My experience with Bafang M560: High output, low reliability, and a "trap" warranty

[AlexLem]

Hello everyone,


I wanted to share my experience with the Bafang M560 (750W/140Nm). I’ll be posting more details soon, but I want to warn those considering this motor for serious E-MTB/Enduro use.


My M560 broke after only 1,300 km (7 months of use). To give you some perspective: the motor failed before my first 12V Shimano chain (CN-M8100) even reached 0.5% stretch (verified with a precision chain checker).


The Issue:


Internal gears (likely 2nd or 3rd stage) started slipping, resulting in a loud grinding noise and a total loss of pedal assist.


The Warranty Trap:


I opened the side cover to diagnose the issue before sending it to Bafang Poland for a warranty claim. Their response? Warranty denied because the motor was opened.


Here is the paradox:


Article 1 forbids opening the motor.
Article 3 states the warranty is void if you don't perform "proper maintenance".
The Reality: In France, the nearest "Bafang Certified" shop is 350 km from my house.


The Math of the "Bafang Tax":


A new M560 costs around €560 in Europe. To keep your warranty, you must pay for shipping (€60) + a certified service (~€200) every 1,000 km. By 3,000 km, you’ve spent the price of a brand-new motor just on "authorized" grease.


Quick Pros & Cons (Real-world Enduro use)

Pros:


Power & Speed: 1000+W peak power is fun for top speed and raw climbing power.
Climbing: On fire roads or steep straight lines, the 140/150nm torque is impressive.


Cons:


Zero Agility: The motor is heavy and the rear-end feels like an anchor. If you ride with flat pedals, doing bunny hops or manuals is a struggle because the bike is poorly balanced. You can try to use suspension compression to pop the bike, but the overall mass makes it feel sluggish compared to a Bosch or Shimano powered bike.
Lag & Overrun: There is a noticeable latency. The motor doesn't cut off instantly when you stop pedaling, which is dangerous in various cases like turns or descent.
Inertia: The total system inertia makes the bike feel "dead" in the air. It’s not a bike for jumping or active riding.
Reliability: Failed at 1,300 km while the drivetrain (chain/cassette) was still like new.


Comparison with Major Brands:

I personally assembled the Pinarello F12 and both Dengfu E10s from the frame up. Having built these bikes, I am intimately familiar with their mechanical requirements and maintenance needs. When compared to the high-end standards of my Rocky Mountain C90 (Dyname 3.0), the Bafang experience is disappointing. With premium systems like Bosch, Brose, or Dyname, the motor is a reliable, sealed unit. You don't face a "hidden tax" requiring a €200 internal regreasing every 1,000 km just to keep a warranty valid. Bafang’s policy—forbidding the opening of the motor while mandating professional maintenance that is not locally available—is a contractual trap. For anyone capable of building their own bikes, being denied warranty for simply diagnosing a premature failure is a major deal-breaker.


Conclusion:


Bafang announced the M560 as a high-performance E-MTB motor, but in practice, it’s just a heavy, unreliable powerhouse. If the motor breaks before a 12v chain snaps, it tells you everything about the internal gear quality.


I am receiving the motor back from Poland next week. I will perform a full teardown and post photos of the internal damage.

"Imagine buying a car, driving only 10,000 km, and having the engine explode before the timing belt even shows a sign of wear. That is exactly what happened here: the M560 motor failed before a high-end Shimano chain even reached 0.5% stretch, even the original tires are in good condition."

(To be fully honest and objective, I was really happy riding the E10 with the M560 for 7 months before this happened, despite my current issues with Bafang’s reliability and after-sales service. That's why I built a second one to ride with my father before my first motor broke; the first is 8 months old and the second is only 2 months old.)

 

[Apartunis]

When Bafang switched to CANBUS incompatibility, they were telling me to take my money elsewhere. And I did.

 

[AlexLem]

That's interesting, when was that? I don't get how they can have such a lack of consideration for their consumers.

 

[Apartunis]

That's interesting, when was that? I don't get how they can have such a lack of consideration for their consumers.

