Please let us know the rules

[John in CR]

I thought we were being pretty civil in recent discussions. If you think I crossed the line or others have claimed that I crossed the line, please let me know. I truly have no intention to offend anyone here on the forum, because despite any differences in opinion about politics or life or health (any topic, period) I consider all of you guys (or girls or whatever pronouns are appropriate in today's confusing (to me) environment) to be my friends with whom which I share a common interest in electric transportation.

I consider this special subsection of ES as the only place that I can safely express my views. While I could be wrong that it's actually safe here, I choose to express my trust in fellow ESers regardless of differences in opinion. I feel strongly in my convictions, and feel compelled to try to convince "my ES friends" come over to a better more logical view. Yeah sure most would say that's impossible and is beyond my responsibility I disagree. It's named "the right" for good reason, so if I can help even just one person see the better way, then my efforts are worth the trouble. While we see plenty of people grow up and abandon the left, we never see true conversions from conservative to leftist views.

 

[neptronix]

I am sorry we are not clear about rules yet. I have a call with Justin tomorrow where we will hopefully come to a decision during that call.
I have been trying to prepare everyone for a change so that it is not a shock.

What i have been trying to get sorted is the most basic posted rule - leave the really nasty ad hominem attacks at the door. I also don't like posts with the intent to agitate ideological warfare because they incite that kind of behavior since multiple people of varying backgrounds get on this religious crusade about their political beliefs. It doesn't work because the discussion becomes unproductive and ugly so fast and never ends.

I would like to see ES handle a high degree of free speech as gracefully as possible so we can still have political discussions. You are big boys and this forum has a higher collective IQ than most. I want to believe it is possible. It means dropping your sword though. It means you come here with the intent to discuss and inform, not convert. I know it's hard when the political environment in the west is so nasty and upside down. But this is the right direction to take with a forum which is about to grow in a big way.


I appreciate you bringing this up. I know you want to be a member in good standing. You are part of a conservative minority here and i appreciate having diverse opinions on this forum. I don't want it to be a polarized monoculture like many online communities. Getting the liberal majority to drop their swords is going to be even harder. But i believe the forum will be better off with less swords and more bikes in the end. Like it was back in the day. :thumb:

 

[John in CR]

Thanks Neptronix,

Please as part of whatever discussions take place don't worry about my feelings because I have thick skin and can't really be offended in these matters. As long as I know what the rules are I will play nicely...just like when I was in school or at Free Speech Alley in the designated area while attending university and truly anything could be discussed as long as you were brave enough to stand up on the concrete bench and start talking. I can only imagine what I knew as Free Speech Alley has devolved into in the current day and age... I'd guess that it allows anything but free speech today.

 

[markz]

Changes

They are a coming!

 

[neptronix]

Please as part of whatever discussions take place don't worry about my feelings because I have thick skin and can't really be offended in these matters. As long as I know what the rules are I will play nicely...just like when I was in school or at Free Speech Alley in the designated area while attending university and truly anything could be discussed as long as you were brave enough to stand up on the concrete bench and start talking. I can only imagine what I knew as Free Speech Alley has devolved into in the current day and age... I'd guess that it allows anything but free speech today.

You're welcome.

I know you have a thick skin but most people don't and become defensive so easily. And some of them have the disposition to go on the attack instead of scurry off. That's when i get to deal with the repercussions.

Your feelings, right to speak, and safety all matter to me regardless of whether you are tough enough to handle it or not. We don't want to be an unwelcoming environment here. I also want to prevent being overprotective at the same time. I feel we are close to a perfect balance of this for ES.

Funny, the perfect balance point just happens to be:
Enforce the posted rules of the forum :lol:

 

[marty]

What are the rules here?

Judging by this thread Dumb & Dumber Discussion of politics is no longer allowed.

Judging by this thread California bill introduced to decriminalize psychedelics Discussion of drugs is allowed.

What about religion? Can we argue about that? I once asked some one what religion he belonged to? He said "Marijuana"

Neptronix you are doing real good with the technical side of things. You doing real bad with trying to be moderator in OUR special area called The Biker Bar. If you can't stand the heat. Get out of the kitchen.

 

[neptronix]

I know you enjoy criticizing my actions on this forum and making conspiracy theories about me, but you should speculate less, accuse less, and read more.

 

[ZeroEm]

by neptronix » Mar 16 2021 9:33am

I know you enjoy criticizing my actions on this forum and making conspiracy theories about me, but you should speculate less, accuse less, and read more.

Missed the conspiracy theories about you from "Marty". Can not even imagine what they would be about?

Have read very few post in the Biker Bar in the last few months. I see it as entertainment as it is not all factual in here.

I have seen it get bad and like to see the options of others to look for my failings of logic. E-bikes are our common connection and a strong one. I like your post much more Neptronix now that you have found the world of recumbents, that I am forced to live in because of my health. Riding more like an arrow is great.

I would not like the Biker Bar go away completely.
John in CR is our friend and has never crossed the line out side of no peddles. (Not even fake ones)

 

[neptronix]

I want to see the biker bar remain too. This community is my home just as it is yours, and we still need a place to vent.

A ban on politics was discussed between me and Justin as an easy way out of dealing what the huge moderation toll and behavior trap they create.
The discussions i had with many members here lead me to back out of supporting the idea and focus on the ad hominem aspect instead. That is a big reason why we took on another moderator who also likes frequenting the dungeon. He's also a great guy and does care about the community a lot.

Ultimately if we can get out of the crusading and attacking element, political posts here are welcome. I don't like them but if they can be more civil, i have no reasonable complaint against them.

 

[nicobie]

I also enjoy a "lively" discussion, and while politics does seem to get peoples blood flowing I see no reason why we can't have a civil discussion about it.

Instead of saying, "If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen", How about,"If you can't make your argument without getting mad and resorting to insults and name calling, stay out of this forum.

So, Politics - OK, up to a point.

Religion - NO, instant delete.

Remember: It's fine to have your own opinion but not your own facts. There IS a difference between the two.

 

[neptronix]

How about,"If you can't make your argument without getting mad and resorting to insults and name calling, stay out of this forum.

So, Politics - OK, up to a point.

Religion - NO, instant delete.

You know, we haven't had much trouble on the religion topic. I think we should include a mention of it in the new rules but the blanket rule about not insulting people's religious beliefs should be covered by the ad hominem rule.
Maybe this should all be generalized out to include those with uncommon sexualities, races, etc.

IE the general rule should be to not assault someone on a critical part of their own identity or belief system, no matter what it is. Discussing is fine but insulting in public would not be. That would include insulting someone for being a white male. Instead of having 'protected classes', we'd extend the 'don't be a dick' rule to everyone.

When i ran ES FB and we ran into social justice issues, that's the rule i laid down. Some liberal types objected and left because they think some people should be protected more than others, but i was fine with their departure. I didn't hear any objection from the more conservative types. It worked very well.

Said rule would have some leeway and warnings before any punishment in order to eliminate the fear of suddenly hitting a brick wall of moderation.

 

[John in CR]

I can't see any hot button topics related to religion that would be interesting to discuss other that some of the lockdown rules that prevent worship gatherings, and that would come under politics and how lockdown rules take away rights guaranteed by the constitution. Those authoritarian edicts which have no basis in science hopefully aren't just training the citizens for worse to come.

 

[nicobie]

^I agree with both of you^