Reg bicycle as moped??

[Jay64]

I have heard reference to this, but I never thought I would have need of it, so I didn't really look into it in great detail before. But now I am thinking about a future project and a possible way around some local laws peventing me from using it to it's full potential. I have heard that if you power a bike to be capable of doing 30 mph you can/have to register it as a moped. Is this true? Can you register a vehicle that was originally not build for street use to be run on the street as a moped? The reason I am asking is because one of my small dirt bikes was converted to be street legal, headlight and tail light. But because it is a motorcycle, and was not originally built for the street, they won't allow it to be registered on the street as a motorcycle. However, if I turn it into an electric vehicle, and limit it to 30 mph, could I register it as a moped? I mean if a bicycle can be converted into a moped that originally had none of the required features, then why can't a dirt bike be changed over? That is of course assuming that I heard correctly and a bicycle can in fact be changed into a 'moped.'

 

[kbarrett]

You aren't handling your local bureaucrats properly.

The key here is to not admit that you are "converting" anything.

You have built a custom chopper. Title it as such. If they dig in their heels, talk to someone in state that builds choppers, find out what the local law really is, and force the issue.

 

[Jay64]

Hmm, custom chopper. That's a good point. There isn't really any standard definition of what a chopper is. There's a chopper shop right up the street from my house on the way to work. Maybe I'll stop by sometime. *picturing myself rolling up to a chopper shop on my electric bicycle....bad to the bone, bad to the bone* Maybe I should put some cards in my spokes. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[fitek]

For the guys on this forum who are running at like 45mph, I sometimes wonder why they bother with pedals at all except the legal issues. I would be terrified to ride an upright that fast, especially on city streets.

My latest bike has no pedals at all right now (haven't welded them on yet). And I've already ridden it on the road. I wonder what would happen if I cruise past a cop. It's a bike, but you don't pedal it, so is it a moped?

Green E Motor sells some small scooters in California that aren't technically mopeds (I guess because of the speed achieved by these vehicles?). Yet if you look at it, or get on it, it's pretty much a motorcycle. All the pieces look like my Honda Shadow, but smaller.

It'd be interesting to take a poll of bike power vs population density of forum members I hardly had enough distance to exceed 18mph on my test runs in San Francisco... too many stop signs and other vehicles, so I don't really feel the need to upgrade from 300 watts.

 

[Link]

*picturing myself rolling up to a chopper shop on my electric bicycle....bad to the bone, bad to the bone*

*Duh na nuh na nuh...*

 

[TylerDurden]

 

[dirtdad]

I have looked into this in California a little bit. The confusion begins with Section 406, the definition of Motorized Bicycle; section 405, Motor Driven Cycle; and section 400, Motorcycle:

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc24016.htm
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d01/vc405.htm
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d01/vc400.htm

As I see it, 406(b) covers many motorized bikes with pedal power. 406(a) lets you go up to 30 mph without cranks. Section 405 is not of much use. To go over 30 but less than 45 mph you are a 400(c) motorcycle.

I have mailed in a form Reg 230 to "register" my electric bike as 406(a). I could not see anywhere that told me the price, but Thunderstruck told me it was $17 last they knew, so that is what I sent in. It is a 1 time, lifetime, transferable registration.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/forms/reg/reg230.htm

I am not sure what I will get, maybe a sticker.

I plan to eventually classify my bike as 400(c) motorcycle, so it needs turn signals, rear view mirrors, brake lights, a horn, and head and tail lights. I think. There are also laws about how the headlights have to turn off with the keys and dozens of others. They are peppered through the DMV code, and it is not always clear what class of vehicle they apply to.

To register and title a vehicle with no PIN in California, I will have to go through Registration Requirements for Home-Made, Specially Constructed, or Kit Vehicles:

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/vr/spcnsreg.htm

Yikes.

One problem with this is that is pretty fuzzy. Most peace officers do not know what 406(a&b) and 400(c) are. I called the CHP here and they insist that any bike with a motor of any kind is illegal on the road, not registrable, and they told me that they had impounded many. I hope there was a lot of miscommunication. The CHP has to inspect and approve any kit vehicle in order to register it. I like the idea of calling a local chopper club. Maybe some CHP stations are friendlier or more knowledgeable than others.

There is irony here. Green environmental groups like the Sierra Club have a clear goal of making car ownership more difficult through increased regulation. Yes, most laws are there for safety. But these laws are now making it more difficult to innovate new kinds of transportation: not what environmentalists intended, I am sure. Eventually I think the vehicle code has to change to be made more explicit and permit other kinds of electric vehicles. And peace officers have to be more aware of the laws and the various kinds of vehicles that are permitted under the law. And we will have to start registering these vehicles and paying taxes and fees on them.

 

[vanilla ice]

I I called the CHP here and they insist that any bike with a motor of any kind is illegal on the road, not registrable, and they told me that they had impounded many.

^Yikes.

I've read that you get a little miniature steel licence plate for your seventeen bucks. The plates are probably so rarely seen that if you get pulled, the cop will have never seen one before!

 

[Mark_A_W]

You really do have CHiPs? Kewl ! 8)

 

[jerryt]

In California, an electric bike that complies with section 406(b) of the DMV code does not have to have a license plate per section 24016 of the DMV code. Heres the text from the DMV:

SECTION 406(b)
(b) A "motorized bicycle" is also a device that has fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power and has an electric motor that meets all of the following requirements:
(1) Has a power output of not more than 1,000 watts.
(2) Is incapable of propelling the device at a speed of more than 20 miles per hour on ground level.
(3) Is incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human power is used to propel the motorized bicycle faster than 20 miles per hour.
(4) Every manufacturer of motorized bicycles, as defined in this subdivision, shall provide a disclosure to buyers that advises buyers that their existing insurance policies may not provide coverage for these bicycles and that they should contact their insurance company or insurance agent to determine if coverage is provided.


SECTION 24016. (a) A motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406 shall meet the following criteria
1)
2)
3) A person operating a motorized bicycle is not subject to the provisions of this code relating to financial responsibility, driver's licenses, registration, and license plate requirements, and a motorized bicycle is not a motor vehicle.

 

[kbarrett]

If you have a plate on the e-vehicle, the cops will leave you alone.

Plate = government permission to drive on the road.

The statement that the cop made was true only because most folks don't bother doing things legally. If you have a plate, a VIN number, a state title, and insurance, they can go pound sand.

Find out EXACTLY what is required for a successful VIN inspection, and have copies of the laws applicable.

If they refuse to issue a VIN get a written statement why.


If you have to, keep a photocopy of the laws in question with the vehicle. If some cop tries to seize it, hand him your copies, and tell him this constitutes constructive notice of the law in question, and suggest he call a supervisor.

 

[fechter]

I've heard it's pretty challenging to find anyone at DMV that knows the process for homebuilt vehicle registration. Clearly the CHP guys don't know what the law says.

There are all kinds of requirements for lighting, brakes, safety features, etc. for Mopeds. They differ slightly from the requirements for motorcycles.

That's why I *never* go over 20mph or use over 1000 watts on my Vego :wink:

If you start out with a gas Moped and convert it, the process will be much easier. In fact, you could get it registered without even mentioning anything about electricity.

 

[dirtdad]

I've read that you get a little miniature steel licence plate for your seventeen bucks. The plates are probably so rarely seen that if you get pulled, the cop will have never seen one before!

That is too cool, I cannot wait. I will get some custom lighting for it and post pics. In the meantime, you can see it here, along with the CA law:

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/plates/specialplates.htm

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