It's been a few years I think, but only in certain product lines. So far I have not observed CAN in hub motors, fortunately.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Umm, you blame the motor for lack of " pop " and yet most full suspension bikes such as the E10 will never " pop " as say a hardtail will due to the intial sag designed into the damping in the suspension. You say the motor is heavy and yet they are pretty much on a weight par with say a Bosch Gen 4. I ride with comparable Bosch bikes with my E10 and Bafang M510 and I have to say that as many Bosch's fail as to my Bafang M series. Its generally considered in my peer group that all EBike motors used off road will fail and they do on a regular basis, from broken belts ( Brose ) water ingress ( Bosch and Bafang ) due to the extreme environment we run them in. Latency, I want latency as I enjoy the ability to ride up steps and root sections where that little bit of latency is enjoyed. The M series has a brake stop, its very simple to fit unlike Bosch or Brose who also have some latency.

I can see your worry with warranty issues and will have to agree about the maintenace costs. But if you treat them as a disposible motor to the mechanically illiterate ( low cost compared to say a Bosch ) but totally repairable motor to those who have a minimum of mechanical skills, then we get into the plus side of the Bafang engines. Every part is available, the parts cost are low and to be honest it is a very easy engine to take apart and repair unlike the Bosch series or less so the Brose, where specialist tools and unvailable parts are the norm. I would suspect the bearing at fault in your engine is I think about 20 Euro, probably less than an hour to remove and fit a new bearing. Perhaps consider backing off the ramp up in Boost to prevent it happening in the future as its the one part that is highly loaded by some riders who like power. Equally pedal strikes whilst fully loaded with human power has a tendancy to damage that one way bearing.

Sorry, I would suspect that Bafang isn't for you and probably only the Specialised brand where motors are replaced without question may fit your zero maintenance requirements. But that will mean you will have to replace your entire bike every two years incurring the substantial depreciation of a two year old off road bike.

 

[AlexLem]

Umm, you blame the motor for lack of " pop " and yet most full suspension bikes such as the E10 will never " pop " as say a hardtail will due to the intial sag designed into the damping in the suspension. You say the motor is heavy and yet they are pretty much on a weight par with say a Bosch Gen 4. I ride with comparable Bosch bikes with my E10 and Bafang M510 and I have to say that as many Bosch's fail as to my Bafang M series. Its generally considered in my peer group that all EBike motors used off road will fail and they do on a regular basis, from broken belts ( Brose ) water ingress ( Bosch and Bafang ) due to the extreme environment we run them in. Latency, I want latency as I enjoy the ability to ride up steps and root sections where that little bit of latency is enjoyed. The M series has a brake stop, its very simple to fit unlike Bosch or Brose who also have some latency.

I can see your worry with warranty issues and will have to agree about the maintenace costs. But if you treat them as a disposible motor to the mechanically illiterate ( low cost compared to say a Bosch ) but totally repairable motor to those who have a minimum of mechanical skills, then we get into the plus side of the Bafang engines. Every part is available, the parts cost are low and to be honest it is a very easy engine to take apart and repair unlike the Bosch series or less so the Brose, where specialist tools and unvailable parts are the norm. I would suspect the bearing at fault in your engine is I think about 20 Euro, probably less than an hour to remove and fit a new bearing. Perhaps consider backing off the ramp up in Boost to prevent it happening in the future as its the one part that is highly loaded by some riders who like power. Equally pedal strikes whilst fully loaded with human power has a tendancy to damage that one way bearing.

Sorry, I would suspect that Bafang isn't for you and probably only the Specialised brand where motors are replaced without question may fit your zero maintenance requirements. But that will mean you will have to replace your entire bike every two years incurring the substantial depreciation of a two year old off road bike.

You might be right on some points, but repairing the motor myself isn't the main issue for me.

(I already have Mobil SHC 100 and bearing extractors for example, I also have Mobil 28 if you prefer bentone. I just don't have Klüber NB 52 because of the price. When I will repair the motor, I’ll see which bearings I can replace with NSK or SKF ones.)

What really stands out is that I’ve owned several bikes and I ride the exact same spots with all of them, yet I have never had a motor failure at 1,300 km due to slipping gears.

I hope it’s just a one-way bearing as you suggested, but the noise is extremely loud and sounds like metal grinding. Regarding sourcing 2nd or 3rd gears, it’s not that obvious here in France. I see some parts on AliExpress, but I’ll need a closer look to ensure they actually fit the M560.

I also ride with people using brands like Brose on the same trails, and they haven't faced these kinds of issues. That’s why I’m shocked by how fast it broke. Additionally my Rocky was second hand and it's now above 4500km without any concern about the Dyname 3.0.

