Need Suggestions for Modifying EBike SX to Higher MPH

[kauaikit]

Hello Russell…good to read your still riding. I remember asking you a question years ago about what charger you were using on your Europa. I've too read your postings about the project bikes you setup and ride.

The two Europa's I have, were both bought for a song (Blk-$75 1k mi, & White-$125 like new). Which is why I would suggest these to anyone starting out riding an electric bike with a budget around $500. I too use the Turnigy Nano tech 22.2v/8ah & 18.5v/8ah batteries hooked in series (11s) for a 46.2v/8ah pack that fits nicely in the side compartment. The bikes do work on 50v's (2x 22.5v/8ah) for high top end speed, but the stock controller doesn't like it, with the 46.2v's working best. I've not yet set up a Samsung 18650 cell 46v range setup in the original battery pack on these Europa's, or even the EVG ebikes….but, soon.

As you know the Europa's use a noisy 235 watt geared brushed hub. NO torque, but has some top end speed. I'm getting 25.5mph level on the blk, & 23.5mph level on the white @ 46.2v (11s). I've upgraded both front chainrings to 48t. On a slight downhill the freewheeling hub gives me around 28mph. On my regular 12 mile route I ride (6 mi uphill & 6 mi downhill) I'm getting an average of 19mph. It's interesting that the Europa's came stock with a 11t high gear freewheel for high end pedaling.

A shame you were disappointed with your stock battery setup Europa. They were underpowered (low ah) and under voltage from the factory. The HK batteries would have given you the performance I think you would have enjoyed.

I also use the same batteries but in a 46.2v/16ah pack for my ride(s) of choice, which is the original Wavecrest Tidalforce M-750x/IO 750X/S-750X ebikes that do 31.5mph (195lbs) on level or 40mph on a slight downhill pedaling like a mad man! These bikes pull HARD and are dead silent with their 7 phase internal sine-wave 1900 watt/58amp range performance, even with a heavy rider (265lbs), when I let my brother test ride one. These bikes too are a pleasure to ride at an average of 25mph on level ground for distance, for my cardio workouts. :wink:

Another complete factory stock bike model (2005), that I would recommend first before doing a DIY project….$900 range with upgrades….for the current low used price and their dead silent performance without much labor to setup.

 

[Russell]

Hello Russell…good to read your still riding. I remember asking you a question years ago about what charger you were using on your Europa. I've too read your postings about the project bikes you setup and ride.

The two Europa's I have, were both bought for a song (Blk-$75 1k mi, & White-$125 like new). Which is why I would suggest these to anyone starting out riding an electric bike with a budget around $500. I too use the Turnigy Nano tech 22.2v/8ah & 18.5v/8ah batteries hooked in series (11s) for a 46.2v/8ah pack that fits nicely in the side compartment. The bikes do work on 50v's (2x 22.5v/8ah) for high top end speed, but the stock controller doesn't like it, with the 46.2v's working best. I've not yet set up a Samsung 18650 cell 46v range setup in the original battery pack on these Europa's, or even the EVG ebikes….but, soon.

As you know the Europa's use a noisy 235 watt geared brushed hub. NO torque, but has some top end speed. I'm getting 25.5mph level on the blk, & 23.5mph level on the white @ 46.2v (11s). I've upgraded both front chainrings to 48t. On a slight downhill the freewheeling hub gives me around 28mph. On my regular 12 mile route I ride (6 mi uphill & 6 mi downhill) I'm getting an average of 19mph. It's interesting that the Europa's came stock with a 11t high gear freewheel for high end pedaling.

A shame you were disappointed with your stock battery setup Europa. They were underpowered (low ah) and under voltage from the factory. The HK batteries would have given you the performance I think you would have enjoyed.

I also use the same batteries but in a 46.2v/16ah pack for my ride(s) of choice, which is the original Wavecrest Tidalforce M-750x/IO 750X/S-750X ebikes that do 31.5mph (195lbs) on level or 40mph on a slight downhill pedaling like a mad man! These bikes pull HARD and are dead silent with their 7 phase internal sine-wave 1900 watt/58amp range performance, even with a heavy rider (265lbs), when I let my brother test ride one. These bikes too are a pleasure to ride at an average of 25mph on level ground for distance, for my cardio workouts. :wink:

Another complete factory stock bike model (2005), that I would recommend first before doing a DIY project….$900 range with upgrades….for the current low used price and their dead silent performance without much labor to setup.

