Need help first build with kt-lcd3

[Waxx44]

Hello,

I bought a kit from www.banggood.com, 26" rear wheel 48v 500w + PAS + cheap controller 48v 22A + brake levers + accelerator, brand of the wheel is Green Pedel, model is 48GP-D27R.



Original controller with accelerator (forbidden in France):



I made a 13s4p li-ion battery with a smart bluetooth BMS 48v 30a, 52 Samsung 3450ma 10A 18650 in a Reention Tigershark DS6 case. I also bought a case for the controller on Aliexpress.







Everything was OK but i wanted a display and my controller isn't compatible, so i bought a new controller with kt-lcd3.





I connected everything and motor is growling/noisy. I tried to swap motor phase wires (with the ES tutorial) but it was worst.
I know i have to set the kt-lcd3 but i don't know nothing about my motor so i'm lost to set P1, P2, C2.

[youtube]NpoBaxino3k[/youtube]
The clic sound is due to the disc brake .

I've set P1 (by default) to 87, P2 to 0, and C2 to 0 but the motor is very noisy at starting and at low speed. I tried other values ( by decades) for P1 but it's not better. With P1 set to 87, [strike] speedometer seems to be good[/strike]. If i don't set P2 to 0, speedometer doesn't work.

My PAS has 8 magnets, i have 2 different doc for kt-lcd3 and zone says i have to set C1 to 1 and the other one says 00, 01 or 02.

How can i know the good values ?

 

[docw009]

Could be a bad KT controller. I bought a 20A sine wave controller that growled under load. It did run the bike, but I knew something was wrong. Other controllers worked fine, and the bad one growled on another motor. So I lost my money, because it came from China.

I did buy two other KT controllers of the same type later, and they were fine.

By the way, it worked fine with no load on the wheel. Quiet. No load speed as expected. Just didn't work if I sat on the bike.

 

[Waxx44]

It's noisy with load and no load.
You are certainly right about a defective controller.
I don't know if it can be fixed and how.
So i need to buy another one, but where ?
I need a 48v minimum 22A compatible with kt-lcd3 display.

I'm going to play a last time with the 36 possibilitys of the hall sensors wires and motor phases wires but i'm sceptical about it.

I will look for a new controller from Europe as i live in France.

Thank you

 

[Waxx44]

I made the little tool with 3 leds to know if the motor's sensors are 60° or 120° and it is [strike]60°[/strike] 120° cause i can see 2 leds lighting at the same time.
[strike]So C2 need to be set on 2.[/strike]

Edit: My bad, after reading again this post : https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3484
If 2 leds llighting at the same time it means phase is 120°.


[youtube]cZtvVErNLPI[/youtube]


When my wheel makes one revolution, each led blink 23 times, so 23×3=69, i set P1 to 69 (why ? Because [strike]speedometer seems to be aproximatly good like this[/strike], i'm going to try it with a GPS to compare).

I tried the 36 combinations with no load and the best results are (motor still noisy):
(I made a wire with 2 connectors and pins to easyly swap wires)



BB/YY/GG | bb/yy/gg 0.2-0.3A
BB/YY/GG | by/yb/gg 0.4A
BY/YB/GB | bb/yg/gy 0.4A
BY/YB/GB | by/yg/gb 0.3A
BG/YB/GY | bg/yy/gb 0.3A
BG/YB/GY | bg/yb/gy 0.3A

All other combinations are realy noisy or reverse, so i keep BB/YY/GG | bb/yy/gg setting.

Last thing i can do is going to test on the road with a GPS and adjust P1 untill lcd3 speedometer match with GPS.

After that i will have to buy another controller.

 

[Waxx44]

I just went bike to compare GPS and lcd3 speedometer, i need to set P1 to 46 to get good speed information, but motor is still growling/noisy/vibrating, mainly at starting (i only use PAS mode).

All i have to do now is buying another controller !

 

[AHicks]

Re: P1=46, I know from my own experience that works well on the larger motors (1000-1500w), but it seems to me I read somewhere that the smaller motors used P1=33 due to the fact they are smaller with fewer magnets? Info is so spread out I can appreciate your issue finding correct/relevant info. In any case, I do know that setting will affect the indicated speed, but I'm not sure setting it for correct speed via GPS is going to leave you with the correct setting.

I've always used P2 and C2 =0

Same story BB/YY/GG motor wiring. Have never had to deviate.

Re: PAS setting, I doubt this is going to leave you with a growling motor if set incorrectly. It's more about whether your PAS is going to work. Correct setting will depend on which side of the crank you've mounted your sensor and magnet ring - forward vs, reverse signal. Reverse signal will have the sensor mounted on the gear side, using settings 05-07. Forward signal will have the sensor mounted opposite the gear and use settings 00-02. Contrary to the directions, I don't think the controller cares how many magnets.

Best of luck!

 

[Waxx44]

Thank you for your reply.
This is my first try for ebike, i was hoping settings of the lcd3 could change something, but after reading you and docw009, and all i tried it's definitively the controller.

May i will buy the cheap tool from eBay/aliexpress to diagnose motors and controllers.

At full power it doesn't go more than 30km/h and 80 Watts.

I'm going to desassemble the controller to check if a wire or something else is unsolder and reheat all the welds.

And after that i will order a new controller.

 

[AHicks]

Have you tried setting P1 to 33?