1,000 km is nothing for a motor, and I don't want to spend significantly more time repairing this bike compared to any other one.

About the ramp-up, I didn't touch anything it's still on stock settings.

You know, I really enjoyed this bike at first—that's why I built two of them to ride with my father. But having motor trouble at 1,300 km? Come on... it just doesn't feel like a serious, reliable product.

What I was trying to say about the agility is that, with this configuration, the bike feels stuck to the ground. I think it could be more playful with a lighter battery and motor. My point is: if the motor can't handle its own power, why do I need something this heavy that drains a big battery that fast?

To answer your point about the motor delay (overrun): it’s useful in some cases like short steep climbs, but it’s also dangerous and tricky when you need precision. You can't change it anyway. Like you said, you can install brake sensors to fix that, but in practice, I’m not sure it’s better. If every time you feather the lever to get ready for a turn it just cuts the motor output, it would be extremely annoying.
Do you have any experience with this kind of setup?

I'm not saying I'm right, but those are my thoughts.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Sadly all EBikes used off road suffer from motor failure. We have one Brose motor now done nearly 10K km in my group I ride wiith, never been touched. We have other Brose based bikes that seem to e permanently in and out of the repair shop. We have an almost brand new Orbea with a Bosch motor, now on it 3rd motor. Its totally random and no motor brand seems to be one that is consistantly good. In the UK we tend to get some pretty horrendous riding conditions with a mix of mud and water logged trails in the winter and fine sandy dusty trails in the summer, the trails make testing grounds for all brands. My own Bafangs M600 & M510 all suffer from water ingress eventually damaging the seal crank side and then letting water into the main controller board. Seem to last about 3 - 4K kms before needing attention.

I wouldn't necessarily blame the motor for failure, things like pedal strikes, accidents where the bike has ended up going down the trail without you, poor changing of gears without slightly backing off on power, transporting the bike on outside carriers in rainy weather, there is a whole host of other contributory factors.

In reference to the over run, you may not be aware that if you ever so slightly back pedal, the motor will instantly cut off. Its just a learning skill to do that.

Can I ask a question, what are your rides like, are they steep interspersed rocky trails using a lot of power (mainly Boost ) and by any chance are you a relatively low cadence guy that likes the Bosch type motor that pulls from 0rpm cadence ?

 

[AlexLem]

That's good to know, I wasn't aware of the back-pedaling cut-off, but after 500km, I figured out that the overrun can be managed via cadence. At low cadence, the delay is shorter, whereas if you are spinning fast, it can take 2 to 3 seconds to cut out.

Regarding the 1,300km, I’ve mostly ridden in dry conditions. I’ve done less than 200km in humid weather, with maybe 50km under actual rain. I haven’t had any major crashes, I rarely fall, and the bike has never 'ghost-ridden' or tumbled down a trail without me. Overall, I ride clean.

The terrain around me is relatively flat but full of technical, narrow single tracks with steep, punchy climbs and descents. The M560 is great here because the torque makes the climbs easy, and the overrun can help when you're just 2 meters short of the top. However, on descents or tight sections, I’m constantly on the brakes to fight that delay. There is a learning curve, but it would be far more precise if it were programmable.
I don't recall any significant pedal strikes. My drivetrain is perfectly maintained, the derailleur is tuned, and I am very careful with my shifting. I always back off and wait for the gear to engage before putting the power back down. Most of the time, I ride the transitions in 'Trail' mode to save battery and get some cardio, only switching to 'Boost' for the technical single tracks.

I believe I used the motor exactly for what it was advertised for. My theory is that the original grease is poor quality to save a few cents. It likely overheated, turned liquid and black, and stopped doing its job, leading to premature gear wear. I’ll confirm this once I open it up. I should receive my broken motor on February 3rd.

What I find unacceptable in this user experience is Bafang’s policy. They don't look for solutions; they hide behind excuses to avoid warranty claims. They redirected me to a workshop for an estimate, but that shop is 350km away and doesn't even stock M-series parts. Outside of Alibaba or AliExpress, there is no reliable source for spare parts. 1,300km is not a normal lifespan for a motor, and this level of customer service is not normal either.

