Question regarding 24V 250W Hub motor kit.

[Mrebman]

Hello:

I purchased an EZ-Glide 24V 250 Watt electric hub motor conversion kit off Ebay. I have converted a Walmart mountain bike to Electric power & have installed the kit & everything works fine. However, the
power is a bit lacking especially on streets that have a an uphill grade to them & my weight is 212 LBS so that doesn't help either.

I am using (2) 12V 12AH SLA batteries hooked up in Series to deliver the 24V that the hub motor needs. My question is that i am think of going Lithium Polymer batteries here & I know ALL about Lipo batteries because I fly R/C aircraft & use all types of Lipos. I am thinking of maybe boosting the voltage by using 2 5000 mAH packs in series, maybe using (1) 5000-4S & (1) 5000-3S connected in series to give me a little more voltage? My question is can that 24V Hub motor take more than 24 Volts & survive? Can I put 36 volts into a 24V Hub motor ??

What is the best way for me to "Hop" up the speed/Power a little on this bike ?

 

[chisixer6]

mrebman;

I was in the same spot you are in, 3 months ago. This forum will help you. they told me to open up the controller 1st, to see if your capacitors can take higher voltage, I had 50v caps. so, I had 2 sla batteries, which were heavy about 8 to 10# each.I couldn't really afford a Lifepo pack, as they were at least $300 and up(my choice would have been Ping) . So I went to nycbike web site and bought another sla battery for $30, and it made a difference, max speed went from 17 to 19mph(with pedaling) and 15mph motor alone, to 21mph motor alone and hi 20's with pedaling. 3 sla slugs were heavy, but I got used to it. I am now gathering parts for Life packs first(getting expensive) , then will dive into LiPo soon after.

later,

Jerry

I was into r/c cars, but those days were ancient nicad was state of the art.

 

[StudEbiker]

The motor will handle it fine, it's the controller you need to worry about. It will depend on the voltage rating of the capacitors in the controller. Some controllers are more tolerant of slightly higher voltages than others. You can either open the controller up and see what the voltage rating on the caps are, or go ahead and try and run it with LiPo if that's what you want to do and see if it works. The end result will be the same. If the caps can handle the voltage then away you go and all's good, if they won't. . . you blow the controller and get a new one.

Of course the real question is if you are familiar and comfortable with LiPo, why did you get a 24v SLA system of Ebay??? :lol:

 

[Mrebman]

I got the 24V 250 Watt system off ebay because well it was CHEAP :wink: & i was not sure how much I would use this bike anyway + I wanted to be legal & you can't go over 20 MPH anyway & be legal, I just did not realize that I was not going to get 20 MPPH but more like 12-15 MPH & I was hoping for a little more speed.

 

[Russell]

Hey I run a "24V" Bafang on 12S LiPo just fine. Voltage ratings on hub motors are pretty much meaningless except that a lower voltage motor is usually wound for a higher RPM/Volts. For example my "24V" motor spins at 9.4 RPM/V while the "36V" Bafang I had spun at 6.4 RPM/V. Do like the other guys have said and check out the controller to see if it can handle it then go with 10S LiPo right away!

-R

 

[StudEbiker]

In the USA, the 36v kits sold by the big e-bike retailers are mostly legal. Remember most of these are being sold with lithium batts so consider 44v. more volts=more speed. With the 9C kit on the TidalForce bike (44v LiFePo4 & 22A controller, or right around 850watts) my top speed is 22-23 (depending on temp.) I don't recognize that motor. It's not a brushed kit is it?? Do you have any other e-bikes around you you could take for a ride so you can see what you like and what you don't?? The Aotema kit from Hightek bikes is a great starter kit. Crazy easy install and super reliable. It is a quick motor though. When I was riding it at 36v, I had a top speed of 26mph, which was fun, but it is not the best climber. Anyway, welcome to the forum!! Have fun!

 

[chisixer6]

mrebman;

Are you willing to spend a chunk of money? Because going liPo or LiFe is going to cost. I know you said you used LiPo before, did you have all the equipment? I just spent $140 for Icharger 2008, $130 for meanwell power supply, 4 batteries (9.9v 4500mah) @ $41 each. and other accessories . Then you got to be careful to not burn the house down. I know everyone puts sla down, but for $30 more you will get that 20mph speed with another lead weight.

Jerry

 

[amberwolf]

What is the best way for me to "Hop" up the speed/Power a little on this bike ?

"Best" or "most reasonable considering cost/etc."?

Best would be replace all the SLA with the LiPo.

If the hubmotor is brushless, it'll take as many volts as you wanna put into it, basically. 48V will get you the ability to do 20-25MPH, if it does half that on 24V (you don't have to use it, but it is good to have it there when a large vehicle happens to be intersecting your path and if faster is a better option than braking at that time). You just need to limit the continous amps so it doesn't exceed the watt rating the motor can handle (which might be notably higher than it's labelled for, or might not be much more).


If it is a brushed hub, then it'll still work at a higher voltage, but it's going to get hotter than it was meant to, and the brushes and commutator will wear faster.


Most likely you'll need to replace the controller in either case, but it depends on the FETs and the capacitors in there, and whatever it uses for pre-regulation on the low voltage supply.

