Sabvoton 72150 and 60 degree phase angle solution

[darkmunk]

So I've been mis-sold a Sabvoton 72150 as I have a 60 degree motor and the controller is for 120 degree.
I'm gutted because I've pinned all my hopes on this amazing controller and I want to keep it!
I wanted to replace the controller on my Evomotion 3000 moped with this one, I'm tempted to change the hub motor rather than give up on the controller!
Is it possible to rewire motors to change the phase angle? I mean 60 is half of 120, so I feel like it might turn out to be quite easy?
Can anyone recommend a similar, strong, programmable 60 degree controller for 72v 70 amps (ish) ?
If all else fails, I may have to sell this one. So register your interest here
Or maybe I'll make a ridiculously fast eBike with it and keep the moped standard and slow.

 

[amberwolf]

It's just the hall sensor position that determines the "angle".

So you could move the halls in the motor, once you determine the correct new positions for them. (though I would leave the originals in place and simply add a whole new set, with a separate set of wires, so you can use either kind of controller).

But instead, what about just changing the settings in the controller for the correct hall angle? Or does this one not have that ability?

 

[darkmunk]

Oh, really? I thought it was the way the coils were arranged and wired up?
Meanwhile, I've just connected the Sabvoton to a large 36v bicycle hub motor and put 72V through it
Got it all wired up and tested through the bluetooth in about 30 mins. So at least I know it's not me! and the controller works fine.
Motor goes like stink! So much torque and speed. Think maybe I should back it off a little before I put it in an actual bike

 

[amberwolf]

Oh, really? I thought it was the way the coils were arranged and wired up?

Not that I know of. It is possible that the design choice of where to put the halls and how they're installed has to do with that, but I don't know about it.

You can reposition halls (or add a new set) to match what you need it to do. But it isn't necessarily easy...because it isn't necessarly simply 120 mechanical degrees apart--it's 120 *electrical* degrees. YOu may be able to just take the existing ones and flip some of them--but I would put a whoel new set in with separate wires, in case you need to use it the other way again. If you're sure you don't...then use the existing ones.


Here's one thread
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2472
particularly this post
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2472#p49265
that describes a way to fix it, at least for the setup he tested.
There's a device linked in a later post that converts one to the toher but the link was dead for me.



FWIW, I had a motor that had no halls at all, and I just put them in the stator slots in an equilateral triangle around the stator, for 120 degrees physical positioning. It worked ok on the bench, though I never did get the chance to test it on a bike. Someday I still hope to.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=32838

 

[darkmunk]

I bought a super cheap hall sensor swap thingie https://www.aliexpress.com/snapshot...rderId=8016439396636806&productId=32796266176. Not sure exactly what it does with the hall wires, but it converts 60 to 120 somehow.
I hooked up the Sabvoton and it 'passed' on the second attempt after switching the blue and green phase wires.
It was running backwards so I changed that and on the stand it ran really well and I couldn't stop the wheel with my foot.
But when I sit on the bike and try it under load it fails and shows me green LEDs.
I can't get the controller software to save the settings even after switching off and on. Not sure what I'm missing?
What does the Test actually do? Can I just set it up manually or does the controller have to save the results of the test in order to work?

 

[amberwolf]

I don't know how it is supposed to work. You could check the various other Sabvoton hall-problem threads to see what resolution they had to similar issues.

Keep in mind that there is more than one brand of controller called "sabvoton", from more than one manufacturer, as the original brand has been out of business for years. So what applies to one may not apply to another (and software from one may not be compatible with another). It is even possible that you have a read-only version of the software, and it can't write to the controller, either because the software isn't made to do it or isn't "unlocked" with a password or secret menu setting, or that the controller itself is not a user-programmable version, and can only be changed at the factory.

I would expect that it must save results of a "learn" procedure to operate, but if it is just a "test" that it is only there for diagnostic reasons it wont' have a way to save anything because there's nothing to save.

Your link must go to something in your logged-in stuff on that site, becuase it won't allow me to open it.

 

[darkmunk]

AH, sorry about the link. Maybe this will work? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32796266176.html
Oh crikey! I had no idea there were so many permutations and pitfalls. I seem to have fallen into most of them so far

 

[amberwolf]

That link works ok. This pic
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB13V5OPVXXXXb7XFXXq6xXFXXXj/230081827/HTB13V5OPVXXXXb7XFXXq6xXFXXXj.jpg
shows a transistor that is simply inverting the green hall wire's signal. I don't know if that will always work with every motor/controller combo, but it could work with some.

It may make a difference *which* hall signal is being inverted. It might have to be the center one, so if you know which hall wire out of your motor is the one in the middle of the hall placement inside the motor, you could put it on that. Otherwise you can simply try it on each one to see if you get results different from what you get now.

 

[darkmunk]

AH yes. Thanks, I didn't notice that photo.
Anyway, the good news - it works!
I had to swap the blue and green wires coming out of this converter then it tested ok and I could begin the process of understanding the software. I have no idea what has changed, but now it saves the settings
The moped is now happily running with 54 amps instead of 30, with a really smooth pickup and none of the tailing-off of the power curve, so it'll race up to 30 mph and hold it. Hills are no longer the boring trudge to the top
I was going to fit a regen 'throttle' on the left handlebar, but the automatic regen works just fine with a smooth transition from regen to acceleration so I can just feather the throttle.
The tiny moped wheels might be a bit of a handicap to speed, but it gets to 30 so comfortably, it is now not in the way of anyone, so it's safe enough.
I'm really pleased with the Sabvoton 72150. It has put up with my learning curve and the results are very refined and impressive.
Need to change the title of this thread now

 

[amberwolf]

Good news that it works.

If you need faster speed with small wheels, you would up the voltage, or use a "faster winding" version of your motor.

To change the title just edit the first post's title.