The Bafang Service center in Poland actually emailed me asking: 'We received your motor, should I send it back or recycle it?' and then followed up with: 'Oh, you opened it! Does your seller know? We can’t do anything for you now.' (I have the emails from less than 24h ago).

In contrast, Dengfu’s customer service has been excellent—better than I expected. This morning, they told me they don't care about the Polish warranty dispute; they are handling it directly with Bafang China and are sending me a brand new motor. They have a great mindset and actually want their customers to be happy.

Ultimately, my goal is to be on the bike, not spending my life repairing it while it’s immobilized. I bought this motor to use its full potential, not to ride in 'Eco' or 'Trail' because I’m afraid of breaking it. I usually ride 3,000 to 6,000km on the road and 1,000 to 3,000km on MTB/EMTB per year. So yes, 1,300km is nothing to me.

I just want something reliable and fun. If the most powerful motor is a nightmare to maintain with zero official support for parts or warranty, I’d rather go for something lighter and more reliable. I might lose some fun on the climbs, but I’ll gain it back on the jumps and corners with a more agile bike. Honestly, this whole experience with Bafang’s politics has made me want to switch brands entirely.

Even if i lose money in the process it's not the most important thing. What matters to me is being out there riding and actually enjoying the ride.

 

[Waynemarlow]

I just want something reliable and fun. If the most powerful motor is a nightmare to maintain with zero official support for parts or warranty, I’d rather go for something lighter and more reliable. I might lose some fun on the climbs, but I’ll gain it back on the jumps and corners with a more agile bike. Honestly, this whole experience with Bafang’s politics has made me want to switch brands entirely.

Pick which three of the four you want, Power, lighter, reliable, fun, sadly I don't think there is a motor out there that can satisfy all four of your criteria. With your demands of almost instant dealer support then Bafang with its sparse dealer network in Europe is probably not the brand for you.

Those brands using the new Avionox motor seem to be getting pretty close, there is quite a few EU based brands now using it but you will be limited to 25kph. We average on a regular off road ride say 1000m climb with 45km distance, nearly 18kph, those with speed regulation suffer.

Don't go down the rabbit hole of going to a light weight. From experiance by the time you fit heavy DD weight tyres with tyre protectors, heavier forks for the drop offs and fit like for like size batteries, the frame weight is almost identical to a full fat motor. The weight savings between say the M820 and the M560 is only about 400gms which if you only 1/2 fill your water bottle is the same over all weight but with only 450 - 600W's of motor energy. 450 W's is painfully slow climbs. I went with the M510 as it seemed a good compromise between power and weight and I have to say the later motors are quiet, will put out 700W's reliably and with the latest Bafang Go App are very adjustiable to suit your riding style.

 

[AlexLem]

Personally, I find a motor limited to 25kph annoying, but that can be easily fixed with a Speedbox. I’ve owned two bikes with them and never had a motor failure.

After riding for a long time, I've realized that doing 45kph on the road isn't that interesting anyway; I’d rather cruise around 30kph on flat doing tempo than have an electric moped that breaks. On the single tracks around here, unless you're going downhill, you're rarely above 25kph; most of the time you are riding between 15 and 25, and even slower in steep or technical areas. Aside from the torque for technical climbs—which is satisfying to clear without forcing—pure speed isn't the main goal. Plus, coming from a road background, I still tend to pedal on descents, but since the motor cuts at 45kph, you're often faster just tucking into an aero position to gain speed once you hit 50 or 60kph.

This whole Bafang situation has been so frustrating that I’ve actually considered switching back to a muscular bike. Sure, the climbs are a struggle, but for everything else, the bike is much more responsive. You’re riding with a third less weight, and when it comes to wheelies, bunny hops, or repositioning the bike, it’s a total game-changer. The motor, battery, and reinforced frame add about 7 to 8kg; on a 22-25kg bike, that’s a massive difference.

Regarding tires, I haven't tried riding low pressures with inserts because I don't like the idea unless I specifically need to protect my rims in a rocky area or for heavy Enduro/Freeride, which isn't my main use. In my opinion, the tire becomes imprecise and lacks lateral stiffness in high-load turns when you run low pressure. I need a real reason to add weight to the unsprung mass, and I don't have one; by staying between 1.6 and 2 bars, I haven't had a single rim issue in 1300km. I value a balance between grip and rolling efficiency, not just grip at all costs. I believe in swapping tires for winter to stay safe and keep the fun alive. Previously I had Maxxis and Schwalbe to compare; my thought is that the Kryptotal/Argotal Enduro Soft is perfect for my use—solid and durable.