 

[dogman dan]

Yeah, overvolt that thing unless it's a brushed motor. 12s lipo is exactly what I would do. If you have to, replace the controller with a 48v one, or a 36v one that has 50-60v capacitors inside. 36c 20 amps, or 48v 15 amps controllers will get you a lot more power for the hills. The motor can easily handle 800w, and can handle more if the duration is on the short side.

But on the subject of hills, if you have really tough hills to deal with, it might be worthwhile to consider a fairly soon upgrade to a more powerful motor. Sometimes not exactly legal, but it depends on your local state law. The fed 20 mph limit may or may not apply. And there is a way to have lots more power, and still keep the speed down. Unfortunately, the typical budget for a really practical, hill climbing, long range ebike is often $1200 on up. But you'll save that much and more if you stop driving a car so much.

 

[Mrebman]

Here are the Specs on my Electric bike conversion kit.

Specifications:
•26”X 1.75” Font Wheel, with Hub Motor, Including Tire, Wheel, and Motor (mounted)
•PAS: Pedal Assist System for extended range and battery life
•250 W 24 V Brushless, Gearless Motor (250W continuous / 500W Spike)
•The Included Brake Levers Disable the Motor When Applied
•Top Speed 18 MPH
•Distance 20-25 Miles (with full charge based on 170lb rider)
•Average charge Time 4 to 8 hours
•3 Stage Smart Charger
•Battery Meter on Throttle
•Gross Weight 50 LBS
•Pennies A Day To Operate with 0% emissions

Right now I am interested in keeping cost down. Bear in Mind that I am big into Radio Control Aircraft & I fly EVERY weekend so I already have a lot of Lipo Batteries but mostly 2200-3S 11.2 V Lipo packs & i also have a Brushless 40A speed controller hanging on my pegboard right now, can that be used on the electric Bike? I get my Lipo packs from Hobbyking.com so they realy are not that expensive & bear in mind that this bike is for casual ride around the neighborhood trips of probably not more than 30 Minutes so i don't necessarily need a lot of duration & that is what got me thinking of going Lipo & maybe a couple of 5000-4S packs in series? Or maybe a 4S & 3S. I am worried about burning up the speed controller but the place where I bought the bike kit only charges like $39 for a new speed controller so maybe it is worth increasing the voltage a bit & see what kind of speed I can get. Just out of curiosity, what kind of duration would I get from a couple of 5000-4S packs connected in series? how about (3) of my 2200-3S packs connected in series?

 

[Mrebman]

Another idea at least for now until I go Lipo. Right now I am running (2) 12V 12AH SLA batteries. I actually have available to me another 12V 7AH SLA battery. Obviously it is smaller than the 12AH batteries but could I add that in series temporarily to get my power up to 36V & then I can get a feel for the extra speed.

 

[dogman dan]

Oh, man.... That's not a gearmotor, it's direct drive. I wouldn't hesitate for an instant to run that thing on 2000w. It would easily stand a 72v 20 amp controller, or 48v 30 amp controller. Since your bike is pas, you want to pick up a throttle that matches your new controller whenever you do decide to go for it. You don't want pas anymore, when the bike goes faster than the pedals can keep up with.

Re 36v, chances are your controller will take 36v fine. You can open it up and see the rating on the capacitors inside. If 50v or larger, go for it on 36v. Go for 48v if they are 63v caps.

I'm not sure on the controller, I assume it's a controller designed for the RC motors. A bike controller in 20 amp, 48v is pretty cheap, and if you run it on two 6s lipo packs in series, 21s, you should have 25-30 mph no sweat. For testing purposes, just string together some of what you already have to 10-12 s.

 

[Drunkskunk]

The picture of the motor looks like a 500 watt Crystalyte 40X or WE/Aetoma. According to the simulator a Clyte 405 would do that claimed speed on 24v.

Good news and bad news on that. the good news is it should be good for 3000+ watts peak, and voltages over 100. the bad news is that motor is realy ment for a smaller wheel turning at high rpm, so its not going to be as efficant and will get hot fast trying to pull your weight on a 26" wheel.

Assuming I'm right about the manufacturer, That series of motor is amoung the most silent and smoothest of all the Ebike motors. Idealy that should be laced into a 20" wheel, and run on 15S to 20S lipo. It would be a very sweet ride.

36 to 48V should be fine on the 26" wheel, if you keep an eye on the heat. you could melt it on steep hills. that motor in a 26" wheel is about like trying to start a car off in 5th gear.

 

[dogman dan]

I agree, it should work great on 44v, with 12s lipo. If it's the 405 winding, it would be very fast at 12s, but a strong controller might be a good idea. Why not 40 amps if you are running lipo? That would get er going a bit faster than 20 amps.

 

[Mrebman]

Where can I buy a 20 Amp Bike controller? Any online sites?

P.S. - If I strung together in series some of my numerous 2200-3S 11.2 Volt Lipo packs, how much duration would that give me? Enough for a 20-30 minute bike ride?

 

[Mrebman]

How far would I get with (3) 2200-3S (36 Volt) 20C Lipo packs connected in series? That would be 2.2 AH right? Would that setup get me through a 30 minute bike ride on mostly full power ?