 

[Waxx44]

Inside the controller:



I've checked all wires from connectors to welds with a multimeter.
I reheated the Mosfets welds.

AHicks, no i'm not sure, i'm going to try as soon as i will reassemble the controller.

 

[Waxx44]

Tested and it's still the same, set P1 to 33, noisy/growling motor. I put back the original controller for now, it works well but it hasn't LCD.

So i've just ordered a new sine controller 48v 500w rated current 13A, maximum current 26A compatible with kt-lcd3 display.

 

[Waxx44]

I received my new controller, and it does exaclty the same thing ! :x
I checked again the kt-lcd3 settings again and i found an other setting after the C's settings, this is L1, does someone know what it does ?

 

[docw009]

That's something. Mine only growled under load and since I had built tow identical bikes, except for the controller, the growl and poorer performance moved with the controller.

Your original kit had a different controller w/o LCD. Did you ever run that combination?

I should also mention that I've installed two of these 6 FET 20A KT sine wave controllers this year, and neither is truly silent, but mine are geared motors.

 

[Waxx44]

Yes it's really better with the original controller but i can't connect a kt-lcd3.

I made a movie to compare original vs kt controller (i bought two kt controller because i was thinking the first one was faulty).
I think the kt controller is power limited by software.

[youtube]FaxFeVE7NaI[/youtube]

 

[Waxx44]

I think i've found the L1 setting explanation.
From the Kt-LCD8S manual :
"L1 parameters are applicable to the automatic under-voltage controller. The default of the factory is 0.
1.1 When L1=0, the automatic under-voltage controller can automatically select the under-voltage value according to the battery voltage.
1.2 When L1=1, the under-voltage value of the automatic under-voltage controller is forced to be 20V.
1.3 When L1 = 2, the under-voltage value of the automatic under-voltage controller is forced to be 30V.
1.4 When L1 = 3, the under-voltage value of the automatic under-voltage controller is forced to be 40V."


Edit: after reading this post: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=79763
My two Kt controller seem to be square (trapezoidal).
ZWS = Square
SVP = Sine

 

[Waxx44]

I tried all C2 settings, still the same.
I'm going to buy a s12s 48v 500 watt torque simulation sine wave controller from bmsbattery.
I hope this will be the last one i have to buy.

 

[Waxx44]

Hi, i've just connected my new s12s torque simulation sine wave controller, it's still noisy, but very less and only on the first level assist. I need a new case for the controller, it is bigger than the other.

I have a new problem, when i use brakes, the battery indicator on the kt-lcd3 shows empty battery and goes back to full, C13 is set to 0.
There is 3 wires on brakes connectors, black, yellow, red.
When pressing brakes levers, it makes contact between the yellow and black wires.

Here a movie for noise and "braking problem" (sorry for the dark video, it's winter)

[youtube]usrjIaKGa88[/youtube]

 

[Pwnlord187]

If the growling you speak of feels like your whole frame is rumbling and buzzing each time you open the throttle in my experience its been an issue with the blades of the anderson phase plugs not maintaining a locked connection but instead having the blades touch but rattle on top of each other. I know you say the LCD changes things but I would swap out my connectors with something better just to be sure. Most of the plugs on the chinese stuff are generally questionable in quality and stability

 

[Waxx44]

What kind of plugs do you recommend ?
I've already changed all the plugs by Anderson plugs (bought from Aliexpress).
I was thinking about soldering controller's wires with motor's wires.

For now motor is quiet (still a bit noisy on first level but it's ok).

On s12s torque simulation controller there is a grey wire loop.
Edit: Grey wire = EABS Wire
Plug in: Ebike can work in braking power while achieving flexible brakes.
So i disconnected it and my problem with brakes and battery indicator just left.

I started to make a box for the controller, need to put some epoxy and spray paint, after that i will have to reduce all the wires to hide it in the box.

 

[Waxx44]

Hi, now everything is ok
Motor was noisy because my controller was square wave, now with the s12s torque simulation sine wave, my motor is quiet.

 

[docw009]

Wow. Nice. You've put a lot of hours into that bike. Glad to hear that you're happy with it!

I bought an S12S controller a few years ago, but it was longer than any free space on my bike's frame. Maybe when I get old enough for a tricycle, and I'll put it in the rear basket.

 

[AHicks]

Congrats on sticking with it long enough to get it figured out. For what it's worth, the controller will run much cooler when exposed to air moving around it. There's no need for it to be encased.

 

[Waxx44]

Yes, it has been so long, now i can ebike to go to work, no need of a car for the summer .

I encased the controller to hide the wires.
It's a 48v 500 Watt but i set it to 250 Watt only, so i hope it won't get too hot.
May i will remove the case if i find a solution to hide wires and connectors.

My battery's craddle has roomspace for a controller, but i didn't find which one and where to buy it.

 

[DougEB]

I recently purchased a KT-LCD3 display but what does it connect to?
here is link to motor kit I am using
https://www.ebay.com/itm/303024861914
any ideas of how to connect tis display to it?

 

[docw009]

DougEB, displays have to be matched with controllers made by the same outfits. So a KT LCD3 will only work with KT controllers. There are some hobbyists that reprogram the firmware so an LCD3 can work with another controller, but they didn't did it for your kit, and they never will.

So sorry, that's $40USD down the drain unless you build another ebike using a KT controller.

.