If the M560 were reliable and parts were easy to obtain, I’d be happy because it’s a fun motor. But I can't afford to open it once or twice a year. Between servicing two motors, suspension overhauls, brake bleeds, truing the wheels every 1000km, regreasing bolts/bearings, servicing hubs and freewheels, it just becomes too much maintenance.

For example, on my road bike, I don't even use discs because of weight and durability like I'm living near mountains. To me, a bike is synonymous with fun and freedom: you jump on it and it works. If a system is sophisticated, it must be reliable as long as it's properly maintained; otherwise, it should stay simple so you can forget everything and enjoy your ride.

I'm not that much into average speed but in muscular i guess you average around 10-14kph and with E-bike you are around 16-20+kph depending on the session and the use. Averaging18kph over 40+km is already pretty high if you are on narrow and slow tracks.

 

[Waynemarlow]

We've found that you use the equivalent workout in energy on an analogue if we transpose kph to mph on the Ebike. The great benefit in that bit faster is your home " patch " suddenly becomes so much larger. When on an analogue from my house I have probably 150km of reachable / rideable tracks and single lane, on an Ebike I have probably 450 km. Its stagering just how much they push your working area out with the same workout as on an analogue.

 

[WallK]

Pick which three of the four you want, Power, lighter, reliable, fun, sadly I don't think there is a motor out there that can satisfy all four of your criteria. With your demands of almost instant dealer support then Bafang with its sparse dealer network in Europe is probably not the brand for you.

Those brands using the new Avionox motor seem to be getting pretty close, there is quite a few EU based brands now using it but you will be limited to 25kph. We average on a regular off road ride say 1000m climb with 45km distance, nearly 18kph, those with speed regulation suffer.

Don't go down the rabbit hole of going to a light weight. From experiance by the time you fit heavy DD weight tyres with tyre protectors, heavier forks for the drop offs and fit like for like size batteries, the frame weight is almost identical to a full fat motor. The weight savings between say the M820 and the M560 is only about 400gms which if you only 1/2 fill your water bottle is the same over all weight but with only 450 - 600W's of motor energy. 450 W's is painfully slow climbs. I went with the M510 as it seemed a good compromise between power and weight and I have to say the later motors are quiet, will put out 700W's reliably and with the latest Bafang Go App are very adjustiable to suit your riding style.

I'm looking at replacing my EP8 for a Bafang, and I am curious about choices
Would you suggest going to M510 as a closer fit by weight to what I have or getting RAW POWER?
I'm really unsure I'll benefit from the bigger motor that much, but it's 0.4kg difference to the M560 if I was to believe the catalogue
Also, I would like to stay close to my wife on a Bosch motor, we always ride together

On another note, should I go to the higher voltage with either? If I build 14s -- it should be fine with M510 too, right?

Thank you!

 

[neptronix]

When Bafang switched to CANBUS incompatibility, they were telling me to take my money elsewhere. And I did.

Look at this based consumer!

 

[Waynemarlow]

Look at this based consumer!

Why ?

 

[Waynemarlow]

I'm looking at replacing my EP8 for a Bafang, and I am curious about choices
Would you suggest going to M510 as a closer fit by weight to what I have or getting RAW POWER?
I'm really unsure I'll benefit from the bigger motor that much, but it's 0.4kg difference to the M560 if I was to believe the catalogue
Also, I would like to stay close to my wife on a Bosch motor, we always ride together

On another note, should I go to the higher voltage with either? If I build 14s -- it should be fine with M510 too, right?

Thank you!

M510 run at 14S is very comparable to the Bosch.

 

[AlexLem]

I'm looking at replacing my EP8 for a Bafang, and I am curious about choices
Would you suggest going to M510 as a closer fit by weight to what I have or getting RAW POWER?
I'm really unsure I'll benefit from the bigger motor that much, but it's 0.4kg difference to the M560 if I was to believe the catalogue
Also, I would like to stay close to my wife on a Bosch motor, we always ride together

On another note, should I go to the higher voltage with either? If I build 14s -- it should be fine with M510 too, right?

Thank you!