Well you certainly can't go wrong buying them for an average of $100. My Europa cost me $700 new. I remember the first time I rode it was late at night just around the neighborhood, I thought I was going to wake everyone up or have someone call the cops on me for noise pollution! I did buy a MAC motor with the intent to swap it with the Heinzmann but I never did. IIRC I sold it a year later with perhaps 100 miles on it for half-price.

With a new brushless motor and lithium power the bikes can make a nice "moped" type E-bike. I like to pedal though and the frame was too small for me and the bottom bracket too high. I recently finished building something very similar though using an Electra Townie and am happy how it turned out.

-R

 

[Hugechainring]

Lots of good advice here. I personally have several EVG bikes as both runners and test platforms. The frames themselves are IMO an excellent starting point for an e-bike build. Going fast is fun, but 35mph on one of these is on the edge of sanity. I run big, balloon type tires on these bikes to help soak up the bumps, with downhill spec tubes. I would suggest investing in some good safety gear. Going down at any speed is not fun.

The forks are better than rigid forks, but don't expect much from them. Make sure all the screws are tight, but don't over do it, they will strip.

The front disc brakes are awful, performance is worse than rim brakes. I would recommend a hydraulic front brake upgrade. The rear rim brake is fine, but the pads should probably be replaced with Kool Stop pads. Check with your LBS to get the right ones.

The cleanest, simplest conversion to a brushless motor setup is probably the one mentioned earlier shown by Ilia from ebikessf.com on YouTube. You indicated that you don't have a lot of electrical expertise. That conversion is fairly straight forward. Since ilia has done exactly what you are talking about, he could probably make it plug and play-in-a-box for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjwQOuSI5-w

I'd like a range of 60 miles at 35-40 mph to manage the feeder roads safely enough in traffic.

Likely you will have compromise on the range. If you have to go that far it will be really expensive for a quality, user friendly battery. Most potential e-bikers I work with throw out figures like this initially, but after some real-world analysis, they realize they don't need and can't afford it. You also cannot get high speed and high climbing ability in the same package without spending several thousand dollars, and either learning many new skills or hiring someone to build your bike for you.

I would suggest getting in contact with Ilia and starting a conversation. Likely you will emerge better educated and with a realistic idea of what you can get as far as $$$ spent vs performance acquired.

 

[Soj]

That bike looks the same as the Lee Cacocca. There were a couple of threads about modifying them for more power. There's one here:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14417

Perhaps somebody else could link to others; however, I think that they're a long way short of your target. I think 30 miles at 30mph will be a more realistic target.

Of course it's a Lee Iacocca. not sure why you said that, since all of his bikes look the same - except for body color.

Thanks for the older thread. This confirms topping up the speed by way of the older thread:
"guy says it's been upgraded with a 48V 'lithium ion' battery. not sure the capacity. said he never rode it long enough - thought it would go for two hours. he said it went very fast too. like over 25mph. said it's 'street legal' since it's over the speed for an ebike, which i found interesting"

Cool. 8) Here in Texas.....as long as things are started with a pedal and not an ignition key ....you don't need registration or license.

Uhhh, no. According to Texas Statute:

(24) "Electric bicycle" means a bicycle that:

(A) is designed to be propelled by an electric motor, exclusively or in combination with the application of human power;

(B) cannot attain a speed of more than 20 miles per hour without the application of human power; and

(C) does not exceed a weight of 100 pounds.

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/TN/htm/TN.541.htm#541.201

Otherwise, it's a "motor-assisted scooter", and while you may not have to register it through the DMV - if you choose not to register it, you can only take it on roads with a speed limit of 35 mph or less. That pretty much puts paid to the idea of going 40 or 50 mph, at least in Texas. Also, more and more municipalities have enacted laws specifically aimed at curbing the far-too-lenient provisos for "motor assisted scooters" allowed by the state statute. Such as being allowed to ride them on sidewalks and bike paths, or at speeds over 20 mph.

Nowhere in the US is an e-bike that goes 50mph street legal - unless you register it as a moped or scooter. Texas, in particular, has a bunch of regulations for things that go faster than 20 mph, depending on how much faster they go. But they are not considered "electric bicycles".

In fact it looks like e-trikes are not legal in Texas at all, as all definitions are limited to "two tandem wheels" or "two wheels in contact with the ground". I wonder if they're even legal WITHOUT having a motor?

Anyway. I don't know where the OP is, but I'm betting that anything over 20 mph is NOT street legal, though I doubt she'll get caught going 25 mph. But 40 or 50 mph - expect problems unless you register it as a moped or scooter, if there is a proviso to do that according to state and local law.