done?

Interested in details.

In the country I live labour is quite cheap so considering this option as well.

 

[Hardcore]

Thanks.
Did you document here how the weld fix was done?

Interested in details.

In the country I live labour is quite cheap so considering this option as well.

Not much to document, here are some photos. And yes, I broke it on two spots that time. They've made improvements to the frame since 2018 I believe, so I haven't actually seen any of those have this issue. My newer frames also never broke but I heavily used them.

Cheers, hope you get it working again!

 

[Hardcore]

Just to write about all the things that broke, here's another part:

Keep in mind that my riding style was intentionally trying to break the bike

 

[HypeMonsterX]

Got a replacement frame 5.0 for the cracked 3.0

However the battery terminal on the frame is slightly different. Hole is the same, but Instead of 2 pins it has 4 (2 of them are small pins) pins. Cant connect the battery. How to fix this?

 

[amberwolf]

Move the connector from the original to the new one?

 

[HypeMonsterX]

Frey AM 3.0 frame is a boost axle rear, right? 148 mm.

 

[HypeMonsterX]

Move the connector from the original to the new one?

I tried removing the new connector from the original, i got the cover off, but there is no plug n play option to remove the wire. It goes inside the frame and can not be pulled out.

The only option I see (instead of removing the whole motor again and see if there is a way take it out that way) is to cut it and resolder the old one with the new bike.

Would you recommend this?

 

[HypeMonsterX]

The battery connector is tucked inside the frame and the white cable can't be pulled out more than in the photo. I need to attach the old connector.

Should I just cut the cables and re solder it with the old one?

 

[amberwolf]

Where does the other end of the cable go?

 

[HypeMonsterX]

Where does the other end of the cable go?

It goes towards the motor. I has a bikeshop assemmble the old parts to the new frame so I assume it's connected to the motor.

It's super tight install so they at the bikeshop advised me to resolder the old battery terminal in it.

 

[amberwolf]

Ok, well, my question was to lead you to actually look for the other end of the cable where you could unplug it there so you can pull the cable further out to access it, to possibly be able to take the entire cable out of the frame and move the one out of the old one over.

I would recommend doing this with the old frame first, carefully, so that you can see the entire path of the old cable, which is likely to be the same in the new one.


Regarding what it connects to: the battery wouldn't connect directly to the motor (if it did, the motor would run all the time if it was brushed, never stopping, and since this is brushless it wouldn't even do that, it would just smoke, so the cable has to go somewhere besides that first.

If the motor, controller and other stuff is all in one unit, then the the cable may go to that whole drive unit, but it is still going to something other than the actual motor first. Usually the controller, but there are systems that have a power control module first; I don't know how yours is designed.

 

[Hardcore]

I've once had to cut the connector on that battery cable near the motor region. It's located directly above the motor where it connects, and replacing it with XT (60 or 90) connectors solved an arcing issue for me. It is not difficult to re-use the cable, no need to cut it unless it's broken.

Oh and AM1000 3.0 has a boost axle 12x148 hub needing a 12 mm x 178 mm x 1.5 thread axle.

Cheers!

 

[FastBiker]

As promised, here is a pic of AM1000 V5 L size frame with Dorado 21700 battery. Fits in but when installing it touches a bit to the top tube but that is not a problem

 

[Hardcore]

As promised, here is a pic of AM1000 V5 L size frame with Dorado 21700 battery. Fits in but when installing it touches a bit to the top tube but that is not a problem

What are the battery statistics? Any improvement in range and voltage drop reduction?

 

[FastBiker]

What are the battery statistics? Any improvement in range and voltage drop reduction?

I have both 48V and 52V versions built with max capasity possible:
- 48V 25Ah and 1200Wh. 13S5P Samsung 50E 21700 Cells
- 52V 20Ah and 1040Wh. 14S4P Samsung 50E 21700 Cells
Both batteries with 30A BMS. It seems there is no room for bigger BMS. I tested 52V battery with M620 that has Innotrace controller with 1700W settings, and it worked fine, but looking at numbers that 30A BMS is too small. I don´t use full power much and only short bursts. It seems to be good enough for my purpose.

Before 21700 the biggest Dorado battery was Dorado Max, that could be built max 48V 21Ah and 1008Wh. Improvement of nearly 200Wh is quite significant, and will affect on range quite much. (I haven´t done any range testing.)

To make a battery that would have smaller voltage sag, I think there would have to be bigger "P". For example 14S7P would not sag as much as 14S4P. My deduction therefore is, that voltage sag has not improved. In real life I only tested full throttle in 52V battery when voltage was under 50V, and then it had 2V drop (Voltage drop tested with stock 1000W M620)

Oh, and in real life when talking about some battery having XX Ah, it never is quite as much as that advertised Ah says. I have test reports on both of my new batteries, and roughly the real Ah is about 0,5 Ah less than advertised number. And that goes of course to all batteries, so Dorado Max with 21Ah is also roughly 20.5 Ah (If buit with good quality cells)

 

[HypeMonsterX]

I just broke one of the internal gears. Do not know which one it is. Circa 2017 model Frey AM 3.0 I believe.

I am trying to find a service center here in Thailand. I do not want to do it myself, unless it is the last option. The locknut tool needs to be a proper one as well, the regular one doesnt fit since the locknut is a bit inside the chainring.

Anyone have experience of this process?