Hi

To be fully honest M560 is a fun motor, you can get 1150w power when it's fully charged, after this it can drop a little bit, it's clearly more powerfull than other brands.
I built 2 because I liked my bike, but if like me you want to use its full potential, i guess you will have to understand how to avoid being stuck by reliability issues.

(You can check my thread on emtbforums for more replies/discussion)

 

[phobos]

Have you ever ridden a diy motor on a well specced analog converted bike? My tsdz8 build weighs 22.5kg (trail tires, fox 36, 900wh 14s battery) and had 0 issues with it over 3k km. Same or even more power as m560, blows amflow out the water, much more quiet, torque sensing is great, you can flash OSF and have hundreds of parameters to tweak the response. Parts are dirt cheap and available in the eu (pswpower). The only bad thing about the motor is the square taper cranks.

 

[AlexLem]

Have you ever ridden a diy motor on a well specced analog converted bike? My tsdz8 build weighs 22.5kg (trail tires, fox 36, 900wh 14s battery) and had 0 issues with it over 3k km. Same or even more power as m560, blows amflow out the water, much more quiet, torque sensing is great, you can flash OSF and have hundreds of parameters to tweak the response. Parts are dirt cheap and available in the eu (pswpower). The only bad thing about the motor is the square taper cranks.

Hello, to answer you briefly no.

I consider your option as one of the best in term of ratio perf/bucks with a nice second hand bike + a kit, in my case it doesn't suit my needs.

I've been interested by CYC Pro Gen 4 motor before i bought the M560. What keeps me riding Mid drive motors is mainly because global packaging and rigidity, when you adapt many spares parts your build doesn't deal with vibrations like a frame with a system that is made for this, also the motor is under the frame that limit the clearance.

In my opinion most of Ebikes systems are good for a classic use, but when you claim big specs in MTB, you face a dilemma between reliability and numbers between Big Brands.

For exemple, on paper you can custom build a M560 with a boost mode about 3k watts 60A 52V but it won't last for long, because you will face issues with parts and components that aren't designed for this.

My disappointment was mainly that i used a motor with stock settings for an intended use but the motor was the first part that broke on the bike.

I still believe that you can upgrade the motor with high quality bearings as long as gears aren't the issue when dealing with the torque.

Before buying a Chinese E-Bike i talked with every brands like Markhor and 4Leaf, Dengfu was the more responsive. Bafang EU denied my Warranty but Dengfu handled this with Bafang CN. From my last exchange (yesterday) they received from Bafang and send me a brand new motor, so Dengfu is way ahead of other Chinese Brands in term of After-sales service.

It doesn't resolve my reliability issue but normally I can keep my broken motor, I will fix it and upgrade it.
Like this my solution is to have 2 E-Bikes with one more motor, when one will break I will repair and replace by a repaired and upgraded one, like this even after the warranty period of 24 months I can handle the maintenance (you can't do this with Bosch Shimano or Dyname but Brose seems able to find solutions after warranty period).



Only one thing could make me move to Bosch is a Frame suited for jumps in 180mm travel, O shape main downtube for rigity, high lateral rigidity in the rear triangle, 100nm of torque and 700w can be enough with a speedbox to avoid speed limiter.
In term of battery 840wh is nice but its too heavy even if i can use 100% for only 25km and 1h15 of MTB in Boost mode, from my experience 600wh inbuilt battery and 300-400wh well suited extender is the ultimate compromise, like this you can deal with range, gravity center, and weight for agility.

 

[phobos]

when you adapt many spares parts your build doesn't deal with vibrations like a frame with a system that is made for this, also the motor is under the frame that limit the clearance.

That I agree with, the standard 73mm bb interface is not as good as a custom mount with m8 bolts running through the motor body, so it will be less stiff. The cranks will be less stiff as well due to the square taper standard I mentioned, not ideal for big jumps. That's the reason I am not jumping much with this bike and in general I am more cautious than I would be with a factory bike.

Regarding the clearance you could find a frame that fits the motor well, the clearance can be made as good as a factory bike. It all depends on how good the donor frame is. There are lots of variables to optimize, like wheel size, geometry, travel, clearance, space for battery, etc etc. From that point of view it's much easier to buy an of the shelf carbon frame that fits everything like lego blocks.

I am currently heavily disappointed with all factory bike options on the market for trail riding so that's why I went that route instead.

Bafang is noisy and you need a 150$ tool to change parameters such as wheel size and speed limit which is ridiculous (not anymore thanks to bafang cannable pro). I am following up on open source efforts for Bafang controllers and putting high hopes in 560RS to be better built. Then I'll consider it.
Every other manufacturer keeps things proprietary so that's a big fat NO from me as I like to build bikes myself, down to spot welding battery cells and revalving/servicing suspension.

 

[neptronix]

Right.. for $150 i can buy a nice VESC and program everything to my liking.. i can also get heat out of the motor casing by removing the internal controller which allows me to push the motor harder.

If the motor has 3 phase wires, and isn't physically broken, a VESC can run it

 

[AlexLem]

That I agree with, the standard 73mm bb interface is not as good as a custom mount with m8 bolts running through the motor body, so it will be less stiff. The cranks will be less stiff as well due to the square taper standard I mentioned, not ideal for big jumps. That's the reason I am not jumping much with this bike and in general I am more cautious than I would be with a factory bike.

Regarding the clearance you could find a frame that fits the motor well, the clearance can be made as good as a factory bike. It all depends on how good the donor frame is. There are lots of variables to optimize, like wheel size, geometry, travel, clearance, space for battery, etc etc. From that point of view it's much easier to buy an of the shelf carbon frame that fits everything like lego blocks.

I am currently heavily disappointed with all factory bike options on the market for trail riding so that's why I went that route instead.

Bafang is noisy and you need a 150$ tool to change parameters such as wheel size and speed limit which is ridiculous (not anymore thanks to bafang cannable pro). I am following up on open source efforts for Bafang controllers and putting high hopes in 560RS to be better built. Then I'll consider it.
Every other manufacturer keeps things proprietary so that's a big fat NO from me as I like to build bikes myself, down to spot welding battery cells and revalving/servicing suspension.

Right.. for $150 i can buy a nice VESC and program everything to my liking.. i can also get heat out of the motor casing by removing the internal controller which allows me to push the motor harder.

If the motor has 3 phase wires, and isn't physically broken, a VESC can run it

Hi ,

I found this thread tonight, it's interesting because it talks about VESC and my potential issue.

VESC based INNOTRACE motor controller for Bafang M560/510

Today is the day guys! Now INNOTRACE belongs to the people! It is like a Christmas miracle! The PCB and the firmware have been updated. I recommend to revive the old thread and include this into the first post, but it is up to you how you want to manage it...

endless-sphere.com

I will perform a full teardown next week and document (if needed) how you replace properly the one way bearing since it's pressed fitted inside the gear.

 

[Apartunis]

If the motor has 3 phase wires, and isn't physically broken, a VESC can run it

Out of the box? Without motor data?

I appreciate super cheap dual mode controllers that need only plugging in, but maybe that is because I prefer to set machine parts in order than to sift through documentation trying to figure out what arbitrary stuff some pencil head with no real experience decided.

 

[neptronix]

Out of the box? Without motor data?

Yes. It has auto detect. You don't even have to plug the phase/hall wires in correctly.

I appreciate super cheap dual mode controllers that need only plugging in, but maybe that is because I prefer to set machine parts in order than to sift through documentation trying to figure out what arbitrary stuff some pencil head with no real experience decided.

You know i run a software/IT company for a living.
The last thing i want once i leave my work PC for the day is to deal with technology problems / clunky designs
I tend to go for brutally simple / failproof things outside of work.

I would pick a phaserunner because it's much simpler but it is limited on power. And it can't drive such a high RPM.

VESCs do look intimidating at first when you start reading about them. But it's such a good controller that it's worth learning. And not hard to program once you understand the basics.

 

[Apartunis]

VESCs do look intimidating at first when you start reading about them. But it's such a good controller that it's worth learning. And not hard to program once you understand the basics.

Noted. One day maybe I will dig into them and find out what I've been missing. For the time being, my interest in controllers is similar to my interest in toasters. Push lever down and receive toast.

 

[stancecoke]

VESCs do look intimidating at first when you start reading about them. But it's such a good controller that it's worth learning

Sorry, yes you can tune the VESC in many ways, but it is absolutely unsuited, if you want something Ebike specific like torquesensor support. Of course you can add this function yourself, if you are nerdy enough. If you just want to ride Moped with the throttle, it's OK....